Social vs. Service

[SigTauJake]

I am not trying to cause any arguments here, but rather I am just trying to get some opinions.

Here is the situation, we have 16 social fraternities on campus, and 11 social sororities. We, the fraternities, generally mix with each sorority atleast once a semester. Lately, like the last two years, the service sororities have been having mixers with some of the houses on campus, and participating in certain events, usually left up to the social houses. This is angering many of the sororities on my campus, and even some fraternities. Case in point, one service sorority participated in Greek Sing, although they do not participate in Greek Week. I am not sure if the fraternity they were paired with didnt have another partner or what, but if they would have placed in the top three, those points they collected would of been wasted, since they do not participate in Greek Week. Is this right? They do not pay the same fees on campus, such as Panhel, and I am not sure they have to pay the insurance that we do either. I am not sure where I stand, but no disrespect to the service ladies on GC, but aren't they crossing some lines they shouldn't be. It is like they are trying to be a social house, but hide behind the letters of a service organization. No one on campus watches them when they have "pledges" and they have been known to haze and have pledges for 12+ weeks. No only does this seem crazy for a service organization, but any organization at that.

Does this seem strange to anyone else, or is this normal and it is finally just happening at our campus? Let me know.

[Rudey]

Dude that's pretty crappy. If IFC and panhel control the greek system and events on your campus, bring this up with them and, if need be, campus officials. Pledge must be regulated to prevent hazing and certain events should require fees for the groups to participate in. At our school the service frat...coed...isn't exactly social. In fact nobody knows what they do or who they are.

[gamma_girl52]

I'm curious, which service sorority is it? I'm in Gamma Sigma Sigma Service Sorority myself and I know of a chapter that did participate in Greek Sing on that campus and I think they won. Are we talking about the same place?

I can only speak for my chapter, but we aren't allowed to participate in Greek Week at all and we have known that from day one-however we do participate in other greek-related events (Dance Marathon, Greek Explosion) if we're invited to.

As far as having pledges, we aren't CLOSELY monitored (not that we're hazing-we don't haze at all!!) but our advisor asks about us and how we're doing.

I have had that said to me before, that it seems as though Gamma Sig is trying to "have their cake and eat it too" kind of thing-we don't affiliate with any of the Greek councils, we don't pay the same dues, and we get school funding, and the greeks can't get money from the school. However we do have social events and participate as much as we can on campus. However, there are some things that Gamma Sig will NEVER get to have such as a suite on the greek floor on campus (we're way too small for houses-we're located downtown!) and really NEVER be viewed as a "real greek" organization. And while I'm proud that I'm a service greek, it's kind of not the same no matter how much we participate in with greeks-it's still easy to feel like an outsider.

Hope that cleared it up from my perspective!

In Service,
gamma_girl52
Gamma Sigma Sigma National Service Sorority

[shadokat]

SigTau--

We had this same problem with sports teams on our campus. Sororities started mixing with the baseball team and the football team and the rugby team and on and on, and yet they wouldn't mix with all of the fraternities. I think that you should remain loyal to the greek community and mix with all of the frats or sororities in there before you go out mixing with every other organization. Besides, isn't part of the draw of frats and sororities being part of a group that gets to do activities with other greeks, something that GDIs aren't invited to partake in?

Just a thought...

[SH80]

A sorority is a sorority and a fraternity is a fraternity. That's it. Why are us service GLO's are looked down upon by social GLO's?
And, yes we have just as much of a right to be recognized on campus as the social ones.

[dzrose93]

Originally posted by SH80:
A sorority is a sorority and a fraternity is a fraternity. That's it. Why are us service GLO's are looked down upon by social GLO's?
And, yes we have just as much of a right to be recognized on campus as the social ones.

I don't think SigTauJake is trying to say that service Greek organizations shouldn't be recognized. He's just saying that service orgs should be treated the same way and held to the same policies, rules and standards that socials GLO's are if they want to do the same things that social Greeks do. It's not fair for social groups to pay dues for various campus activities and for service groups to be exempt, although they enjoy the same privileges and attend the same types of functions. I think that's what Jake was trying to say. No one was putting down service orgs. Hope this clarifies things a litte.

[shadokat]

I agree as well, in that sororities and fraternities have fees to pay to belong to NPC or NIC. They have rules to abide by with membership in these national organizations. I think service groups are a great thing, and would in no way want to lose their place in campuses. I just think that social greeks hold a different place than the service greeks do. It's not that social GLOs are better or worse, just different is all.

[SilverTurtle]

I'm not in a service GLO, but a professional one. (Which happens to do a ton of community service). Because none of our "social" GLOs on campus are national, we just had "Greek Council". All of our GLO chapters were in it, professional, service or social. We adhered to the same rules and regulations as the social GLOs, and participated in almost all of the greek events (greek week, greek sing, etc.). Not all of the non-social greeks participated in everything, but they did have the same rules. I think this will be an issue at each campus, but also will vary by how your greek system is structured.

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SilverTurtle@greekchat.com

Phi Beta Fraternity

Phi chapter

[33girl]

SigTauJake - I'm glad your IFC voted to stop the mixing thing. We did that at our school too - fraternities mixed w/ the dance team, sororities mixed with sports teams or Pershing Rifles (the ROTC frat who was an entity unto themselves) and it did cause bad feelings.

If service fraternities and/or sororities want to participate in Greek week it should be to (drum roll) perform a SERVICE, like refereeing Olympics or ushering at Greek sing. Like people have pointed out, Greek week and the events aren't free. That's what your IFC and Panhel dues partly pay for. If you didn't pay your dues as a member, you couldn't participate - why should it be different for organizations?

gamma_girl, you said many GSS members are in "social" sororities also. Well to say that GSS should be able to have mixers like the "social" sororities - to me that sounds like double dipping. Obviously you should have social events - I was in APO and we had MANY of them. But we would have never had a mixer-type event. We were proud of our "unique" status as a service fraternity and didn't want to muddy it by doing things that were so strongly associated with "social" Greeks.

Service sororities and fraternities are special - be proud of your specialness!

[SigTauJake]

To clear things up....

I am in no way putting down service organizations, they are a wonderful contribution to our campus, and every campus they are located at.

Gammma_girl, one of the service soroirities doing this is GSS, and they almost did place in Greek Sing this past spring. They did a great job, but they were kinda in it for fun, while the rest of us were trying our hardest to get Greek Week points. So if they would of placed, they would of "wasted" those points, because they were not in Greek Week.

Fraternities were also mixing with the girls rugby team, and the dance team at my school. Sororities were off at the football house, and baseball too. IFC voted to stop this, for legal reasons and it was detracting from the Greek unity on our campus.

I just think that it detracts from the true meaning of what these orgs were founded on, and as gamma_girl says, they want their cake and eat it too. If you want the life of a social greek, you should join a social GLO, i f you can't find one that suits you on your campus, start one. Don't try to make your service GLO a social one, and complain when the social GLO's get mad about it.

[gamma_girl52]

I figured that was one of them. What school do you go to, SigTau?

Anyway, I wouldn't NECESSARILY say that having social events is taking away from our overall purpose. Again, speaking for Gamma Sig only, just because we do socialize and have socials with other groups doesn't make us any more a "social" greek organization. Gamma Sig was founded on Service, yes. As a matter of fact I'm sure that ALL GLO's have a duty to serve others. But what's wrong with joining in on greek activities if we're extended an invite? I could see if we were "crashing" in on something that we're we were not asked to be in, but if we're asked to be there and we can be there, great.

And for the record, many Gamma Sigs are members of "social" GLO's as well.

[kdgirlie]

I have to agree. if service org. are going to do the social aspect of greek life then they should certainly have insurence that is for that reason. I know because I have friends in some of these groups and they do somethings that would undoubtly be deemed as hazing for any social group. If service org are going to particate at any level socially then they should be held to those standards of a social group. that is just my opinion. as far as mixing out side of the Greek system-- I think that it should be fine if the group is also mixing with all of the greeks first. Also the insurance thing comes up again.

[JayBEE!]

Well to say that GSS should be able to have mixers like the "social" sororities - to me that sounds like double dipping.

Your speaking like there is a rule against double dipping. I have plenty of friends in both a service organization and a social service organization. But people here are speaking like the only National Greek Lettered Organizations that can have social events are the National Greek Lettered Organizations that are on councils. Let's be real about what we are saying here. If there is a Greek Council Sponsored event, then give
those that are not on the council simple
rules and charge them a extra fee for participation in the events if thats a problem.

It is like they are trying to be a social house, but hide behind the letters of a service organization.

The thing that strikes me about this statement is that it looks upon service organizations not as fraternities or sororities or even a "Service Greek", but just as an NSO. And this view of being a sub organization to other organizations, is one that all National Greek Lettered Organizations do not want to have. Why? Service Fraternities and Sororties are not just service organizations. And Social fraternities and Sororities are also service-doing organizations. So as far as having cake and eating it too, Why are social organizations doing service? I really don't need an answer to that. Because as long as your doing something positive, it not a problem. We are what we are, and when you think of a fratenity or sorority, you will have social aspects. However if your organizations says that you are So-and-So National Service Organization, an NSO, and not a fraternity or sorority, then I can see you only doing service. It's crazy to think that an entire fraternity or sorority should do nothing but service, and not have any social aspects.

He's just saying that service orgs should be treated the same way and held to the same policies, rules and standards that socials GLO's are if they want to do the same things that social Greeks do.

This is a good statement, but it should be altered. It should be stated this way. National Greek Lettered Service Fraternities and Sororiries should be treated the same way and held to the same policies, rules and standards that socials GLO's are if they want to pariticpate in the same functions that is sponsored by the local Greek Council, when they have been invited to participate in a Greek Council sponsored event. The rules and regulations of the Greek Council are rules and regulations of the Greek Council and they should not interfer with the way another organization runs their organization. The only exception should be unless that organization is in an Greek Council event, and then the rules would apply to that National Greek Lettered Service Fraternity and Sororirity just as it would apply to any other social house during that Greek Council event.

The point of all the is that the service greeks do not fit into the professional organization or curriculum organizations. And their national orgnazation has decided that they do not want to be governed by a Greek Council. So we GLSO's that is are between. I believe that because all organizations do service these days that we are now all NGLSO's. National Greek-Lettered Service Organizations.

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JayBEE!

Ay-Phi-Que!
Alpha Alpha Lambda Chapter
Alcorn State Unversity
Fall, October 18th 1980
President, Brothers of the Rising Sun, Atlanta Alumni Chapter of Alpha Phi Omega
JayBEE's State Of Mind
The AyPhiQueGammaSig Family Homepage

[SH80]

Originally posted by JayBEE!:
Well to say that GSS should be able to have mixers like the "social" sororities - to me that sounds like double dipping.

Your speaking like there is a rule against double dipping. I have plenty of friends in both a service organization and a social service organization. But people here are speaking like the only National Greek Lettered Organizations that can have social events are the National Greek Lettered Organizations that are on councils. Let's be real about what we are saying here. If there is a Greek Council Sponsored event, then give
those that are not on the council simple
rules and charge them a extra fee for participation in the events if thats a problem.

It is like they are trying to be a social house, but hide behind the letters of a service organization.

The thing that strikes me about this statement is that it looks upon service organizations not as fraternities or sororities or even a "Service Greek", but just as an NSO. And this view of being a sub organization to other organizations, is one that all National Greek Lettered Organizations do not want to have. Why? Service Fraternities and Sororties are not just service organizations. And Social fraternities and Sororities are also service-doing organizations. So as far as having cake and eating it too, Why are social organizations doing service? I really don't need an answer to that. Because as long as your doing something positive, it not a problem. We are what we are, and when you think of a fratenity or sorority, you will have social aspects. However if your organizations says that you are So-and-So National Service Organization, an NSO, and not a fraternity or sorority, then I can see you only doing service. It's crazy to think that an entire fraternity or sorority should do nothing but service, and not have any social aspects.

He's just saying that service orgs should be treated the same way and held to the same policies, rules and standards that socials GLO's are if they want to do the same things that social Greeks do.

This is a good statement, but it should be altered. It should be stated this way. National Greek Lettered Service Fraternities and Sororiries should be treated the same way and held to the same policies, rules and standards that socials GLO's are if they want to pariticpate in the same functions that is sponsored by the local Greek Council, when they have been invited to participate in a Greek Council sponsored event. The rules and regulations of the Greek Council are rules and regulations of the Greek Council and they should not interfer with the way another organization runs their organization. The only exception should be unless that organization is in an Greek Council event, and then the rules would apply to that National Greek Lettered Service Fraternity and Sororirity just as it would apply to any other social house during that Greek Council event.

The point of all the is that the service greeks do not fit into the professional organization or curriculum organizations. And their national orgnazation has decided that they do not want to be governed by a Greek Council. So we GLSO's that is are between. I believe that because all organizations do service these days that we are now all NGLSO's. National Greek-Lettered Service Organizations.

Exactly, Jay-bee!

[LexiKD]

I think IFC and NPC groups shouldn't socially mix with Service groups or local groups for many reasons, but the main reason is:
IFC and NPC are the governing bodies of the social groups and have regulations which make us all play from an epual playing ground, so we all know who can do what and how. These rules superseed chapter rules so we all follow similar risk mangement plans, not to mention insurance.
NPC groups shouldn't mix with teams either for the same reason, what if something happend, only the sororoty has insurance.
About the Greek Week issue:It would be a different story if the service groups were indeed part of an all Greek Council and that council sponsered Greek Week, then I think it would be OK for any Greek Organization to praticiate.
This will always be an issue amoung campuses across the country unles we can set up national regualtions beacuse the different organzations ae set up so differently.