1 Killed in Shootings at Virginia Tech

[Goldenphoenix]

The following two articles deal with how some people are apparently elevating the status of the VT shooter with those of his victims. This is the moral equivalent of honoring suicide bombers, only in this case it's a suicide shooter. My heart goes out to the victims of the shooter, but he knew what he was doing, he didn't go to get professional help (medication and counseling), and he coldly and methodically plotted his evil deeds. I'm sorry, but I'm not so relativistic as to put the shooter on anything close to an equal level with his victims.


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1121840


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1126459

[DeltAlum]

Originally Posted by Goldenphoenix

My heart goes out to the victims of the shooter, but he knew what he was doing, he didn't go to get professional help (medication and counseling), and he coldly and methodically plotted his evil deeds.

I agree that he should not be considered at the same status as the victims, but I'm not sure it's fair to say that he knew what he was doing if he was, in fact, mentally ill.

But that argument should be answered by mental health professionals, I suppose.

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by Goldenphoenix

The following two articles deal with how some people are apparently elevating the status of the VT shooter with those of his victims. This is the moral equivalent of honoring suicide bombers, only in this case it's a suicide shooter. My heart goes out to the victims of the shooter, but he knew what he was doing, he didn't go to get professional help (medication and counseling), and he coldly and methodically plotted his evil deeds. I'm sorry, but I'm not so relativistic as to put the shooter on anything close to an equal level with his victims.


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1121840


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1126459

It's not for us to decide. It's up to the victims, their families, and the campus. They are the ones going through the pain.

[DeltAlum]

Originally Posted by PM_Mama00

It's not for us to decide. It's up to the victims, their families, and the campus. They are the ones going through the pain.

That is true.

The following link (from www.delts.org) is to a story in which a Virginia Tech Delt who was in the Science Building during the shooting described the experience to the British Broadcasting Company (BBC).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/talking_point/6561733.stm

Thankfully, all of the people in his classroom escaped injury.

The following is the official statement to the Fraternity from our Virginia Tech Chapter:

"Virginia Tech Delts safe
“We would like to express our sincere thanks for all the e-mails and phone calls from other chapters, alumni, and Delts across the world,” Chapter President Chandler Douglas said. “Calls began immediately after the news broke. We are especially grateful to the American University chapter who has offered assistance with whatever we need.”

The Fraternity’s thoughts and prayers go out to the Virginia Tech community.

Jon, the story on the SAE webpage sounds very much like the one on the Delt site. I wonder if your brother and mine might have been in the same room...

[jon1856]

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

That is true.

The following link (from www.delts.org) is to a story in which a Virginia Tech Delt who was in the Science Building during the shooting described the experience to the British Broadcasting Company (BBC).

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/talking_point/6561733.stm

Thankfully, all of the people in his classroom escaped injury.

The following is the official statement to the Fraternity from our Virginia Tech Chapter:

"Virginia Tech Delts safe
“We would like to express our sincere thanks for all the e-mails and phone calls from other chapters, alumni, and Delts across the world,” Chapter President Chandler Douglas said. “Calls began immediately after the news broke. We are especially grateful to the American University chapter who has offered assistance with whatever we need.”

The Fraternity’s thoughts and prayers go out to the Virginia Tech community.

Jon, the story on the SAE webpage sounds very much like the one on the Delt site. I wonder if your brother and mine might have been in the same room...

I would agree with you; same room.

[texas*princess]

Originally Posted by Goldenphoenix

The following two articles deal with how some people are apparently elevating the status of the VT shooter with those of his victims. This is the moral equivalent of honoring suicide bombers, only in this case it's a suicide shooter. My heart goes out to the victims of the shooter, but he knew what he was doing, he didn't go to get professional help (medication and counseling), and he coldly and methodically plotted his evil deeds. I'm sorry, but I'm not so relativistic as to put the shooter on anything close to an equal level with his victims.


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1121840


http://wtopnews.com/?nid=644&sid=1126459

I noticed when all of this first started happening "32" was the number being reported on the news. It wasn't really put in the context of "32 were gunned down", for example, but more like "32 died in a tragic.." or "32 lives ended..."

So it's like the media on some of the news reports I saw, didn't count the gunman in the total.

I wonder if this was why?

[DeltAlum]

I think that technically, depending on the context, if the words were "thirty-two were gunned down," that would be essentially correct since we don't generally consider suicide as someone "gunning" him/herself "down."

If the context was total deaths, the number thirty-two would be in error.

As we heard so many times here after Columbine, "(Paraphrasing) Fourteen were killed before the two gunmen took their own lives."

By the way, there was the same kind of controversy here when someone put up crosses on the hill in Clement Park next to the high school and included crosses for the shooters. As I recall (and it's a little fuzzy now) the additional two crosses were taken down -- or maybe all of them were.

[AChiOhSnap]

Originally Posted by Goldenphoenix

The following two articles deal with how some people are apparently elevating the status of the VT shooter with those of his victims. This is the moral equivalent of honoring suicide bombers, only in this case it's a suicide shooter. My heart goes out to the victims of the shooter, but he knew what he was doing, he didn't go to get professional help (medication and counseling), and he coldly and methodically plotted his evil deeds. I'm sorry, but I'm not so relativistic as to put the shooter on anything close to an equal level with his victims.

I'm inclined to agree with the students putting up the memorials for Cho. I think it's important to support the VT community in doing whatever helps them heal. For many, many people forgiveness is an integral part of the healing process after a tragedy like this. Whatever helps the students and victims heal is fine by me.

Originally Posted by DeltAlum

By the way, there was the same kind of controversy here when someone put up crosses on the hill in Clement Park next to the high school and included crosses for the shooters. As I recall (and it's a little fuzzy now) the additional two crosses were taken down -- or maybe all of them were.

I remember the controversy too, but I'm actually inclined to say that they left the gunmen's crosses up in the end. IIRC, the backlash was mainly from media-type people who weren't even students at Columbine or residents in Littlewood, and eventually it died down. It was interesting in the way the community immediately put up the crosses for Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in the wake of the tragedy, that the residents and students immediately began trying to forgive. I do recall that someone wrote "Forgive them Father, for they know not what they do" on the crosses, but that was the only reference to their actions in the memorial.

I don't know, I hope this controversy over Cho's memorial goes away soon. I think it's a testament to the strength of the VT community that, at the end of the day, they're willing to acknowledge that Cho's life had some value no matter how atrocious his actions. A memorial isn't just for the dead. I guess at the end of the day, Cho was someone's son too and it's awfully sweet of the VT students to acknowledge that there's a family out there grieving over the loss of Cho's life.

[DeltAlum]

Originally Posted by AChiOhSnap

I remember the controversy too, but I'm actually inclined to say that they left the gunmen's crosses up in the end. IIRC, the backlash was mainly from media-type people who weren't even students at Columbine or residents in Littlewood, and eventually it died down. It was interesting in the way the community immediately put up the crosses for Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold in the wake of the tragedy, that the residents and students immediately began trying to forgive.

I recall it differently.

Actually, it's Littleton, and the crosses were built and put up by an out-of-state man (from Pennsylvania, I think). Community reaction was immediate and heavily divided. The "media" had little to do with the controversy with the exception of reporting it. However, we're always a good scapegoat.

I won't pass judgement on either case, not being a Biblical scholar, but my understanding of the Divine being -- no matter what you may call him/her is of an all-loving, forgiving entity.

Whether others agree or disagree with that, and how they interpret what their response should be is up to them, I think.

[Goldenphoenix]

According to what I read, the individual who put up Cho's memorial did it a 4 am, so nobody would see her. I don't know what the members of the VT campus feel about him, but I'm sure that they all grieve for his innocent victims. Perhas a memorial should be put up on campus whenever a student loses his or her life for whatever reason. It's up to them. I'm personally not at a point yet where I can say that my feelings for the shooter and those he shot are equivalent. That's ultimately up to the Hokies.

[alum]

When the Pentagon attack is mentioned, the number of dead that is always re-reported does NOT include the hijackers.

[AlexMack]

Don't know about the rest of you but that picture of Caitlin's friend (sister?) is killing me. As I'm writing this right now I'm listening to a song that claims 'life is beautiful but complicated.' Understatement to say the least.
I just can't help but think back to the Lancaster PA school shooting and how the amish reacted. People amaze me everyday-everyday, and this is no exception.

[alum]

A sophomore Hokie who was a graduate from our local hs was killed. She was a wonderful young woman, passionate about history, dedicated to her friends, teammates, and to those less fortunate.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...042502762.html

I would much rather read about the victims' short lives rather than rationales and excuses regarding the killer.

[Tom Earp]

Originally Posted by alum

A sophomore Hokie who was a graduate from our local hs was killed. She was a wonderful young woman, passionate about history, dedicated to her friends, teammates, and to those less fortunate.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...042502762.html

I would much rather read about the victims' short lives rather than rationales and excuses regarding the killer.

There is no excuss for this Person who took so many lives no matter where it is.

Now being PC, they were harmed by parents or their peers!

Hell, we all grew up with that unless you were The Beautiful People!

But actually how many are the beautiful People?

[PM_Mama00]

Originally Posted by Goldenphoenix

According to what I read, the individual who put up Cho's memorial did it a 4 am, so nobody would see her. I don't know what the members of the VT campus feel about him, but I'm sure that they all grieve for his innocent victims. Perhas a memorial should be put up on campus whenever a student loses his or her life for whatever reason. It's up to them. I'm personally not at a point yet where I can say that my feelings for the shooter and those he shot are equivalent. That's ultimately up to the Hokies.

The individual also wrote a letter to their newspaper admitting she was the one who did it.

It doesn't matter if you're at a point yet where you can blah blah, because you're right. It's ultimately up to the Hokies and their loved ones.