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  #16  
Old 10-09-2019, 06:03 PM
LaneSig LaneSig is offline
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My 2 cents. I don't think the comment was necessarily meant to be racist. In my opinion, the member saw a picture of her sisters dressed in white, and tried to make a stupid joke that failed.

She saw a picture of sisters all dressed in white and said "Join the KKK" and immediately followed it with "Oops, KKG." It wasn't an accident, but she didn't say, "I love the KKK and I hate all minorities!" She did not attack any groups. She did not use any disparaging remarks about other ethnicities. Again, to me, it looks like she tried to make a stupid joke and it failed. Now, she's getting pulled through the ringer, the Kappa chapter is getting spotlighted, and it's not like she burned a cross on the front lawn.
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  #17  
Old 10-09-2019, 06:12 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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People are entitled to their feelings about these things. I'm not sure those feelings should translate into schools and organizations being so defensive that they overcorrect.
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  #18  
Old 10-09-2019, 07:14 PM
anongreek anongreek is offline
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Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Couple of things. First, our intake processes are often too superficial to really prevent us from recruiting a dumbass 19 year old who happens to be a racist and we don't often find out about that until that individual is a full fledged member. And then, once the behavior is known, with regard to the leaders of the organization between 20-22 years old, let's be honest, not a lot of them are going to want to take days out of their week utilizing standards to properly adjudicate unacceptable viewpoints.

And we recruit a fresh batch of 18-19 year old kids every single year and every single year, we open ourselves up to the same behavior, and every single year that behavior continues to happen. Why are we tired or surprised? Our organizations don't have much capacity to learn unless they are properly advised by adult volunteers, but the advice we give very often falls on deaf ears.

It's a problem with no real solution that I can think of.
Yes, I agree Kevin, there is no real solution to completely end it... that's what I was telling someone else above, I wish there was a way to end it altogether, but at the same time, this is a trait that is learned, and like you mentioned, doesn't often come out through the common conversation during recruitment. It's just frustrating the entire organization has to suffer by the comments of a member who, let's be honest, whether they are 18 or not, should truly know better by this point. Even if it was meant to be a joke, it was done completely in poor taste.
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Last edited by anongreek; 10-09-2019 at 07:20 PM.
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  #19  
Old 10-09-2019, 08:51 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Originally Posted by LaneSig View Post
My 2 cents. I don't think the comment was necessarily meant to be racist. In my opinion, the member saw a picture of her sisters dressed in white, and tried to make a stupid joke that failed.

She saw a picture of sisters all dressed in white and said "Join the KKK" and immediately followed it with "Oops, KKG." It wasn't an accident, but she didn't say, "I love the KKK and I hate all minorities!" She did not attack any groups. She did not use any disparaging remarks about other ethnicities. Again, to me, it looks like she tried to make a stupid joke and it failed. Now, she's getting pulled through the ringer, the Kappa chapter is getting spotlighted, and it's not like she burned a cross on the front lawn.
That’s kind of what I thought too. Just because you mention the KKK doesn’t make you a racist. But the fact that her brain would automatically “go there” just because a group of any kind is dressed in all white is a little off.
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  #20  
Old 10-09-2019, 09:03 PM
Sororitysock Sororitysock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LaneSig View Post
My 2 cents. I don't think the comment was necessarily meant to be racist. In my opinion, the member saw a picture of her sisters dressed in white, and tried to make a stupid joke that failed.

She saw a picture of sisters all dressed in white and said "Join the KKK" and immediately followed it with "Oops, KKG." It wasn't an accident, but she didn't say, "I love the KKK and I hate all minorities!" She did not attack any groups. She did not use any disparaging remarks about other ethnicities. Again, to me, it looks like she tried to make a stupid joke and it failed. Now, she's getting pulled through the ringer, the Kappa chapter is getting spotlighted, and it's not like she burned a cross on the front lawn.
Oh yes, it's hilarious and not racist at all to make a joke comparing your organization with one that has oppressed and murdered people of the "wrong" color, background or religion for over 150 years. Wearing white does not compare to membership in the KU Klux Klan, even in a joking manner, in a normal non-racist's brain. This is exactly the kind of aggression that makes us appear unwelcoming and non-inclusive.

At least Kappa did address it right away, so they have one up on Alpha Phi.
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  #21  
Old 10-09-2019, 10:01 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Originally Posted by Sororitysock View Post
Oh yes, it's hilarious and not racist at all to make a joke comparing your organization with one that has oppressed and murdered people of the "wrong" color, background or religion for over 150 years. Wearing white does not compare to membership in the KU Klux Klan, even in a joking manner, in a normal non-racist's brain. This is exactly the kind of aggression that makes us appear unwelcoming and non-inclusive.

At least Kappa did address it right away, so they have one up on Alpha Phi.
Let's not confuse aggression with microaggression. I very much doubt the [former?] sorority member woke up that day with the intent of publishing something on her Instagram which would prompt an apology from her national office.

I do not understand this need to completely destroy a kid for making a dumb joke--even if the joke hurts some folks' feelings.

These kids are 18-19 years old. Their brains aren't fully developed yet. I would hope that the community practice would be to educate these kids rather than wishing death, pain, and misery upon them. In your lane, maybe you knew that joking about looking like Klansmen was not okay. You don't know where she comes from, and at that young an age, she's not fully responsible for what she thinks and says yet.

I'm not saying an 18/19 YO lacks agency, but I am saying they are very new to exercising it and we ought to give them a mulligan or two.
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  #22  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:01 AM
Sororitysock Sororitysock is offline
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Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Let's not confuse aggression with microaggression. I very much doubt the [former?] sorority member woke up that day with the intent of publishing something on her Instagram which would prompt an apology from her national office.

I do not understand this need to completely destroy a kid for making a dumb joke--even if the joke hurts some folks' feelings.

These kids are 18-19 years old. Their brains aren't fully developed yet. I would hope that the community practice would be to educate these kids rather than wishing death, pain, and misery upon them. In your lane, maybe you knew that joking about looking like Klansmen was not okay. You don't know where she comes from, and at that young an age, she's not fully responsible for what she thinks and says yet.

I'm not saying an 18/19 YO lacks agency, but I am saying they are very new to exercising it and we ought to give them a mulligan or two.
No, Kevin, aggression. You as a white male don't get to define the way the oppressed feel about an action. You have no idea what it's like to be on the receiving end of this kind of behavior.

It's up to us to provide organizations where our members feel safe, protected and respected. We don't exist to change the racist inclinations young adults bring with them to college. Those have been years in the making - and whether subtle or overt - there is no room for that behavior in our organizations.

Where do you draw the line? SAEs singing "there will never be a n* SAE"? Banana eating Snap Chats comparing races with monkeys? Hanging a noose around the neck of a statue of a notable African American? Drunken Finstas declaring how you don't care about the plights of certain groups of people? Naming your team a racial pejorative? They're all kids. Their brains aren't fully formed. Let's give them a pass while telling them how naughty they are. That will make the rest of our members feel safe.

But boys will be boys, right?
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  #23  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:06 AM
anongreek anongreek is offline
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Originally Posted by Sororitysock View Post
No, Kevin, aggression. You as a white male don't get to define the way the oppressed feel about an action. You have no idea what it's like to be on the receiving end of this kind of behavior.

It's up to us to provide organizations where our members feel safe, protected and respected. We don't exist to change the racist inclinations young adults bring with them to college. Those have been years in the making - and whether subtle or overt - there is no room for that behavior in our organizations.

Where do you draw the line? SAEs singing "there will never be a n* SAE"? Banana eating Snap Chats comparing races with monkeys? Hanging a noose around the neck of a statue of a notable African American? Drunken Finstas declaring how you don't care about the plights of certain groups of people? Naming your team a racial pejorative? They're all kids. Their brains aren't fully formed. Let's give them a pass while telling them how naughty they are. That will make the rest of our members feel safe.

But boys will be boys, right?
We can all skip church on Sunday because SororitySock just delivered a full on sermon! Amen, HALLELUJAH. YES! PREACH.
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  #24  
Old 10-11-2019, 09:55 AM
zTaalum zTaalum is offline
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Originally Posted by Sororitysock View Post
No, Kevin, aggression. You as a white male don't get to define the way the oppressed feel about an action. You have no idea what it's like to be on the receiving end of this kind of behavior.

It's up to us to provide organizations where our members feel safe, protected and respected. We don't exist to change the racist inclinations young adults bring with them to college. Those have been years in the making - and whether subtle or overt - there is no room for that behavior in our organizations.

Where do you draw the line? SAEs singing "there will never be a n* SAE"? Banana eating Snap Chats comparing races with monkeys? Hanging a noose around the neck of a statue of a notable African American? Drunken Finstas declaring how you don't care about the plights of certain groups of people? Naming your team a racial pejorative? They're all kids. Their brains aren't fully formed. Let's give them a pass while telling them how naughty they are. That will make the rest of our members feel safe.

But boys will be boys, right?
Kevin you should have known that being a white male means you are not allowed to have an opinion on anything ever unless you want to be crucified
for simply being a white male.


The KKG's comment was a really bad joke and in this climate she should have known better. I don't feel she was being blatantly racist but blatantly stupid.

While we are calling out all things KKK let's not forget that there was a card carrying member who was an elected senator for many years and when he died was eulogized by several prominent politicians (one who was a former POTUS and one who ran for POTUS from his party). I will give you a heads up he and they weren't registered republicans. I hope some of you were
as equally outraged by that as well as this comment.



Hopefully this woman learns her lesson and that KKG nationally or this particular chapter are not harmed in terms of numbers from this really dumb mistake.


By the way I am glad some of you were so mature and so woke in your early college years that you never made dumb decisions that you would regret!

Last edited by zTaalum; 10-11-2019 at 10:09 AM.
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  #25  
Old 10-11-2019, 09:59 AM
LaneSig LaneSig is offline
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Originally Posted by Sororitysock View Post
Oh yes, it's hilarious and not racist at all to make a joke comparing your organization with one that has oppressed and murdered people of the "wrong" color, background or religion for over 150 years. Wearing white does not compare to membership in the KU Klux Klan, even in a joking manner, in a normal non-racist's brain. This is exactly the kind of aggression that makes us appear unwelcoming and non-inclusive.

At least Kappa did address it right away, so they have one up on Alpha Phi.
DP is that you?
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  #26  
Old 10-11-2019, 01:39 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Originally Posted by Sororitysock View Post
No, Kevin, aggression. You as a white male don't get to define the way the oppressed feel about an action. You have no idea what it's like to be on the receiving end of this kind of behavior.
Ah. So white males don't get to have opinions? Or we are not allowed to make a distinction between aggression and microaggression when the distinction is a dictionary issue? And there you have my actual name, my real badge number, while you tut tut folks hiding behind a name like sororitysock.

Quote:
It's up to us to provide organizations where our members feel safe, protected and respected. We don't exist to change the racist inclinations young adults bring with them to college. Those have been years in the making - and whether subtle or overt - there is no room for that behavior in our organizations.
It's not for you to tell any organization what it is supposed to do. I'm not really comfortable with you saying "we" when there's no verification you're even a member of a sorority. You're just an anonymous virtue signaler as far as I can tell.

Quote:
Where do you draw the line? SAEs singing "there will never be a n* SAE"? Banana eating Snap Chats comparing races with monkeys? Hanging a noose around the neck of a statue of a notable African American? Drunken Finstas declaring how you don't care about the plights of certain groups of people? Naming your team a racial pejorative? They're all kids. Their brains aren't fully formed. Let's give them a pass while telling them how naughty they are. That will make the rest of our members feel safe.

But boys will be boys, right?
Actually yeah, the noose aside, I'd probably give every single one of those kids a pass. It's biology. Their brains are not fully formed. Kids in college do stupid stuff and no matter how much virtue signaling you do behind an anonymous name, that's always going to be the case. Maybe you were perfect in your undergrad career and never did or said a single questionable thing by today's standards, that's likely not the case for many. And many who are guilty of things in their past have learned and moved on.

If you feel "unsafe" because some 18 year old doesn't care about the plight of certain group or named their team a racial pejorative, that's more on you than the kids. There is nothing in that team name or opinion about certain groups that threatens anyone's safety.

Maybe those kids make convenient targets for reprisal for the actual acts of real racists who are beyond your reach or members of the law enforcement community which actually do threaten minorities' safety. But that's what it is. These kids are convenient targets. They're just dumbass kids who should be afforded the opportunity to learn from their mistakes.
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  #27  
Old 10-11-2019, 04:19 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Kevin you should have known that being a white male means you are not allowed to have an opinion on anything ever unless you want to be crucified for simply being a white male.
And eff that. I don't believe I'm stating opinions either. It's a fact that the brain is still developing and that most of our new members don't have fully developed prefrontal cortexes--the part of the brain which is responsible for inhibition.

Quote:
The KKG's comment was a really bad joke and in this climate she should have known better. I don't feel she was being blatantly racist but blatantly stupid.
Right. She made a comment which was funny to her and failed to consider the impact on others. She likely has very little, if any, actual knowledge about what that particular group has been responsible for over the years.

Quote:
While we are calling out all things KKK let's not forget that there was a card carrying member who was an elected senator for many years and when he died was eulogized by several prominent politicians (one who was a former POTUS and one who ran for POTUS from his party). I will give you a heads up he and they weren't registered republicans. I hope some of you were as equally outraged by that as well as this comment.
You're talking about Robert Byrd--and so there's an individual who demonstrates the ability to grow and learn from your mistakes.
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  #28  
Old 10-11-2019, 04:50 PM
Rod D Rod D is offline
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And eff that. I don't believe I'm stating opinions either. It's a fact that the brain is still developing and that most of our new members don't have fully developed prefrontal cortexes--the part of the brain which is responsible for inhibition.
That's why these things still continue to happen. Everyone who doesn't live under a rock "knows better." But with young adults, you can tell them "don't do that" and they'll say "hold my beer" and do it.
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  #29  
Old 10-11-2019, 05:12 PM
TriDeltaSallie TriDeltaSallie is offline
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And we wonder why high school and college kids are so stressed out, depressed, hurting themselves, abusing drugs, etc. today? They make one stupid mistake and everyone is ready to ruin their lives and the lives of everyone they associate with.

I do not understand why when one person makes a stupid comment or does something stupid the current standard is now to condemn or eliminate the entire chapter or organization. Somehow I missed the memo that went out where we went from thinking college was a time for young adults to grow up and learn how to be mature adults to expecting perfection in everything they say or do from the minute their feet hit the campus.

I'm thankful my sisters and advisors operated in a kinder world where we were allowed to try, fail, and learn. We admonished plenty of sisters to grow up in different ways, sometimes in serious ways, but we never thought that the answer was to destroy them. That's not love. That's abuse.

It's a sick world the virtue signaling left wants us to live in.
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  #30  
Old 10-11-2019, 05:49 PM
carnation carnation is offline
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I do not understand why when one person makes a stupid comment or does something stupid the current standard is now to condemn or eliminate the entire chapter or organization.
This! I do NOT get it. I've been a member of several organizations through the years and many of them had stupid/clueless/horrible people with whom most of the members did not even deal with. The sh#! would have flown if we had been blamed for their actions. Why is it okay (PC?) to condemn the whole group now?
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