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  #91  
Old 11-24-2014, 09:52 PM
cinder1965 cinder1965 is offline
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Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby View Post
And they don't fire the teacher? Yes, yes they do. Institutions other than the legal system have their own rule sets and enforce consequences all of the time.

It depends. In a lot of cases they may not fire a teacher right away, they put them on administrative leave, etc. The school still has to report it to law enforcement and cooperate to make sure justice is done. So what is your point?
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  #92  
Old 11-24-2014, 11:36 PM
DeltaBetaBaby DeltaBetaBaby is offline
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Originally Posted by cinder1965 View Post
It depends. In a lot of cases they may not fire a teacher right away, they put them on administrative leave, etc. The school still has to report it to law enforcement and cooperate to make sure justice is done. So what is your point?
My point is that your example is a bad one. If a teacher is accused of molesting a student, the school doesn't just sit around doing nothing until there's a jury trial. Universities need to be empowered to take action to protect their students, just as elementary schools would.

And if you really think that law enforcement is a means by which rape victims get "justice," you should read up on what actually happens when a woman reports a rape to the cops.

Last edited by DeltaBetaBaby; 11-24-2014 at 11:43 PM.
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  #93  
Old 11-25-2014, 01:22 AM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby View Post
My point is that your example is a bad one. If a teacher is accused of molesting a student, the school doesn't just sit around doing nothing until there's a jury trial. Universities need to be empowered to take action to protect their students, just as elementary schools would.
Universities already are empowered and because of Tile IX, they are more empowered than primary and secondary schools. With Title IX investigations, they have a lower burden of proof to actually do something and relaxed rules of evidence. So much so that I think there are some Constitutional issues still.

When it is he said vs. she said, rape allegations are often not prosecuted. Schools under Tile IX still have lots of options.
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  #94  
Old 11-25-2014, 11:02 AM
DeltaBetaBaby DeltaBetaBaby is offline
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Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Universities already are empowered and because of Tile IX, they are more empowered than primary and secondary schools. With Title IX investigations, they have a lower burden of proof to actually do something and relaxed rules of evidence. So much so that I think there are some Constitutional issues still.

When it is he said vs. she said, rape allegations are often not prosecuted. Schools under Tile IX still have lots of options.
I know. I was responding to a poster who said that universities should just kick it over to the criminal justice system. That's a bad idea; hence Title IX.
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  #95  
Old 11-25-2014, 02:28 PM
Tom Earp Tom Earp is offline
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What upsets me the most, is that ALL GLOs were suspended from any activities!

These acts were not done by all GLOs, just some members alone.
They should be prosecuted not the whole Greek System! We as GLOs do so many good things for others!

Now allow me to lay a lot of blame-The Schools who sweep this under the rug and not following through! Get the bad guys, not the group!
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  #96  
Old 11-25-2014, 03:34 PM
MysticCat MysticCat is offline
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Originally Posted by Tom Earp View Post
What upsets me the most, is that ALL GLOs were suspended from any activities!
Frankly, Tom, there's a major problem is that's what upsets anyone the most about this situation.

Quote:
These acts were not done by all GLOs, just some members alone.
They should be prosecuted not the whole Greek System! We as GLOs do so many good things for others!

Now allow me to lay a lot of blame-The Schools who sweep this under the rug and not following through! Get the bad guys, not the group!
Except here we seem to have a Greek system that condoned, if not encouraged, the problem behavior. No, perhaps not every fraternity actually committed crimes, nor perhaps did every member of the "problem" fraternities. But at UVA, there seems to have been a campus culture in general and a Greek culture in particular that allowed these assaults and rapes to continue without challenge. Whatever good they may otherwise do, the Greek system allowed a culture of sexual violence to continue for decades.

I'm not one to promote punishing all for the offenses of some. But from what I've seen, the Greek system at UVA has problems that have to be addressed by dealing with individuals, with specific fraternities and with the system as a whole. I think this may be a time that holding the Greek system accountable is called for.

And to be clear, that is not to suggest that there aren't others, such as the administration, that also need to be held accountable.
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  #97  
Old 11-25-2014, 08:20 PM
cinder1965 cinder1965 is offline
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Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby View Post
My point is that your example is a bad one. If a teacher is accused of molesting a student, the school doesn't just sit around doing nothing until there's a jury trial. Universities need to be empowered to take action to protect their students, just as elementary schools would.

And if you really think that law enforcement is a means by which rape victims get "justice," you should read up on what actually happens when a woman reports a rape to the cops.

MY point is that the university's options through Title IX have not been utilized by the administration to date. Please spare me your sarcasm and rudeness about how I should read up on what happens when a woman reports rape. I know what the hell happens thank you very much.

Any and all options should be utilized. Can't believe how this university and Greek are continually defended, so done with this thread. Peace out.
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  #98  
Old 11-25-2014, 09:59 PM
Nanners52674 Nanners52674 is offline
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Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby View Post

And if you really think that law enforcement is a means by which rape victims get "justice," you should read up on what actually happens when a woman reports a rape to the cops.
I really respect you as a member but I'm incredibly bothered with your message. No one knows if someone has been raped and in a discussion about rape, to suggest to a woman that she has no idea what happens when a rape is reported is so far over the line. You have no idea who you're really saying this to. But if gosh forbid they happened to be a rape survivor you come off sounding like a hard assed bitch.
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  #99  
Old 11-25-2014, 11:01 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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I know I'm about a hundred posts too late, but I still don't understand what Title IX has to do with rape and sexual assault.
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  #100  
Old 11-25-2014, 11:38 PM
ASTalumna06 ASTalumna06 is offline
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Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
I know I'm about a hundred posts too late, but I still don't understand what Title IX has to do with rape and sexual assault.
Oh good.. I'm not the only one! Someone care to explain?
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  #101  
Old 11-26-2014, 12:41 AM
Low D Flat Low D Flat is offline
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Basically, the law requires coed schools to maintain environments where women have equal access to education. If women are being run off campus, harassed, in fear, etc. due to the prevalence of rape and other kinds of abuse at the hands of their classmates, then they don't have equal access to education at that school. It's no different, from a legal perspective, from a school that requires all the women to take Home Ec and doesn't allow them to major in physics.

This is not just in education law; this is the theory that applies in workplaces, too. If you're being sexually harassed at work, then as far as the institution's responsibility is concerned, it doesn't matter whether it's your co-worker or the CEO that's harassing you. If the bosses know that the environment is toxic and discriminatory, and they don't act to fix it, they're in violation of the law.
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  #102  
Old 11-26-2014, 12:45 AM
pinksequins pinksequins is offline
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I'm confused, Nanners. I read DBB's comment as meaning that the victim not only has to relive the trauma through testimony but also skepticism by authorities as to the validity of the claim. In sum, it can be another horrific experience. Did I miss something?
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  #103  
Old 11-26-2014, 01:43 AM
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WhiteRose1912 WhiteRose1912 is offline
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Originally Posted by pinksequins View Post
I'm confused, Nanners. I read DBB's comment as meaning that the victim not only has to relive the trauma through testimony but also skepticism by authorities as to the validity of the claim. In sum, it can be another horrific experience. Did I miss something?
DBB was telling another woman (cinder) that since she had a different opinion on how rape should be handled, she clearly has no idea what it's like to be a rape victim trying to come forward to police, and dismissed cinder's opinion and experiences based on that assumption. That's the issue. I'm surprised to see this coming from DBB.
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  #104  
Old 11-26-2014, 02:13 AM
DeltaBetaBaby DeltaBetaBaby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nanners52674 View Post
I really respect you as a member but I'm incredibly bothered with your message. No one knows if someone has been raped and in a discussion about rape, to suggest to a woman that she has no idea what happens when a rape is reported is so far over the line. You have no idea who you're really saying this to. But if gosh forbid they happened to be a rape survivor you come off sounding like a hard assed bitch.
You're right; I made the unconscious assumption that someone (no matter their gender) advocating that all rapes be reported to the legal system is not someone who has reported a rape to the legal system. Based on my experience with rape survivors, I don't know a single one who would take that stance, but that doesn't mean there aren't some who would. Mea culpa.

Last edited by DeltaBetaBaby; 11-26-2014 at 02:18 AM.
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  #105  
Old 11-26-2014, 02:28 AM
DrPhil DrPhil is offline
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Some rape survivors (and organizations that address sexual assault and rape) advocate and advise reporting to police and the legal system. Doing so is usually an overall bad experience but it is typically considered necessary. Even if it is often ineffective for some individuals it can be effective in bringing attention to the issue and giving a larger voice.

Examples: https://rainn.org/get-information/le...reporting-rape

There are far more accounts of why people do not report rapes to the police but it isn't the case that all rape victims would advise other rape victims to not report rape to the police.

Last edited by DrPhil; 11-26-2014 at 02:37 AM. Reason: Some, not many
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