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  #106  
Old 07-12-2003, 11:38 AM
meridionaleDG meridionaleDG is offline
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This post makes me sad.

"You'll end up where you are meant to be."

If you don't believe that then you don't believe in fate - which I guess maybe to some people that is no big deal. I give this comment as advice because it is something I had to tell myself when I got a bid for DG. I was extremley disappointed and wanted to cry. I wondered why so and so cut me, and why I wasn't good enough. I just kept replaying this phrase in my head, and after starting school and going out with DG a few nights and seeing the other sororities, it made me realize I really DID end up where I belonged.

Even if a person does not get a bid, that doesn't eman this statement doesn't hold true. The whole point of this statement is to keep an open mind and to not get your hopes up. Maybe the person who doesn't get a bid will make a lot of friends in another sorority and COB them in the Spring - which might have been the plan for her all along.

If you go into recruitment thinking that fate doesn't play a huge roll in it, well then I guess good luck to you. No path is for sure, and recruitment is certainly one of those that isn't an exact map for most girls.

I can only speak from my own expierences, and if a rushee posts about how nervous she is because she doesn't think she well get into ABC sorority, then I will continue to tell her "you'll go where you belong." It happened to me, it happened to many others (inculding people who didn't get bids at formal recruitment). The statement isn't saying "You will definitly get in a sorority," the statement is saying (to me) "Keep an open mind because something you think might not be good for at the time will end up working out to your betterment in the future."

In a bigger picture, life really is in fact that, "You'll end up where you were meant to be." Maybe not at first - but you never know what the future holds.
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  #107  
Old 07-12-2003, 02:49 PM
aopinthesky aopinthesky is offline
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where you were meant to be...

Meridionale is a perfect example of someone who gave a house a chance and worked it out for the best. More PNM's should have that attitude, but many are unwilling to do that and that is why some end up without bids.
However, rush, like life, is not always fair and doesn't always work out "the way it is supposed to" (the way it is SUPPOSED to being the way you intend it to). It just doesn't go the way you want it to sometimes - and often it has nothing to do with the PNM and everything to do with the process. That is why I think it is not helpful to say things like "you'll end up where you belong" and "things work out the way they are supposed to". Then, a PNM who is bidless on bid day, despite doing everything right, believes there is not house of which she is worthy. Sometimes the process gets screwed up - all PNM's should know this.
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  #108  
Old 07-12-2003, 06:04 PM
James James is offline
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If I am reading the Rush posts correctly, one of the reasons the process screws up is that the NPC is trying to tamper with the "Market".

A lot of girls that in a free market economy would have matched with the chapter they wanted are in fact cut heavily because of the artifical process.

So I am not sure we are talking Fate so much as NPC's attempt to mimic Command/Control Economies lol.

To blame fate excuses what seems to be a flawed system.
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  #109  
Old 07-12-2003, 06:10 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Ok, here's a thought. Say that rushees could follow James' "free market" model and join whatever group they wanted. After a while, do you think the "top" groups would lose their status and the system would become more equal? Because a lot of the perceived desirability of a group has to do with its level of exclusivity.
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  #110  
Old 07-12-2003, 06:11 PM
James James is offline
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It might be better to tell people: Look if you get to know these girls with an open mind you might come to like them.

Realistically if you meet 60 girls you are bound to like a bunch of them and make some friends. If you make some friends you will probably enjoy your experience. Thats usually what happens when someon comes back to us and says, it worked out. OR they found a home. They made friends.

However, its safe to say that they would have made friends in the organization they wanted originally. they just worked though their initial dissapointment. I am not abolutely sure why the women have decided to develop a system that puts undergrads in this position, but there it is.

However, the potential to make friends may not overcome the fact that a chapter has a lower social status in the eyes of the PNM and maybe even in the eyes of the campus. In that case its perfectly understandable for the woman not to want to join, and we shouldn't be pressuring them to do so.
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  #111  
Old 07-12-2003, 06:36 PM
Munchkin03 Munchkin03 is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by James
I am not abolutely sure why the women have decided to develop a system that puts undergrads in this position, but there it is.
I've never really understood this myself, and as I get older, it bothers me. I'm not sure if there's a better system, but I think it's terribly unfair to put girls, many of whom haven't even attended their first day of college, through this sort of pressure. It's not fate, it is NPC's way to mimic command/control economies, as James so stated it.

This is why I am a huge fan of Deferred Recruitment, and an even bigger fan of the NPHC's system of not allowing Freshmen to go through Recruitment. In those systems, you get to spend your first semester or year focusing on what you really came to college for.
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  #112  
Old 07-12-2003, 07:40 PM
aopinthesky aopinthesky is offline
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>>>Originally posted by James
I am not abolutely sure why the women have decided to develop a system that puts undergrads in this position, but there it is.<<<

No system is foolproof (all you have to do is take a look at our last Presidential election) and I do agree that deferred rush and the exclusion of freshmen are great ways to take some of the pressure off. Keep in mind, though, that this system that "the women" have developed does work for the majority. Granted, I think that over time it has worked less well. James, any woman who has participated in rush on either side knows full well what the flaws are.
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  #113  
Old 07-13-2003, 09:46 AM
carnation carnation is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by AlphaXi4983
this is kinda off topic, but earlier someone mentioned that she watched "the cream of the crop" from her daughter's school get cut and her and all the other alum were wondering what happened.... sometimes those that would would consider a-list are only mediocre when they rush becuase of the quality of the other girls that go through, it just all depends on who goes through at what time.

(i dont mean to sound snotty or anything, cuz i would hardly be considered a-list, but sometimes thats just the reality)
It was probably either justamom or me. As for the girls in question--they were all top 5 grads at a large suburban high school, had incredible activities and community service, and were unquestionably gorgeous. These weren't situations where a girl was yearbook editor and no more at some little unknown high school (don't get me wrong, nothing wrong with that but we're comparing to Atlanta high schools now-which is what most of the UGa sororities do) and was then shocked because she hardly had any invitations.
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  #114  
Old 07-13-2003, 10:32 AM
sailorpiphi sailorpiphi is offline
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Thumbs up i did end up where i belong

Sorry but I ended up where I belong.
It sounds really stupid to say it now, however, rush was long for me and complicated and I was one very confused rushee, not knowing much going into it and the taboos etc.
My Rho Chis were awesome, two very different people and also very different from myself, however, after i went off and signed my bid card they told me,
we knew you belonged in Pi Phi from the start you were just confused at first!
The next day they were almost as excited as me to deliver me the bid from Pi Phi!
Looking back I really cant see myself anywhere else.
On a somewhat related note, on our campus we have the problem of saying,
when i went through rush the reason i knew i belonged in my house was because i just had that feeling you know? that feeling that this was where i belonged.
In my house we highly discourage anyone from saying that, not because some of us havent gotten that feeling (i for sure did!) but only because not everyone gets that all consuming magical feeling that this is where i belong
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  #115  
Old 07-13-2003, 10:48 AM
AOcutiePi4ever AOcutiePi4ever is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by carnation
It was probably either justamom or me. As for the girls in question--they were all top 5 grads at a large suburban high school, had incredible activities and community service, and were unquestionably gorgeous.
what would it matter how she looks?? i would hope it wouldn't make any rusher bat an eye... and if it does, that is pretty sad
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  #116  
Old 07-13-2003, 12:30 PM
carnation carnation is offline
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I know it shouldn't matter but it often does, especially at selective schools. It's human nature--I've read several research studies that show that even infants will react more favorably to pictures of attractive people than pictures of those who aren't. And no, I don't want to get into a discussion of what constitutes attractiveness and what doesn't!
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  #117  
Old 07-13-2003, 12:59 PM
justamom justamom is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by AOcutiePi4ever
what would it matter how she looks?? i would hope it wouldn't make any rusher bat an eye... and if it does, that is pretty sad
You are not being realistic. Maybe in a non competative environment it doesn't matter, but when you have apx 985 girls(the year they rushed) vying for a spot in 10 sororities with quota at 70, it IS a factor. Last year they upped quota to 75 or so.

Originally posted by AlphaXi4983-this is kinda off topic, but earlier someone mentioned that she watched "the cream of the crop" from her daughter's school get cut and her and all the other alum were wondering what happened.... sometimes those that would would consider a-list are only mediocre when they rush becuase of the quality of the other girls that go through, it just all depends on who goes through at what time.

(i dont mean to sound snotty or anything, cuz i would hardly be considered a-list, but sometimes thats just the reality)


The comment was mine, but Carnation saw the same thing happen with some girls from her daughters' HS. To clarify, our HS is known ALL over the state. Our graduates perform outstandingly. Our TOWN is not part of the NO, BR Laf. powerhouse but I repeat, our HS is.

The point of the comment WAS to illustrate just how darn competative it was that year AND how highly qualified the PNMs were. As just one example-Our Magna Cum Laude-Dance line Captain-Homecoming court-favorite-Blond hair/blue eyed beauty AND A LEGACY was cut by ALL the houses (legacy included) that our little area thought she was born and bred to join---- after open house! She droped out in the midde of round two parties...
I can assure you after following LSU rush for the past 10 years, there was nothing mediocre about them. I was more than pleased to see how successful my daughter's rush was. Call it shallow, but I actually wondered if the fact she wasn't on some kind of court would hurt her chances. Apparantly not.

So, you see the point you are making is true in a sense, but all things considered, I think it reinforces the concept that sometimes
there really isn't a specific reason a person is cut. Also, the fact remains that those girls most interested in rushing PROBABLY share common characteistics. Was it-imsohappythatimatheta-who said, "Rush is full of girls who have great resumes."? This is an undeniabe truth.
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  #118  
Old 07-13-2003, 01:12 PM
KillarneyRose KillarneyRose is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by AOcutiePi4ever
what would it matter how she looks?? i would hope it wouldn't make any rusher bat an eye... and if it does, that is pretty sad

In a perfect world, it wouldn't but in this world it does. It's a shame, but it's true.
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  #119  
Old 07-14-2003, 10:03 AM
shadokat shadokat is offline
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The system may have flaws, and I'll agree that it sucks to get cut for whatever reason, but the system DOES work for the majority of schools and women. Yes, we hear about the bad more than the good, because when it works, we take that for granted. James, the fraternity free-for-all recruitment system is fine for fraternities, because that's the way you've always done it. And fraternities at many schools have chapters of such differing sizes, unlike sororities, that maybe that system is what will continue to work. NPC put in place a system to benefit both the PNM and the sorority, and honestly, I believe it works 95% of the time.
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  #120  
Old 07-14-2003, 10:26 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by James
However, the potential to make friends may not overcome the fact that a chapter has a lower social status in the eyes of the PNM and maybe even in the eyes of the campus. In that case its perfectly understandable for the woman not to want to join, and we shouldn't be pressuring them to do so.
But if everyone who wanted to join XYZ COULD join it, would they still have a higher social status? Would there even be levels of social status at all?

Munchkin03, I am happy to see that you are on the Deferred Rush Express with me.
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