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  #1  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:34 PM
TexasPNM13 TexasPNM13 is offline
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Could I Fit In ..?

Hello, amazing Kappas!!

I want to be (one of) you!!


However, at the risk of facing rejection before recruitment has even begun, I must ask ...


Could I make it in a southern KKG chapter as an out queer woman with a girlfriend?


I'm a perfectionist. So, when it came to the prospect of recruitment I did my homework to find the perfect sorority for me. I researched every single sorority at my university and found myself falling in love with Kappa Kappa Gamma: their mission, their values, their causes. (Even if I founded a new chapter of an existing lesbian sorority, it wouldn't be as good of a fit for me. And frankly, I don't have that kind of time.)


But ... I did some research on the non-discimination by-laws for each sorority. Unfortunately, Kappa Kappa Gamma does not have any by-laws pertaining to sexual orientation.


Also, I tried to find some more-tangible advice about queer women in sororities via GreekChat though it just wasn't clear or relevant enough for me (I guess that's the Aries coming out in me).

Some Things About Me:
- If you saw me walking down the street by myself, you would never guess that I have a girlfriend.
- I am in love with learning and am graduating with a double degree (three more years). Semester GPA = 4.0, Cumulative GPA = 3.6ish. I know exactly what I want to do with my career.
- I love the environment and interned with a prominent environmental activist organization last Fall.
- I love art museums.
- I'm quite involved within my community (not just the gay community), love participating in philanthropy events and always will.
- I adore food.
- I am working on a business proposal for a cafe near my campus in 2011 (with a little help from my girlfriend, who graduated with a double major in Business and Marketing).
- I stay classy.
- Hooking up with sorority sisters is not on my list of things to do.


My Concerns:
- I knew sorority girls at my previous institution up north, but I hear that greek life in the South is a whole different ball game.
- Even if I could win my chapter over, I would be so sad to not feel included in my sorority at a national level. All the extra obstacles that I expect to face as a queer Greek at my new university would not be as worthwhile.
- I am moderately involved within the gay community. I've participated in womens organizations, picketed against Prop 8, volunteered at a couple other events, and plan to be involved with the Pride organization on-campus. While this is only a small part of who I am (besides mentioning my girlfriend, I rarely talk about my sexuality unless someone asks) and how I spend my time, I'm not exactly low-profile about being queer. Previous posters about related topics have expressed concern mostly when the GLB member wears their sexuality on their sleeve. Would this be wearing my sexuality on my sleeve?
- I'd be a little older than most of my pledge class. Would it be awkward to have a Big Sis who's younger than yourself?


I hope that wasn't too long. I normally don't talk this much about myself, but I thought some context would help. Any advice, ladies?


Sincerely,

TexasPNM13

Last edited by TexasPNM13; 05-27-2010 at 05:44 PM. Reason: Formatting Errors
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  #2  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:47 PM
lovespink88 lovespink88 is offline
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I'm pretty sad that I'm leaving for dinner soon so I won't get to watch this one unfold.
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  #3  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:54 PM
IrishLake IrishLake is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovespink88 View Post
I'm pretty sad that I'm leaving for dinner soon so I won't get to watch this one unfold.
ditto!
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  #4  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:55 PM
AZTheta's Avatar
AZTheta AZTheta is offline
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Location: 17 39' 3.312'' S 149 25' 33.7512'' W
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPNM13 View Post
Hello, amazing Kappas!!

I want to be (one of) you!!


However, at the risk of facing rejection before recruitment has even begun, I must ask ...


Could I make it in a southern KKG chapter as an out queer woman with a girlfriend?


I'm a perfectionist. So, when it came to the prospect of recruitment I did my homework to find the perfect sorority for me. I researched every single sorority at my university and found myself falling in love with Kappa Kappa Gamma: their mission, their values, their causes. (Even if I founded a new chapter of an existing lesbian sorority, it wouldn't be as good of a fit for me. And frankly, I don't have that kind of time.)


But ... I did some research on the non-discimination by-laws for each sorority. Unfortunately, Kappa Kappa Gamma does not have any by-laws pertaining to sexual orientation.


Also, I tried to find some more-tangible advice about queer women in sororities via GreekChat though it just wasn't clear or relevant enough for me (I guess that's the Aries coming out in me).

Some Things About Me:
- If you saw me walking down the street by myself, you would never guess that I have a girlfriend.
- I am in love with learning and am graduating with a double degree (three more years). Semester GPA = 4.0, Cumulative GPA = 3.6ish. I know exactly what I want to do with my career.
- I love the environment and interned with a prominent environmental activist organization last Fall.
- I love art museums.
- I'm quite involved within my community (not just the gay community), love participating in philanthropy events and always will.
- I adore food.
- I am working on a business proposal for a cafe near my campus in 2011 (with a little help from my girlfriend, who graduated with a double major in Business and Marketing).
- I stay classy.
- Hooking up with sorority sisters is not on my list of things to do.


My Concerns:
- I knew sorority girls at my previous institution up north, but I hear that greek life in the South is a whole different ball game.
- Even if I could win my chapter over, I would be so sad to not feel included in my sorority at a national level. All the extra obstacles that I expect to face as a queer Greek at my new university would not be as worthwhile.
- I am moderately involved within the gay community. I've participated in womens organizations, picketed against Prop 8, volunteered at a couple other events, and plan to be involved with the Pride organization on-campus. While this is only a small part of who I am (besides mentioning my girlfriend, I rarely talk about my sexuality unless someone asks) and how I spend my time, I'm not exactly low-profile about being queer. Previous posters about related topics have expressed concern mostly when the GLB member wears their sexuality on their sleeve. Would this be wearing my sexuality on my sleeve?
- I'd be a little older than most of my pledge class. Would it be awkward to have a Big Sis who's younger than yourself?


I hope that wasn't too long. I normally don't talk this much about myself, but I thought some context would help. Any advice, ladies?


Sincerely,

TexasPNM13
QFP, just because...
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  #5  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:56 PM
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AZ-AlphaXi AZ-AlphaXi is offline
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QFP .... good for you!!
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  #6  
Old 05-27-2010, 05:58 PM
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AZTheta AZTheta is offline
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Originally Posted by AZ-AlphaXi View Post
QFP .... good for you!!
did NOT do it for me, did it for some esteemed GC veterans; I'm sitting in the bleachers with my soda.
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Basically my main piece of advice is: if you are lucky enough to get a bid to ANY chapter, that is your golden ticket and you should take it and run with it.
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  #7  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:02 PM
knight_shadow knight_shadow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPNM13 View Post
- Even if I could win my chapter over, I would be so sad to not feel included in my sorority at a national level. All the extra obstacles that I expect to face as a queer Greek at my new university would not be as worthwhile.
Swerving, buuuut...

1. What do you mean by this? Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I doubt that I/HQ will overturn a chapter's decision if they discover your sexual orientation.

2. The font color and "I WILL BE A KAPPA" attitude is very presumtuous. Remember, this is a mutual selection process.
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  #8  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:05 PM
bostongreek bostongreek is offline
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Posts: 265
this is going to be good.
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  #9  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:06 PM
IrishLake IrishLake is offline
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Posts: 3,015
I'll just add this... I know a LOT of lesbian and gay men, family, friends, former co-workers and classmates... I have never heard one of them refer to themselves as "queer," unless they are joking around. Maybe things are different in Texas...

Lovely Kappa ladies... enjoy! :-)
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" k_s
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With twin stars and kites above.
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  #10  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:09 PM
violetpretty violetpretty is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: A state with a North-South identity crisis
Posts: 3,213
I'll bite.

For starters, the way you are looking at recruitment is not how it works in the NPC. You don't choose a sorority based on the national organization before looking at the chapter at your school. There are other NPCs that I admire nationally but I never would have joined because I went to Maryland, and they weren't a fit for me at my campus. You need to find a fit on the local level first. If you want to be a member of an NPC sorority, you need to consider all chapters on your campus. If KKG cut you, would you not want to be Greek?

Not every "Southern KKG Chapter" is the same. Some are tippy top tier, some are bottom, some are in the middle. Without knowing you or the specific KKG chapter in question, this is impossible to say. Even if we did know both, it's impossible to say your chances because we are not in that chapter making the decision.

Based on what you've told us, I would want you in my chapter. But even I couldn't guarantee that the rest of the women in my chapter would feel the same way. Who gets a bid is not the decision of just a few people. So even if you did find an active GCer in the chapter in question, she wouldn't be able to tell you.

Your sophomore status will be enough of an obstacle if you are at a competitive school. You sound like a good candidate with your activities and GPA. However, certain people will not be able to look past your sexuality. Can you deal with the possibility of rejection?
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  #11  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:10 PM
violetpretty violetpretty is offline
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Location: A state with a North-South identity crisis
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishLake View Post
I'll just add this... I know a LOT of lesbian and gay men, family, friends, former co-workers and classmates... I have never heard one of them refer to themselves as "queer," unless they are joking around. Maybe things are different in Texas...

Lovely Kappa ladies... enjoy! :-)
One of my education profs from college is gay, and he prefers "queer".
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  #12  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:11 PM
AXOrushadvisor AXOrushadvisor is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 682
I'm not a Kappa.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by TexasPNM13 View Post
Hello, amazing Kappas!!

I want to be (one of) you!!


However, at the risk of facing rejection before recruitment has even begun, I must ask ...


Could I make it in a southern KKG chapter as an out queer woman with a girlfriend?


I'm a perfectionist. So, when it came to the prospect of recruitment I did my homework to find the perfect sorority for me. I researched every single sorority at my university and found myself falling in love with Kappa Kappa Gamma: their mission, their values, their causes. (Even if I founded a new chapter of an existing lesbian sorority, it wouldn't be as good of a fit for me. And frankly, I don't have that kind of time.)


But ... I did some research on the non-discimination by-laws for each sorority. Unfortunately, Kappa Kappa Gamma does not have any by-laws pertaining to sexual orientation.


Also, I tried to find some more-tangible advice about queer women in sororities via GreekChat though it just wasn't clear or relevant enough for me (I guess that's the Aries coming out in me).

Some Things About Me:
- If you saw me walking down the street by myself, you would never guess that I have a girlfriend.
- I am in love with learning and am graduating with a double degree (three more years). Semester GPA = 4.0, Cumulative GPA = 3.6ish. I know exactly what I want to do with my career.
- I love the environment and interned with a prominent environmental activist organization last Fall.
- I love art museums.
- I'm quite involved within my community (not just the gay community), love participating in philanthropy events and always will.
- I adore food.
- I am working on a business proposal for a cafe near my campus in 2011 (with a little help from my girlfriend, who graduated with a double major in Business and Marketing).
- I stay classy.
- Hooking up with sorority sisters is not on my list of things to do.


My Concerns:
- I knew sorority girls at my previous institution up north, but I hear that greek life in the South is a whole different ball game.
- Even if I could win my chapter over, I would be so sad to not feel included in my sorority at a national level. All the extra obstacles that I expect to face as a queer Greek at my new university would not be as worthwhile.
- I am moderately involved within the gay community. I've participated in womens organizations, picketed against Prop 8, volunteered at a couple other events, and plan to be involved with the Pride organization on-campus. While this is only a small part of who I am (besides mentioning my girlfriend, I rarely talk about my sexuality unless someone asks) and how I spend my time, I'm not exactly low-profile about being queer. Previous posters about related topics have expressed concern mostly when the GLB member wears their sexuality on their sleeve. Would this be wearing my sexuality on my sleeve?
- I'd be a little older than most of my pledge class. Would it be awkward to have a Big Sis who's younger than yourself?


I hope that wasn't too long. I normally don't talk this much about myself, but I thought some context would help. Any advice, ladies?


Sincerely,

TexasPNM13
TexasPNM13,

I'm not a Kappa, but I am involved in the recruitment process. Kappa is a great group of ladies and they have a great national organization. Perhaps you don't understand how the recruitment process works, but it is a mutual selection process and there are no guarantees that Kappa will invite you back or you'll even want to go back. What if you have nothing in common with the Kappa girls on your campus and fall in love with another group? Going into recruitment thinking you only want to be one thing is a recipe for heart break in my humble opinion.

There are lots of gay men and women involved in Greek organizations. I actually personally know many for what its worth, but most if not all did not come out until after college. I don't think that I would flat out advertise that your gay because a lot of people are narrow minded. Having said that unless you tell someone or have it listed on your application the sororities will never know. When you say this: Could I make it in a southern KKG chapter as an out queer woman with a girlfriend? Do you mean if you could make it if or when you become a member? I'm not sure even a TX Kappa could answer that for you.

If you want to go through recruitment at your university I would do so with an open mind. Good luck to you. You sound like a very nice articulate girl.
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  #13  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:12 PM
Drolefille Drolefille is offline
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Posts: 13,655
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishLake View Post
I'll just add this... I know a LOT of lesbian and gay men, family, friends, former co-workers and classmates... I have never heard one of them refer to themselves as "queer," unless they are joking around. Maybe things are different in Texas...

Lovely Kappa ladies... enjoy! :-)
Queer is coming back into fashion in a "we're taking it back" sort of way, it pretty much means either an orientation or a gender expression that is non-heteronormative.

Anyway, I'm being good and not pouncing on the drama llama that this is. Except to say that a) go through recruitment and find out, b) if you're a member, HQ isn't going to not include you or kick you out for your orientation/gender expression, and c) read more before you post about this.
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  #14  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:13 PM
LucyKKG LucyKKG is offline
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 4,421
Hello TexasPNM13,

I'm sure some people can go into more detail, but here's the summarized version of what I think about your post:

- Go through recruitment so you can get a look at EACH chapter at your school. That's what recruitment is for. You may find that you fit better with a different organization (or who know, you could still be all about Kappa).

- Discretion is a good thing! You have given out a lot of personal information on the internet, and a lot of people read these boards.

- Being at a southern school, you may be at a disadvantage because you are older than a freshman. I am not an expert (at all) in regards to your school, but that's what I have heard multiple times. No one here can tell you what your chances are of getting a bid.
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  #15  
Old 05-27-2010, 06:13 PM
Drolefille Drolefille is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 13,655
Quote:
Originally Posted by violetpretty View Post
I'll bite.

For starters, the way you are looking at recruitment is not how it works in the NPC. You don't choose a sorority based on the national organization before looking at the chapter at your school. There are other NPCs that I admire nationally but I never would have joined because I went to Maryland, and they weren't a fit for me at my campus. You need to find a fit on the local level first. If you want to be a member of an NPC sorority, you need to consider all chapters on your campus. If KKG cut you, would you not want to be Greek?

Not every "Southern KKG Chapter" is the same. Some are tippy top tier, some are bottom, some are in the middle. Without knowing you or the specific KKG chapter in question, this is impossible to say. Even if we did know both, it's impossible to say your chances because we are not in that chapter making the decision.

Based on what you've told us, I would want you in my chapter. But even I couldn't guarantee that the rest of the women in my chapter would feel the same way. Who gets a bid is not the decision of just a few people. So even if you did find an active GCer in the chapter in question, she wouldn't be able to tell you.

Your sophomore status will be enough of an obstacle if you are at a competitive school. You sound like a good candidate with your activities and GPA. However, certain people will not be able to look past your sexuality. Can you deal with the possibility of rejection?
My sister is awesome.
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