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  #16  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:17 PM
KSUViolet06 KSUViolet06 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
as for all the required things, what are we supposed to just let everyone in? wheres the selection process, how do we determine who is dedicated and willing to further the fraternity in a positive way.

as i mentioned they have to hit a point level its super easy to get to with not much effort if at all.
Cutting out cheesy CIA interviews does not = letting everyone in. lol.
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  #17  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:27 PM
als463 als463 is offline
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Originally Posted by KSUViolet06 View Post
Cutting out cheesy CIA interviews does not = letting everyone in. lol.
I agree with KSUViolet on this one. Everyone has told you that what you are doing is hazing. I disagree with your belief that by "hazing" the pledges you are determining who will be great brothers who want to further the needs of the fraternity.

I was NOT hazed and I am very involved. I am a member of Foundation, I have held a position every year since graduation in various Alumna Chapters. I am heading to my second convention as a voting delegate. I send money to my undergraduate chapter. I have written a recommendation for a young lady who later became one of my sisters. I wear my letters every chance I get, ESPECIALLY during times when I am doing philanthropy events. I care about everything my sorority stands for and I have respect for all the other NPC GLOs who are members of National Panhellenic. I'd say I'm a decent sister, who has never given away secrets of my sorority and loves it-yet I was never hazed. What is your response to that?
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  #18  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:33 PM
IrishLake IrishLake is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
as for all the required things, what are we supposed to just let everyone in? wheres the selection process, how do we determine who is dedicated and willing to further the fraternity in a positive way.

as i mentioned they have to hit a point level its super easy to get to with not much effort if at all.
so if someone chooses to not finish a task, be it the essay or the interview, because they feel it's uncomfortable hazing, then how do they earn enough points to join? You say that walking out of something like that doesn't affect their potential membership status, but it does. How can they earn enough points if they don't finish the task? How can you say, then, that walking out does not affect them joining?

How about just talking to the guys? Getting to know them? Everything else sounds ok. The bowling, the mixers, the dinners. Keep up with stuff like that. Even an interview is fine, just take out the interrogation.
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  #19  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:35 PM
AZPHI JOURNEAUX AZPHI JOURNEAUX is offline
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Last edited by AZPHI JOURNEAUX; 05-07-2010 at 09:50 PM.
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  #20  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:41 PM
AZPHI JOURNEAUX AZPHI JOURNEAUX is offline
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Last edited by AZPHI JOURNEAUX; 05-07-2010 at 09:50 PM.
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  #21  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:51 PM
VandalSquirrel VandalSquirrel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
I'm opening the floor for you to explain your selection processes so we can take a look.... I'm sure we can find hazing to some degree.... someone I went through the system and didn't feel my personal felling where hurt in any way, i figured it was part of the game, to be in a community service group you might want to be active in community service. its like being on the baseball team, the selection criteria there is you have to proficiently play baseball... if it works better we can change the lighting to general florescent lights if it really means that much....

as for the tests and quizzes we are not talking about go get me this and that, its written tests. from a set informational packet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
and we have point value assigned to spending time with people in the fraternity, as i said you don't have to do everything, if you really think that a selection process like this is hazing, its all openly going on, we admit to it, and no one has ever complained. if someone voices a complaint its heard and the problem is remedied, we don't allow any physical harm to come to the pledges or for that matter the availability for it.

as for the psychological effects of a lighting change in a room, its not a interrogation, its an interview, just like those for a job. just you have a light shining in your eyes.... honest if it means enough we can change.
I honestly do not see how any of these things relate to worthiness to join a community service organization. Why not have people work together on a community service project as membership candidates, and if they massively fail at that, don't let them in. Or do X amount of community service hours and have a GPA or X.XX None of your little email tasks, light blinding interviews, or wallet door things have any relation to a community service organization. I can't imagine Habitat for Humanity blindfolding me and shooting a nail gun near my head to prove I can participate, or the Humane Society mashing up a chocolate bar to look like dog poop and having me eat it before I can walk or groom animals.

I wouldn't want someone in my group who allowed themselves to be manipulated or treated like crap, and I wouldn't want to be on the radar of my school administration for actions where I could be sued or shut down, especially in the name of community service.
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  #22  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:52 PM
Senusret I Senusret I is offline
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AZPHI - Notice the lack of men who have responded to your questions. (I am the first one since you)

I suggest that you speak to men who are in a national fraternity already -- your fathers, blood brothers of fraternity brothers, and family friends. They will know you better than we do and will give you advice or referrals that are better than our advice could truly be.

Various fraternities also have much of their programs, pledging standards, etc, on the public parts of their websites. You can review these documents and compare your organization to them.

Good luck with everything -- go out there and meet the fraternity men you seek. GreekChat won't ultimately be very helpful. (Unless you want a whole lot of judgment from people who might not have even been initiated as undergrads into a fraternity like yours)
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  #23  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:52 PM
als463 als463 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
and we have point value assigned to spending time with people in the fraternity, as i said you don't have to do everything, if you really think that a selection process like this is hazing, its all openly going on, we admit to it, and no one has ever complained. if someone voices a complaint its heard and the problem is remedied, we don't allow any physical harm to come to the pledges or for that matter the availability for it.

as for the psychological effects of a lighting change in a room, its not a interrogation, its an interview, just like those for a job. just you have a light shining in your eyes.... honest if it means enough we can change.
You still haven't answered my question. How do you feel about what all I just said? I wasn't hazed and yet I am VERY involved and loyal to my sorority. I am also willing to bet that MANY people on this site, who are VERY LOYAL to their organizations, were NOT hazed. If you were at my campus and you were doing that (which you wouldn't be because Penn State no longer allows locals-at least local sororities and I'm sure fraternities) many of the people on campus would laugh at your CIA-style of "interviewing" the brothers. You make it seem more like a JOKE than an actual reputable fraternity. Aren't there any national fraternities on your campus?
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  #24  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:54 PM
VandalSquirrel VandalSquirrel is offline
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Originally Posted by Senusret I View Post
AZPHI - Notice the lack of men who have responded to your questions. (I am the first one since you)

I suggest that you speak to men who are in a national fraternity already -- your fathers, blood brothers of fraternity brothers, and family friends. They will know you better than we do and will give you advice or referrals that are better than our advice could truly be.

Various fraternities also have much of their programs, pledging standards, etc, on the public parts of their websites. You can review these documents and compare your organization to them.

Good luck with everything -- go out there and meet the fraternity men you seek. GreekChat won't ultimately be very helpful. (Unless you want a whole lot of judgment from people who might not have even been initiated as undergrads into a fraternity like yours)
How much Boy Scout popcorn did you have to sell before they let you in Alpha Phi Omega?

Those Girl Scouts made me sell and eat cookies, and I had to sew on all the badges of the older girls
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  #25  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:55 PM
Senusret I Senusret I is offline
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  #26  
Old 05-06-2010, 09:58 PM
AZPHI JOURNEAUX AZPHI JOURNEAUX is offline
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Last edited by AZPHI JOURNEAUX; 05-07-2010 at 09:51 PM.
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  #27  
Old 05-06-2010, 10:01 PM
AZPHI JOURNEAUX AZPHI JOURNEAUX is offline
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Last edited by AZPHI JOURNEAUX; 05-07-2010 at 09:51 PM.
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  #28  
Old 05-06-2010, 10:01 PM
Senusret I Senusret I is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AZPHI JOURNEAUX View Post
So that really puts it in context..... women are under a different standard, their pledging processes are a lot different than anything I've seen, cause well women are emotional, men we like a sense of accomplishment... Yes we actually want our members to feel like they accomplished something, and it wasn't just given to them...

thanks for the first bit of good advice. ill look into the pledging standards for other frats.

thanks

You're welcome.

Be careful not to oversimplify the rationale, though. Some women prefer to feel a sense of accomplishment through trial (in their Greek experience) and others feel accomplished just by being selected. Conversely, many men are emotional and don't thrive off a trial-by-fire type of pledging program.

Do what's best for your fraternity, period.
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  #29  
Old 05-06-2010, 10:02 PM
AZPHI JOURNEAUX AZPHI JOURNEAUX is offline
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Last edited by AZPHI JOURNEAUX; 05-07-2010 at 09:51 PM.
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  #30  
Old 05-06-2010, 10:04 PM
IrishLake IrishLake is offline
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you may also want to try the "local" section of GC. maybe other Local GLOs could help you out.
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