Florida Loses Appeal in Terri Schiavo Case

[pinkyphimu]

this is so sad. i wish that this woman's parents would just let her go. several years ago, a family friend's 5 yro son was diagnosed with cancer. as he neared the end, a priest told his parents to be sure to tell him that it is ok to leave. he said that for many patients, they stay alive longer than they want to because they see how much their family wants them to stay.


now, on another note, a friend's older brother was in a serious motorcycle accident. he had a portion of his brain removed and many numerous surgeries. after a few weeks on life support, it was determined that he was brain dead and that there was no chance for life without artifical means. his family decided to remove his life support. eight days later, he woke up and said he was hungry. it has been a very very long road for him, but he can now walk and talk. he can return to a normal life, but different from what he was used to. his wife divorced him. he sees his daughters regularly, but can't take them overnight because he has such short term memory loss that he is afraid he might forget to turn off the stove or something. his doctors honestly were in disbelief when he woke up. based on his test results, there was no brain activity whatsoever. no one is sure why he woke up, but he did. the main difference between the case of my friend's brother....and terri shivo is that he had only been on life support a few weeks. she has had 15 years to make gains and has shown no progress.

[RUgreek]

Latest news on the legislation b.s., the senate pre-approved a bill that hasn't been voted on or debated in the house. This is so ass backwards I don't even know if it's worth talking about anymore

Apparently the house is going to convene after midnight to pass it back to bush to sign asap. I hope that florida defies this, but that would be too funny....

[Optimist Prime]

Originally posted by RUgreek
Latest news on the legislation b.s., the senate pre-approved a bill that hasn't been voted on or debated in the house. This is so ass backwards I don't even know if it's worth talking about anymore

Apparently the house is going to convene after midnight to pass it back to bush to sign asap. I hope that florida defies this, but that would be too funny....

that would be funny...or if the fed judge sides with Florida anyway

[honeychile]

Originally posted by pinkyphimu

now, on another note, a friend's older brother was in a serious motorcycle accident. he had a portion of his brain removed and many numerous surgeries. after a few weeks on life support, it was determined that he was brain dead and that there was no chance for life without artifical means. his family decided to remove his life support. eight days later, he woke up and said he was hungry. it has been a very very long road for him, but he can now walk and talk. he can return to a normal life, but different from what he was used to. his wife divorced him. he sees his daughters regularly, but can't take them overnight because he has such short term memory loss that he is afraid he might forget to turn off the stove or something. his doctors honestly were in disbelief when he woke up. based on his test results, there was no brain activity whatsoever. no one is sure why he woke up, but he did. the main difference between the case of my friend's brother....and terri shivo is that he had only been on life support a few weeks. she has had 15 years to make gains and has shown no progress.

This gave me new perspective. I seldom (if ever) agree with this columnist, but he mentions depositions etc that I had no idea had been taken:

"On Friday, a Senate committee, trying to forestall the withdrawal of feeding, subpoenaed her, though unsuccessfully. The action is not as silly as it sounds. At one point, after she presumably became vegetative, Terri Schiavo was taken to a shopping mall."

"...The facts are these: Terri Schiavo collapsed in 1990. She has been in hospitals and nursing homes since then. Videotapes depict a young woman who seems to respond to some voice stimuli, but does not communicate. At least three affidavits are on file from former nursing home attendants who insist Terri showed some hope of making progress, but that her husband insisted she be given no rehabilitation."

"...One nurse, Carla Sauer Iyer, said Terri 'spoke on a regular basis, saying such things as 'Mommy' and 'help me.' " Iyer said that when she put a washcloth in Terri's hands to keep her fingers from curling together, 'Michael saw it and made me take it out, saying that was therapy.'"

Read the article - it's an eye opener.

[KillarneyRose]

I am absolutely livid about President Bush signing this bill. This is the first time since I've started to vote that I'm not feeling so great about the Republican party

At least Michael Schiavo can rest knowing he did everything he possibly could to honor his wife's wishes. Who would ever thought something so personal could have become such a public spectacle?

[moe.ron]

Originally posted by KillarneyRose
I am absolutely livid about President Bush signing this bill. This is the first time since I've started to vote that I'm not feeling so great about the Republican party

At least Michael Schiavo can rest knowing he did everything he possibly could to honor his wife's wishes. Who would ever thought something so personal could have become such a public spectacle?

This smells like a purely political move. They don't give an iota about the Schiavo. It's all about clamoring to the religious right.

[mu_agd]

Hopefully someone can explain this to me, but why are Congress and the government getting involved in this? Shouldn't this be something that stayed in Florida and when the Court said to remove the tube, it should be removed? Aren't there better things to be worrying about than this?

[moe.ron]

Originally posted by mu_agd
Hopefully someone can explain this to me, but why are Congress and the government getting involved in this? Shouldn't this be something that stayed in Florida and when the Court said to remove the tube, it should be removed? Aren't there better things to be worrying about than this?

I'm also confused about another thing. The bill that was passed, was it agains euthanasia in general or was it specificaly for this case?

[HelloKitty22]

Originally posted by honeychile
This gave me new perspective. I seldom (if ever) agree with this columnist, but he mentions depositions etc that I had no idea had been taken:

"On Friday, a Senate committee, trying to forestall the withdrawal of feeding, subpoenaed her, though unsuccessfully. The action is not as silly as it sounds. At one point, after she presumably became vegetative, Terri Schiavo was taken to a shopping mall."

"...The facts are these: Terri Schiavo collapsed in 1990. She has been in hospitals and nursing homes since then. Videotapes depict a young woman who seems to respond to some voice stimuli, but does not communicate. At least three affidavits are on file from former nursing home attendants who insist Terri showed some hope of making progress, but that her husband insisted she be given no rehabilitation."

"...One nurse, Carla Sauer Iyer, said Terri 'spoke on a regular basis, saying such things as 'Mommy' and 'help me.' " Iyer said that when she put a washcloth in Terri's hands to keep her fingers from curling together, 'Michael saw it and made me take it out, saying that was therapy.'"

Read the article - it's an eye opener.

My mother is a nurse and when she was in nursing school she worked at Neurological Institute at Columbia-Presbyterian Hospital with comatose patients and people in cronic vegetative states. I was talking to her about the case and she told me some pretty interesting stuff. She says that many facial movements and other stuff are reflexive movements which come from the brain stem (the part which directs the most innate movements - like breathing). People in CVS can smile, yawn, and make noise. They can make small movements with their hands and arms. I was particularly surprised by the yawn thing which I thought was pretty advanced but is apparently something that we're innately trained to do. She says that family members would come and they would be like "look she smiled!! She recognized me!!" But what they didn't realize is that the person smiles reflexively whenever, whether there's someone in the room or not. It's not evidence that the person can hear you or anything.
Since this woman is breathing, there's no reason you can't wheel or to a mall, or anywhere else for that matter. As long as they give her good nursing care, they can take her wherever. But it doesn't mean that she knows where she is or that she's enjoying her day out. There are sophisticated tests which they do to see if people are having advanced brain activity and it's my understanding she isn't. If she hasn't had brain activity of the thinking kind for fifteen years, no amount of therapy is going to change that. All that therapy can do is keep her physical body healthy, by preventing atrophy of the muscles, infection of the lungs, bedsores, sepsis, etc. In that respect, her health could "improve" but it isn't going to change her CVS.

[DeltAlum]

Originally posted by KillarneyRose
I am absolutely livid about President Bush signing this bill.

And even more livid about Congress sticking its colective nose in a place it doesn't belong -- in a local matter.

Does this mean that our friends in Washington are going to consider every case in which a family is in disagreement over taking someone off life support?

Sorry, but that's not what I pay them for.

[sageofages]

Originally posted by moe.ron
I'm also confused about another thing. The bill that was passed, was it agains euthanasia in general or was it specificaly for this case?

It was specific to the Schiavo case. It allows her family to be able to take this matter to FEDERAL court. All it does it prolong the fight. I would expect the law be to be declared unconstitutional very quickly!.

[BetteDavisEyes]

God I really hope the federal judge finds it unconstitutional. Her parents need to let her go in peace & stop prolonging the agony. I know no parent wants to watch their child die before them but is this really the quality of life she would want and/or deserve?

[Shortfuse]

Originally posted by moe.ron
This smells like a purely political move. They don't give an iota about the Schiavo. It's all about clamoring to the religious right.

Kinda makes that "Government staying out of civilian lives" thing look like bs huh?

[aggieAXO]

most mammals and some reptiles yawn-it is a basic act.

[moe.ron]

Originally posted by sageofages
It was specific to the Schiavo case. It allows her family to be able to take this matter to FEDERAL court. All it does it prolong the fight. I would expect the law be to be declared unconstitutional very quickly!.

Wow, that is a very dangerous precedent. I also expect the law to be declared unconstitutiona.