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  #76  
Old 06-05-2020, 02:49 PM
SWTXBelle SWTXBelle is offline
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Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
It doesn’t screw them over, it prevents a tiered system from forming. You’re going to have to have some canaries for this coal mine and we all know damned well that it’s not going to be any of the groups that are thought of as nationally prestigious.
There are already well-known "tiers", if you want to call them that, because all of the NPC sororities have different criteria for presenting, and some are not interested in smaller, lesser known colleges, while others enthusiastically open chapters at the same. Horses for courses.
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  #77  
Old 06-05-2020, 03:48 PM
KSUViolet06 KSUViolet06 is offline
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Late to the party on this, but my concern is turnover in Chapter Executive Boards/Officers with women who are only in school for two years or so. (And really, remember that for half of one of those years, you're still a NM. So it's really being active for 1.5 years.)
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  #78  
Old 06-05-2020, 04:08 PM
shirley1929 shirley1929 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
It doesn’t screw them over, it prevents a tiered system from forming. You’re going to have to have some canaries for this coal mine and we all know damned well that it’s not going to be any of the groups that are thought of as nationally prestigious.
I’m not trying to be dense I swear, I just want to understand... How does it NOT screw them over
- if ABC and XYZ want to be those canaries you speak of
- and PDQ does not, so they vote against it
- so ABC and XYZ don’t even get a chance to try, because PDQ doesn’t want to? (Given that all 26 have to unanimously decide to try it)

How is this any different from an extension happening At a 4year and groups not choosing to put in a packet for whatever reason?
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  #79  
Old 06-05-2020, 05:10 PM
SWTXBelle SWTXBelle is offline
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Originally Posted by shirley1929 View Post
I’m not trying to be dense I swear, I just want to understand... How does it NOT screw them over
- if ABC and XYZ want to be those canaries you speak of
- and PDQ does not, so they vote against it
- so ABC and XYZ don’t even get a chance to try, because PDQ doesn’t want to? (Given that all 26 have to unanimously decide to try it)

How is this any different from an extension happening At a 4year and groups not choosing to put in a packet for whatever reason?
It's not; you are exactly right.
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  #80  
Old 06-05-2020, 05:23 PM
shirley1929 shirley1929 is offline
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Originally Posted by SWTXBelle View Post
It's not; you are exactly right.
Ok thanks. I really was feeling dumb there for a sec...
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  #81  
Old 06-05-2020, 06:48 PM
TriDeltaSallie TriDeltaSallie is offline
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I thought of this discussion when I saw this today.

(Disclaimer: Did not listen to actual interview, only read article.)

Almost Half Of Universities May Be Gone In 5 To 10 Years, Professor Admits
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  #82  
Old 06-05-2020, 09:26 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shirley1929 View Post
I’m not trying to be dense I swear, I just want to understand... How does it NOT screw them over
- if ABC and XYZ want to be those canaries you speak of
- and PDQ does not, so they vote against it
- so ABC and XYZ don’t even get a chance to try, because PDQ doesn’t want to? (Given that all 26 have to unanimously decide to try it)

How is this any different from an extension happening At a 4year and groups not choosing to put in a packet for whatever reason?
Extension is not always a matter of “wanting” or “not wanting” to go somewhere. How many times have we talked about the SEC schools that need more groups but there aren’t groups that have the $ or local alumnae available to handle it?
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  #83  
Old 06-05-2020, 11:22 PM
Titchou Titchou is offline
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Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
Extension is not always a matter of “wanting” or “not wanting” to go somewhere. How many times have we talked about the SEC schools that need more groups but there aren’t groups that have the $ or local alumnae available to handle it?
Good heavens! She said "choosing" not "wanting." Groups may want to go to a campus but choose not to for any number of reasons. And it isn't always money or local alumnae. Not everyone wants to be at Big Southern U!
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  #84  
Old 06-06-2020, 03:27 AM
33girl 33girl is offline
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I know that.

I just see this making the tier system that’s already in the NPC worse. Obviously all the groups will never be equal - we are 150 years too late for that.

It just seems to me that if there are, as some people are saying, CCs that are virtually indistinguishable from regular 4 year colleges, it would be better to vote on expanding to them individually as exceptions to the rule, rather than opening the door to CCs that because of their student turnover are simply not suitable places to put an NPC group.
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  #85  
Old 06-06-2020, 09:48 AM
SWTXBelle SWTXBelle is offline
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I trust NPC member groups to evaluate for themselves whether or not a community college would be a good place to plant a colony, just as they do now for 4 year schools
Unless they change V, it is not even a possibility. Starting to grant individual exceptions to the Unanimous Agreements would set a very dangerous precedent, and open up an entirely unnecessary can of worms.
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Last edited by SWTXBelle; 06-06-2020 at 09:54 AM. Reason: Clarification
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  #86  
Old 06-06-2020, 09:53 AM
Titchou Titchou is offline
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Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
I know that.

I just see this making the tier system that’s already in the NPC worse. Obviously all the groups will never be equal - we are 150 years too late for that.

It just seems to me that if there are, as some people are saying, CCs that are virtually indistinguishable from regular 4 year colleges, it would be better to vote on expanding to them individually as exceptions to the rule, rather than opening the door to CCs that because of their student turnover are simply not suitable places to put an NPC group.
33, I get a headache from smh at some of the things you say.

1) Do you really want ALL of NPC to have to vote unanimously every time MMM or NNN wants to simply submit a packet to a CC expansion effort? Does that sound feasible to you?

2) What makes you think that student turnover is the reason?

3) And what the heck do you mean by "simply not suitable?" OMG! sounds like you are in a membership selection meeting at the stereotypical Big Southern U that everyone rails against

Well, bless your heart!
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  #87  
Old 06-06-2020, 12:01 PM
Alumna2 Alumna2 is offline
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Did not read all of the posts on this thread so I may be repeating an earlier note.

When NPC formed in 1902, several of the founding groups had chapters at what might be called junior colleges. Anyway, they were not accredited, four year colleges. In a couple of cases, the Alpha chapters of the groups were at such a college.

The original National Panhellenic Congress required member groups to give up such charters. Groups could have alumnae chapters, mothers' clubs and college chapters at accredited four year institutions only.

So I am surprised our current National Panhellenic Council is considering such a dramatic change. To have such groups at junior colleges is great - but why would they need to be NPC groups? I agree that this would not be in the best interests of the girls themselves if they choose to transition to a four year university to complete their career ambitions. In recent years it has been shared on this network that many campuses have two quotas - freshman and upper class - because having four years of membership ahead of you was already an advantage for PNMs in recruitment. Also agree with the few posts I read which pointed out that as likely as not, the university a woman chooses will not have the same groups as her JC did. Even if there was a match in groups on campus, would they be a match in interests?
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  #88  
Old 06-06-2020, 12:15 PM
TriDeltaSallie TriDeltaSallie is offline
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Originally Posted by 33girl View Post
I just see this making the tier system that’s already in the NPC worse. Obviously all the groups will never be equal - we are 150 years too late for that.
The groups could have all started at the same time and they still would not be equal. That's not the nature of human beings.

Some groups would make choices that work out well and others wouldn't. Groups would adopt different growth strategies, membership retention strategies, expansion strategies, etc.

Will we ever know how things would have been if they had all started at the same time? No. That's the way the world works. The USA is only a few hundred years old and look what it has accomplished that countries thousands of years old have never come close to achieving.

Chi Omega came into existence decades after other groups and yet they are the largest organization now. One could argue that some of the groups that joined later might not even exist if they hadn't been added to NPC.
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  #89  
Old 06-06-2020, 02:32 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Originally Posted by Titchou View Post
33, I get a headache from smh at some of the things you say.

1) Do you really want ALL of NPC to have to vote unanimously every time MMM or NNN wants to simply submit a packet to a CC expansion effort? Does that sound feasible to you?

2) What makes you think that student turnover is the reason?

3) And what the heck do you mean by "simply not suitable?" OMG! sounds like you are in a membership selection meeting at the stereotypical Big Southern U that everyone rails against

Well, bless your heart!
I’m just being blunt because I have no patience for pussyfooting with all the crap that’s going on these days. People keep posting about “CCs that are almost like 4 year universities.” That is not my experience, and the majority of the CC students I know of (older students trying to get a better job, freshmen who want to have a bare bones first year to save money, students who are trying to get basic credits as fast as possible and then transfer) are not good candidates for NPC sorority membership as it is now.

And quite frankly, you don’t get why I’m concerned about this because our sororities are in two completely different places as far as expansion opportunities are concerned. If you think chapters at community colleges are a good idea for DG, fine. I personally don’t think they’re a good idea for ASA. I sincerely hope all the groups vote (if this gets to a vote) for what suits them, not because they think it would be a good idea for someone else.
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  #90  
Old 06-06-2020, 02:33 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Originally Posted by Alumna2 View Post
Did not read all of the posts on this thread so I may be repeating an earlier note.

When NPC formed in 1902, several of the founding groups had chapters at what might be called junior colleges. Anyway, they were not accredited, four year colleges. In a couple of cases, the Alpha chapters of the groups were at such a college.

The original National Panhellenic Congress required member groups to give up such charters. Groups could have alumnae chapters, mothers' clubs and college chapters at accredited four year institutions only.

So I am surprised our current National Panhellenic Council is considering such a dramatic change. To have such groups at junior colleges is great - but why would they need to be NPC groups? I agree that this would not be in the best interests of the girls themselves if they choose to transition to a four year university to complete their career ambitions. In recent years it has been shared on this network that many campuses have two quotas - freshman and upper class - because having four years of membership ahead of you was already an advantage for PNMs in recruitment. Also agree with the few posts I read which pointed out that as likely as not, the university a woman chooses will not have the same groups as her JC did. Even if there was a match in groups on campus, would they be a match in interests?
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