School Shooting Newtown CT

[SigKapSweetie]

Originally Posted by adpimiz

Honestly, no amount of laws, metal detectors, searches... Nothing can stop someone who is that messed up in the head and that determined to kill. I agree something needs to be done, but I don't think gun control is the answer. Obviously, the shooter didn't care that murder is illegal. So why would he care if having a gun was illegal? Someone like that will always find a way, no matter what the law is.

This. Other countries (England springs to mind first) have very strict gun laws, and they still have mass shootings. Gun control isn't enough. Access to mental health care isn't enough. Everyone HAS access to emergency mental health care - just walk into the ER and tell the staff you're thinking about killing some kids. Boom, instant access. The real problem is the culture, the stigma associated with mental illness and its treatment. This guy may not have wanted any help, especially if he was psychotic. If he had no insight into his illness, the responsibility then falls (maybe unfairly, but there you go) to the people around him, like his family, to notice that there is a problem and to make sure that he receives treatment, voluntarily or involuntarily. Had anyone around him noticed what was going on with him? One call to 911 reporting concern that this guy was a danger to himself or others might have been enough to stop this. Especially given this:

"I think the most important thing to point out with this kind of individual is that he did not snap this morning and decide to act out violently," said former FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole. "These acts involve planning and thoughtfulness and strategizing in order to put the plan together so what may appear to be snap behavior is not that at all."

[MysticCat]

Originally Posted by SigKapSweetie

One call to 911 reporting concern that this guy was a danger to himself or others might have been enough to stop this. Especially given this:

"I think the most important thing to point out with this kind of individual is that he did not snap this morning and decide to act out violently," said former FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole. "These acts involve planning and thoughtfulness and strategizing in order to put the plan together so what may appear to be snap behavior is not that at all."

Comment I heard at a Christmas gathering last night:

Perhaps we ought to be keeping track of who buys things like Kevlar vests. I mean. who outside the military and law enforcement needs stuff like that? But the killers in cases like this always seem to have them.

Not a completely crazy idea, I thought.

[groovypq]

I seriously need to stop reading all of this, because it's making me physically sick. Those children were shot at close range, multiple times.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by SigKapSweetie

The real problem is the culture, the stigma associated with mental illness and its treatment. This guy may not have wanted any help, especially if he was psychotic. If he had no insight into his illness, the responsibility then falls (maybe unfairly, but there you go) to the people around him, like his family, to notice that there is a problem and to make sure that he receives treatment, voluntarily or involuntarily. Had anyone around him noticed what was going on with him? One call to 911 reporting concern that this guy was a danger to himself or others might have been enough to stop this. Especially given this:

"I think the most important thing to point out with this kind of individual is that he did not snap this morning and decide to act out violently," said former FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole. "These acts involve planning and thoughtfulness and strategizing in order to put the plan together so what may appear to be snap behavior is not that at all."

A lot of my friends, today, are posting about their own struggles with mental illness, and how we can remove the stigma. It's tough, even though my social circle consists largely of well-educated, privileged white kids who have access to healthcare, etc.

[groovypq]

I just read that Westboro Baptist "Church" is going to picket the funerals and is praising God for this tragedy. Sick fucks. Pardon my French but there is no other way to put it. I wish I could be a fly on the wall when they finally face God. I know that's really judgmental but there's no way He approves of their shit.

[adpimiz]

^ how disgusting. No parent should have to bury their child, especially with people like that around. Give them the privacy they deserve.

[DGTess]

http://blog.oup.com/2012/09/seven-myths-of-mass-murder/

[lovespink88]

Originally Posted by groovypq

I just read that Westboro Baptist "Church" is going to picket the funerals and is praising God for this tragedy. Sick fucks. Pardon my French but there is no other way to put it. I wish I could be a fly on the wall when they finally face God. I know that's really judgmental but there's no way He approves of their shit.

Of course they are. I had forgotten about those morons.

[KSUViolet06]

I keep reading about a teacher who lost her life trying to protect her kids and the principal who died trying to fight the gunman off (buying time for the kids.)

http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/video/vick...dents-17983086

[aephi alum]

Originally Posted by groovypq

I just read that Westboro Baptist "Church" is going to picket the funerals and is praising God for this tragedy.

That is truly disgusting.

[Munchkin03]

Originally Posted by DGTess

Short answer, no discussion from me.

It's not a question of "need". It's a creator-given right, to own a hunting rifle.

Whaaa? Where in the Bible does it say, "Thou shalt have a Baikal MR221?"

Look, I don't want to see guns banned, either. There's a reason we have a Second Amendment, and it's obvious that the Founding Fathers felt it important to include that in the Bill of Rights. I grew up around hunting, and I'm not afraid of guns. My nephew is 12 and has a hunting rifle, as well as a bow and arrow. He knows how to use them and he respects what they can do.

I just think what you said is not only incorrect, but a little overly emotional.

An attempt to ban guns would fail miserably. What would they do, seize all guns? Go through people's houses, conducting random firearm searches? (THAT would violate the Bill of Rights.) Not all firearms are registered, either. People inherit firearms from family members all the time.

If someone wants to have a gun, they're going to have a gun--regardless of whether or not it's illegal.* A member of my extended family was shot and killed earlier this year--by a 16 YEAR OLD IN A BOTCHED ROBBERY. This wasn't the inner city, and it wasn't a small town. I'm pretty sure gun banning wouldn't have prevented my relative's death. I'm pretty sure gun banning wouldn't have prevented what happened in CT, either. For the gunman, firearms were readily available--but he could have gotten them anywhere.

(*This clearly applies to many things, ranging from drugs to Kinder Surprises.)

[Xidelt]

Fox News was just showing pictures of one of the little girls killed in the shooting. I lost it. I keep thinking of the kiddos at my school.

[KSUViolet06]

Putting on my SPED grad student/SPED lab school teacher hat for a minute:

It bothers me to hear media saying "it's believed that the shooter had Aspberger's."

That's exactly what we need, people who don't understand Aspberger's/Autism to start thinking that having Aspberger's = murderous rampages.

[badgeguy]

I think everyone should have as many guns as they want, just ban bullets and ammunition!

[badgeguy]

Has anyone ever seen any studies done on the connection between these violent crimes and people who have been on Ritalin or other medications? I seem to recall that whenever these events took place some reporter would mention that the perp had either stopped medication or something.....just curious if maybe there is something to over medication of our youth....