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  #1  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:49 PM
Johnnie5 Johnnie5 is offline
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How about this question?

I am sorry everyone. I am not Greek. I have a question about Greek life and the rules that are supposed to stand as of today with your organizations. The question arose that only full time students are allowed membership into frats and sororities. Not to sound rude or anything but the responses to that question are pretty lame and I think much outdated. The only response to someone asking if part time students can join is that they "just can't"? Ridiculous. Is change a part of these organizations or are we still living in the past even pay n 2018? Here's my question, before I start pointing fingers, is whole bordering on discrimination, if a part time students works just as hard as a full time students to go to school and achieve academic success, is there success less in the eyes of someone who went full time? I think not. And this where I have the problem. Some part time students are going to school part time because of disabilities. If you are familiar with the disability programs with social security then you would know that they only allow you to go part time. That does not mean that that person still doesn't have a family tradition or dream of becoming Greek that seems to be shattered all because of one mere class. At the risk of losing their medication, insurance, and check that sustains them just as anyone else who works doesn't seem to be a requirement to join an organization that is SUPPOSED to be about uplifting individuals. Most of the people who are part time are already secure in the financial obligations with school and life. There are people who are Greek and went to school full time that don't give a. Damn about what other are doing and are doing farvworst. Now to me , those already secure are the type of people I would want in my organization. Not the latter. The will and determination to successfully become Greek is not an factor. How can this be overlooked? Are you saying that your education is better than mine? Are you saying that you are more capable of doing something than I am because your full time? Let's get off our high horses and start doing some work and addendums to outdated policies. It's 2018 not 1900. It's downright sickening and I am almost ashamed of everyone who believes in discriminating one group feom another.
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  #2  
Old 11-26-2018, 12:58 PM
LaneSig LaneSig is online now
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It is my experience that the "must be a full-time student, 12 hours or more" comes from the universities and colleges themselves, not the Greek organizations. Perhaps you need to approach the Greek Life office at your campus instead of the Greek organizations.
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  #3  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:34 PM
navane navane is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnie5 View Post
I am sorry everyone. I am not Greek. I have a question about Greek life and the rules that are supposed to stand as of today with your organizations. The question arose that only full time students are allowed membership into frats and sororities. Not to sound rude or anything but the responses to that question are pretty lame and I think much outdated. The only response to someone asking if part time students can join is that they "just can't"? Ridiculous. Is change a part of these organizations or are we still living in the past even pay n 2018? Here's my question, before I start pointing fingers, is whole bordering on discrimination, if a part time students works just as hard as a full time students to go to school and achieve academic success, is there success less in the eyes of someone who went full time? I think not. And this where I have the problem. Some part time students are going to school part time because of disabilities. If you are familiar with the disability programs with social security then you would know that they only allow you to go part time. That does not mean that that person still doesn't have a family tradition or dream of becoming Greek that seems to be shattered all because of one mere class. At the risk of losing their medication, insurance, and check that sustains them just as anyone else who works doesn't seem to be a requirement to join an organization that is SUPPOSED to be about uplifting individuals. Most of the people who are part time are already secure in the financial obligations with school and life. There are people who are Greek and went to school full time that don't give a. Damn about what other are doing and are doing farvworst. Now to me , those already secure are the type of people I would want in my organization. Not the latter. The will and determination to successfully become Greek is not an factor. How can this be overlooked? Are you saying that your education is better than mine? Are you saying that you are more capable of doing something than I am because your full time? Let's get off our high horses and start doing some work and addendums to outdated policies. It's 2018 not 1900. It's downright sickening and I am almost ashamed of everyone who believes in discriminating one group feom another.


Johnnie,

I am sorry that you had what appears to be a negative experience with trying to join a GLO. I think that, in your disappointment, you've perhaps read too much into the situation. No GLO says, "Hey, let's discriminate against disabled students by only allowing full-time students to participate." In addition, it is not fair for you to assume anything about full-time students (that they are more financially secure, they don't work as hard, they care less) anymore than it is fair for anyone to assume anything about part-time students (they must have issues if they're not full-time). Your upset towards full-time students is misplaced and the use of the phrase, "discrimination" is a bit overdramatic.

Historically, Greek Life was meant to be a part of the full-university experience. There have to be limitations on a lot of things in life. Many groups have a minimum age of 16 or 17 to pledge. Most all groups have a minimum GPA requirement. Most all groups have some kind of minimum enrollment requirement. That is, you can't just enroll in one 3-unit class and say, "but I'm enrolled!" So, they set a cut-off point for how many units of coursework is considered "full-time". We've had many many students come on here upset saying that the minimum GPA to participate in rush is 2.5 and s/he has a 2.48 and why are they being excluded for "only" .02 less in GPA. Because a cut-off is a cut-off and there has to be some "line". Also, as LaneSig pointed out, some of these policies are not from the GLOs but the university itself.

NOW....this does not mean that the organization or university cannot make exceptions. We've had members here at GreekChat who received age waivers for being too young. We had one member here who was born a female, but is gender fluid and mostly identifies as a male. He received an invitation to pledge a fraternity. My sorority pledged a young woman with Down Syndrome who was participating in a disability-access program. There have been many, I'm sure, that got GPA waivers because their other qualifications were so outstanding.

Being a "full-time student" is a standard qualification. As is being a student enrolled at the university at which the chapter is located. That is, students at a nearby campus that doesn't have Greek Life at all can't complain of discrimination when the university across town won't let them join the GLOs there. There simply have to be rules. Also note that there are vast differences between NIC fraternities and NPHC fraternities. If it is an NPHC fraternity you were attempting to approach, then your options will be very different. Most of us here cannot (or will not) speak on NPHC practices.

I would do what LaneSig suggests and contact your campus Greek Life Office for guidance and to find out if it's a campus rule or GLO rule. There may be fraternities which are able to make exceptions or maybe not. I will say, though, angrily e-mailing people and accusing them of discrimination will not do you any favors. You appear to be easily angered. If I was the rush chair and I received the message you posted above, I would politely turn you down even if there was possibly an exception that could have been made. Approach everyone with professionalism and politeness. That will get you further.

Best wishes to you.
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  #4  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:36 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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This policy isn't "bordering on discrimination." It's discrimination. As private organizations, we are allowed to discriminate in membership selection so long as we aren't discriminating based on race/religion, etc.

The full time requirement isn't something I've heard of regarding my alma mater. Most chapters aren't going to arbitrarily cut you because you're taking 9 and not 12 hours.
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  #5  
Old 11-26-2018, 01:40 PM
navane navane is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
This policy isn't "bordering on discrimination." It's discrimination. As private organizations, we are allowed to discriminate in membership selection so long as we aren't discriminating based on race/religion, etc.

Thank you. You explained it better than I did. Discrimination is a word that can be applied in more than one way.
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  #6  
Old 11-26-2018, 03:34 PM
Titchou Titchou is offline
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I don't know about men's groups but my NPC sorority requires that a potential new member be registered as a full time student as defined by the individual university. We do not mandate a set number of hours. I'm sorry that someone who evidently wasn't well versed in their group's rules nor the university's gave you that answer. As others have suggested, talk with your Greek Life office. But keep in mind, the groups choose their own members based on their own criteria. Just because the U may allow something does not mean the individual groups all do.
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  #7  
Old 11-26-2018, 07:13 PM
FSUZeta FSUZeta is offline
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Many students who join Greek orgs these days go to school full time and work part time. Many.

My organization also has the "regularly matriculated and full time female student" requirement. Perhaps in the future that will change, but as of now, there is an abundance of qualified PNMs, so there is no need to change.

Are you setting your sights on a single org or would you be open to membership in one of several? Casting you net wider might yield better results.
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  #8  
Old 11-26-2018, 07:21 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FSUZeta View Post
Many students who join Greek orgs these days go to school full time and work part time. Many.
At one point, I worked a full time job, two part time jobs, and was on scholarship with the school orchestra (kind of a 3rd PT job because it meant daily rehearsals). Having a full time job does not mean you can't carve 12 hours out of your evenings for classes.

Also, OP should be aware that if he can't commit 12 hours to class attendance and preparation, he doesn't have time to join a fraternity.

Quote:
Casting you net wider might yield better results.
Solid advice. I'd also urge OP to look at other organizations such as Freemasonry, Kiwanis, etc.
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  #9  
Old 11-26-2018, 09:20 PM
navane navane is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Also, OP should be aware that if he can't commit 12 hours to class attendance and preparation, he doesn't have time to join a fraternity.

If I understood correctly, the OP seemed to be explaining that he is in a disability program and, per Social Security rules, he cannot continue to receive benefits unless he remains a part-time student. If he attends full-time, he would lose his "...medication, insurance, and check...".
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  #10  
Old 11-26-2018, 10:02 PM
Titchou Titchou is offline
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But we don't know who told him no part time students. Perhaps it was one brother in one particular house. That's why we are encouraging talking with Greek Life.
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  #11  
Old 11-26-2018, 10:29 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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According to this, it is not that you are only “allowed” to go part time, rather if you have the faculties to carry a full credit load, your case will be reevaluated as to whether you should remain eligible.

https://www.collegeraptor.com/paying...lege-students/

Also, when you speak of the “determination” to become Greek, it kind of seems to me that you are missing the point of what fraternities and sororities are about. It’s not a reward that you get for hard work or by beating out anyone else. It is a bond of friendship.
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  #12  
Old 11-27-2018, 02:02 AM
SoCalGirl SoCalGirl is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnnie5 View Post
I am sorry everyone. I am not Greek. I have a question about Greek life and the rules that are supposed to stand as of today with your organizations. The question arose that only full time students are allowed membership into frats and sororities. Not to sound rude or anything but the responses to that question are pretty lame and I think much outdated. The only response to someone asking if part time students can join is that they "just can't"? Ridiculous. Is change a part of these organizations or are we still living in the past even pay n 2018? Here's my question, before I start pointing fingers, is whole bordering on discrimination, if a part time students works just as hard as a full time students to go to school and achieve academic success, is there success less in the eyes of someone who went full time? I think not. And this where I have the problem. Some part time students are going to school part time because of disabilities. If you are familiar with the disability programs with social security then you would know that they only allow you to go part time. That does not mean that that person still doesn't have a family tradition or dream of becoming Greek that seems to be shattered all because of one mere class. At the risk of losing their medication, insurance, and check that sustains them just as anyone else who works doesn't seem to be a requirement to join an organization that is SUPPOSED to be about uplifting individuals. Most of the people who are part time are already secure in the financial obligations with school and life. There are people who are Greek and went to school full time that don't give a. Damn about what other are doing and are doing farvworst. Now to me , those already secure are the type of people I would want in my organization. Not the latter. The will and determination to successfully become Greek is not an factor. How can this be overlooked? Are you saying that your education is better than mine? Are you saying that you are more capable of doing something than I am because your full time? Let's get off our high horses and start doing some work and addendums to outdated policies. It's 2018 not 1900. It's downright sickening and I am almost ashamed of everyone who believes in discriminating one group feom another.

Some of the phrasing here makes me think the OP is meaning NPHC specifically. Regardless though, if you can't pledge while in school you can always pursue Grad / Alum Initiation if the group you're seeking to join has it as an option.
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