Taking the RAP for your Sorors/Frats

Let's say that there is a situation where your organization is pledging a line. You are a BIG Bro or BIG Sis and a couple of the other Big Bros or BIG sis go out (without notifying you) and do a little HARD hazing. The situation gets out and goes public. Now, you don't want to loose your right to be in your organization. So do you go against the wrong doers of your org. or do you stick by their side? ****REMEMBER**** this is your bor or sis of the organization that you love so much. Give some insight!!!

[LXAAlum]

I would report it - I would not stick by their side, for if they are hazing, they are not acting as true members of the organization. They are consciously choosing to violate their oath and obligation of membership in their order. This would be very hard to do, but, like my signature line says...

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Don't be your brother's keeper; rather, be your brother's Brother.

If i felt it was hazing and i knew about the incident, I would like to think I would report it.

By not speaking up when you know a problem exists makes you part of the problem. If you know a hazing has occured and you turn the other cheek, you are not helping your chapter. If you don't step forward, you are in essense condoning the action.

Do remeber - reporting or "ratting" on a few brothers or sisters may mean you lose them as brothers and sisters - keeping quiet, you may lose your charter and very well your membership - not to mention if left unchecked you might lose a brother or sister's life. -- Which is better for your brother/sisterhood?

[Tigger]

definitely stand up for what you believe in. And that is respecting your sorority or fraternity (not to mention the members). If they went against something that you all decided you wouldn't do, and it caused a conflict for your sorority or fraternity then they were not acting out of respect.

just because they are your "family" doesn't mean you don't follow your beliefs. Maybe not jumping up to point the finger ASAP, but if you are put in the situation where it's speak or disban, then I believe speaking up is good. If you are not in a dire situation, then I would only respond negatively about your sis or bro if asked.

[charlotte]

We just went through a situation identical to that. One of our sisters was picking on individual pledges and hard-core hazing them. We had absolutely no clue this was going on until the entire pledge class came to me (being the pledge educator) with a written, formal complaint and the decision that the entire pledge class was going to quit. Did we stand up for our sister or the pledges? The pledges, without a doubt. What our sister had done was very wrong and malicious, directed at just a few pledges she deemed "unworthy." The pledges stayed, and (after the judgement of the intergreek council and Head of Greek Affairs) the perpetrator was made to leave the sorority. Was this hard on us? You bet it was. But, overall, it was the best thing. What she did was very wrong, and not an action of a sister. The greeks in the other organizations respected us much more after dealing with this swiftly... they knew we weren't pushovers. This obviously caused hardships between the greeks and this girl, but sometimes you have to sacrifice the friendship of one for the well-being and friendship of many others.

Originally posted by charlotte:
We just went through a situation identical to that. One of our sisters was picking on individual pledges and hard-core hazing them. We had absolutely no clue this was going on until the entire pledge class came to me (being the pledge educator) with a written, formal complaint and the decision that the entire pledge class was going to quit. Did we stand up for our sister or the pledges? The pledges, without a doubt. What our sister had done was very wrong and malicious, directed at just a few pledges she deemed "unworthy." The pledges stayed, and (after the judgement of the intergreek council and Head of Greek Affairs) the perpetrator was made to leave the sorority. Was this hard on us? You bet it was. But, overall, it was the best thing. What she did was very wrong, and not an action of a sister. The greeks in the other organizations respected us much more after dealing with this swiftly... they knew we weren't pushovers. This obviously caused hardships between the greeks and this girl, but sometimes you have to sacrifice the friendship of one for the well-being and friendship of many others.

Good for you! I belive what you did was right and in the best intrest of the organization as a whole. This will no doubt have a lasting effect on your chapter (positive). As far as reporting, I would in a heartbeat. If I've seen it onece.....hazing does nothing but make people bitter and want to do it to someone else. It needs to stop.

Wait a minute! I can't believe what I just read! Your pledges told you that the "pledge director" was hazing them and you and your soror's kicked her out? Wow! Was there and investigation done by the chapter first before you took those allegations to your HQ? How long were they into the process before the pledges decided to report "hazing" to you?

I guess what I'm getting at is there was no other way in which your former soror could have been punished for her actions? Did you guys consider firing her or relieving her of her duties and possibly fining her?

I would never dime a brother out in as far as having him removed from my frat. Yes we have fired and suspended an individual under similar circumstances and he has learned a lot from that experience. But we never thought about having him kicked out. That's unneccesary!

[Alumnus who cares]

No, she said that she (Charlotte) was the pledge educator and one of her other sisters was picking on individual pledges, and that the pledge class came to Charlotte with the formal complaint because she was the pledge educator. She didn't say anything about what position the sister who was doing the hazing held.

[Alumnus who cares]

However, I do have to agree with Dirtyharry that kicking the girl out of the house was pretty harsh. There are many other less severe ways to deal with the problem.

[babyface1914]

This situation has a bglo twist too it from how it sounds. the fact of the matter is is that if you pledged and you know wuts going on with a 'line' on campus, but u didn't 'see' them yet, you still take the rap as a chapter. not unless deans and adps plan on taking in. this is my assumption. is the original righter apart of the nphc.

[charlotte]

Note: We are a local sorority, so we do not have a national office to contact to help deal with this. We do not have a house; we all live in seperate apartments, dorm rooms... your basic college housing. So, obviously none of this was right under our noses for us to ignore. Incidents took place between classes, off campus, in the middle of the night... whenever she saw fit to "deal with" the pledges.
This girl had also been reprimanded numerous times for being to harsh to the pledges during the meetings. We can't, though, control and watch the every move of a sister who lives twenty miles away... who would have thought she would drive back to campus "just for fun?"
She had also had her position stripped and sorority privledges taken away for other, non-related actions earlier in the year. So, who do you believe? A group of pledges you are beginning to know, or a sister who has proven herself as trouble from day one? Should we have just given her yet another slap on the wrist and hope that she doesn't do it again? Or do we deal with the problems swiftly and move on? The pledges were only halfway through their pledging period... chances are the personal hazing would have only gotten worse as initiation grew closer!
And, with the severity of the allegations, the Head of Greek Affairs gave the organization an ultimatum... her membership or the sorority charter. Hmm... her or the sorority... that should not be too difficult a choice for anyone.

[SilverTurtle]

It sounds to me like charlotte's chapter did the right thing, especially based on the sister's history. I'm sure it was difficult for the active sisters to make that decision, but if I was given that ultimatum (one member or the entire chapter), I know what I would have to choose in those circumstances. And I'm sure most of us would make the same decision.

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SilverTurtle@greekchat.com
Phi Beta Fraternity
Phi chapter

Dirty Harry
I'm really wondering why you would say that you would stand beside the wrong doer. So are you saying that you would wait until s*#t got heated to say something. I believe in a little something something but not HARD hazing. That's just bull*#@&. I would nip it right in the bud!!! C'mon!!!

[mgdzkm433]

If it is asking them to run arends and little things, it was kinda harsh but anytime anyone hazes, they take a chance of getting caught. If it was severe, then she deserved it totally. There should be a "NO TOLERANCE" policy for every organization. I commend you for taking swift action. It's just like under age drinking. One beer might not be a whole lot, but the punishment is still severe whether you drink one or 12. Letting the girl get away with the hazing would have been disasterous. Not only would they have lost the whole pledge class, but they would have lost stature on campus and possibly the whole chapter. Letting one person get away with hazing means that more might get away with it. . .and that is just flat out wrong.

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Mikki Gates
Delta Zeta Alum
Kappa Mu Chapter
Sigma Alpha Iota Alum
Eta Tau Chapter

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(Steel Magnolias)

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NO, NO SATIN! DON'T MISCONSTRUE THE INTENT OF MY LAST MESSAGE. IF THERE ARE OR ANY FORMER DEAN'S OUT THERE, I'M QUITE SURE THEY WILL FEEL ME ON THIS.

FIRST, IF YOU'RE THE DP OR EVEN THE ADP, YOU DON'T LET NOONE GET WITH YOUR LINE UNLESS YOU AS THE DEAN SAYS SO. IT IS IMPORTANT THE PLEDGES UNDERSTAND THIS AS WELL FOR THEIR OWN SAFETY. SECONDLY, IT IS IMPORTANT THAT THE DP OR ADP HAVE CONTROL OVER "SESSIONS" IN ORDER TO COOL OFF OR REMOVE THOSE WHO RISK YOUR CHAPTER. DON'T GET ME WRONG THERE'S ONE IN EVERY "SESSION", BUT IT'S UP TO THE DP AND ADP AS WELL AS THE BB'S AND BS'S TO DEAL WITH THAT BRO/SOROR.

I GUESS MY ISSUE WITH THE WHOLE CHARLOTTE THING IS, IF YOU HAD PLEDGES WHO HAD BEEN ON FOR A NUMBER OF WEEKS (HALF WAY THROUGH), WHY ARE THEY STILL OPENING THE DOOR TO THOSE OTHER THAN THE DEAN, LET ALONE SOMEONE WHO IS SUPPOSEDLY HAZING THEM? I UNDERSTAND THE CHAPTER DID ALL IT CAN TO PUNISH HER, BUT IF SHE WAS A PROBLEM SINCE DAY ONE, THEN THE CHAPTER SHOULD HAVE DROPPED HER ON DAY ONE. IF YOU GUYS WERE TIGHT DURING YOUR PROCESS THEN SHE WOULDN'T SELL YOUR CHAPTER OUT, NOR WOULD YOU GUYS SELL HER OUT.


I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOUR ORG. BUT MOST MEMBERSHIPS ARE FOR LIFE. THERE ISN'T ANY EXPULSIONS AT THE REQUEST OF THE CHAPTER.
UNFORTUNATELY THAT GIRL PLACED YOUR CHAPTER IN A BAD PREDICAMENT WITH THE UNIV. HOPEFULLY SHE HAS BEEN REMOVED FROM THE SITUATION.