What do you consider "fat?" - Page 2

James · #16 12-07-2001, 01:18 PM

What an awesome topic for a guy to touch on . . . I wasn't going to comment . . . but what the hell.

First: weight is not the most important factor. As Aephi Alum said, fat percentage can give a more accurate picture, and even that can be misleading because some people's frames/genetic distribution will allow some to carry more fat and not be noticeable and some can have relatively low percentages and still look pudgy as hell.

For example: There are guys with 15 percent body fat (by caliper) that have visible abs, but most guys need to be under 10 percent. I won't show abs if I let my body fat get to be 12 or 13 percent.

Ok the real tests are: How do you think you look in clothes and how do you think you look naked. There should be congruencey between the two self images in regards to fat.

These are tests of self image.

If you are unable to wear what you want, or feel at a disadvantage socially because of extra body fat- then you are fat to yourself.

Same with taking off the clothes that you bought to disguise the extra body fat. If you can visibly see sagging flesh and cellulite, and it bothers you, then you are fat to yourself.

I am also talking in cases where you don't have a serious body-image problem.

Now I realize that much of this is going to be socially influenced, but oh well, unhappy is unhappy, dissatisfied is dissatisfied.

In a perfect world we wouldn't care about this stuff. In this world we do.

I'll tell you a secret, its much easier to lose unwanted body fat, than it is to totally reconstruct your unconscious to be non-reponsive to social norms, and less expensive and time consuming than getting that much therapy.

So lose it rather than complain, hide, or rationalize it.

Twinstars, actually the opposite is true, men are more conscious of a girl's appearance in terms of body size than you might believe. Its a frequent topic of discussion and commentary. Although I don't think we are maliscious about it, just observing.

And the more socially savvy the guy is, the more he is likely to hold body appearance as a factor in dating potential.

Just keeping it real folks . . .

#17 12-07-2001, 02:09 PM

Dealing with this issue being a girl, my friends and I had an discussion about the following one night (in a hot tub wile they had on bikini's and I was in my racing speedo, ha ha)

Who do you think puts more pressure on females to be more thin or "ideal", Males or Females?

I personal feel females put more pressure on themselves and others. If you go to a party, walk to class or out in general, I find its females who more look you up and down, and whisper about appearances and stuff. Its women who write articles in mags saying what we should wear, look like and etc. Yes, guys do play a role, but I dont feel they are the major source of it.

LexiKD · #18 12-07-2001, 02:10 PM

Hey Tibi what are you trying to say...like my comment huh, trying to say I'm chubby are you....yeah, well I started school in 96, I have grown a wee since then, up and a little out....don't make me come to Greenville...

Wait until you move in the house, Ms Murt(sp) will have you thickened up alright...

MoxieGrrl · #19 12-07-2001, 09:51 PM

Might I add, screw what men think about our bodies. Because last time I checked, they weren't beating themselves up because they don't look like Brad Pitt.

volgirl2376 · #20 12-07-2001, 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MoxieGrrl
last time I checked, they weren't beating themselves up because they don't look like Brad Pitt.

I am not being a smart ass at all when I say...that has to be the most profound statement I have ever heard. You made me feel better about a lot of things

James · #21 12-07-2001, 10:16 PM

A higher percentage of men train as opposed to women in the US.

Quote:

Originally posted by volgirl2376

I am not being a smart ass at all when I say...that has to be the most profound statement I have ever heard. You made me feel better about a lot of things

James · #22 12-07-2001, 10:20 PM

This is actually true from my experiences. You women can be terrible to each other, I am almost surprised that women can be sincere friends with each other without secretly worrying what the other one might be thinking or saying.

And women tend to be way more specifically critical of another woman's attire, weight, and looks than I have ever heard another man be.

But perhaps those of you on the site have different experiences and find that most if not all the women you know are supportive and kind to each other in public and private. Even if in competitive environments.

Quote:

Originally posted by UMgirl
Dealing with this issue being a girl, my friends and I had an discussion about the following one night (in a hot tub wile they had on bikini's and I was in my racing speedo, ha ha)

Who do you think puts more pressure on females to be more thin or "ideal", Males or Females?

I personal feel females put more pressure on themselves and others. If you go to a party, walk to class or out in general, I find its females who more look you up and down, and whisper about appearances and stuff. Its women who write articles in mags saying what we should wear, look like and etc. Yes, guys do play a role, but I dont feel they are the major source of it.

volgirl2376 · #23 12-07-2001, 10:23 PM

Its all attitude. I have had friends who are worried about stupid stuff like eating a big meal before a formal....just to make sure they fit in the dress...or worry about their appearance bc they want a guy to like their body...guys on the other hand, or guys i know....sit at the table and feed their face, belch, do whatever..and expect to impress a girl.
Bottom line, yeah maybe guys work out more. But I dont think that statistic includes all the girls who work out for hours in their own home.

MoxieGrrl · #24 12-07-2001, 10:42 PM

I think that most guys and girls train differently...yes, there are exceptions. Guys are in the weight room, and girls are in the exercise machine room... I hardly ever see a cross-over.

James: With what you were saying about women may be nicer in private or public...well, the backbiting stereotype is way too often true! Women are the first to comment on a weight gain, but the first to say that you are ridiculous for dieting. We just can't win everyone over, I guess....

G8Ralphaxi · #25 12-08-2001, 12:25 AM

I think the key is definitely being "fit" more than "not fat"

Everyone knows a girl who never works out, eats junk food all the time, and is still not "fat" - but isn't in shape either. My roommate calls this being a "skinny fat girl." Maybe she's a size 4 but that's more due to being petite and she has no muscle tone at all. When she is in her 40s, she's gonna be screwed!

I was a real gym bunny 2 summers ago - went several days a week, ran, yoga, weight training, etc. LOVED IT. Had so much energy all the time, great muscle tone. Ladies, I HIGHLY recommend weight training - you don't get all bulky (it's nearly impossible without drastic diet changes and mega-intense training), you just end up with nice definition everywhere. Marilyn Monroe used to train with weights and she definitively did NOT look the least bit masculine.

Then I messed up my knees - tendonitis is NOT FUN, people!

Then they got better and I started working out again, yeah!

Then I got in a car wreck. NOT FUN! I killed my poor car. RIP Roxy the Giant red Oldsmobile (1990 Royal Brougham 4 door - the Ruby Limousine!) I also did a number on my neck and back. Good thing I wasn't in a Geo, right?

So anyway, I'm just now in the last couple months being able to get running, etc. again without pain. It just sucks to feel like a little old lady at 23.

The ironic thing is, I actually lost weight from not working out. I stayed the same size but lost all my nice muscle tone.

Since muscle weighs more, without it I weigh less. I'm slowly starting to get some back but it's slow.

I know I'm really lucky though, because I'm tall. Being a size 6 at 5'8" is slender - at 5'2" it can look pudgy on some figures. I can cheat.

Next summer though, when I'm home and have time and money (woo! got a job! yeah!), I'll be back at that gym...just very careful with my knees.

well, the point of this long-rambling-history-of-my-life post was that a girl who is physically fit and has some natural "curves" to her will always look better than the little scrawny girls - the "skinny fat girls."

SilverTurtle · #26 12-08-2001, 10:45 AM

I think I pretty much agree with everything that's being said (at least that I remember being said

).

A friend at work & myself were having a similar conversation last week because there was an article (I think it was in People) about "Fat Women" who were mad about the movie Shallow Hal. Now, I haven't seen the movie, so I can't really comment on that aspect. But these women looked in great shape to me, they just had fuller-figured bodies (by that I mean hips and boobs) and they were tall (I would guess close to 5'10"). One of them even said she works out with a personal trainer at least 3 times a week.

My friend (who is petit, but also works out regularly) & I were both commenting on how it's all about how in shape you are. So, since so many of us seem to be enlightened with this thinking, why is it such an issue? I mean, why are girls/women always so concerned about it?

I will admit, I could stand to work out more often than I do, I just have a hard time finding the time for it on a daily basis. (But a couple times a week isn't horrible, either)

James- I have to comment on guys caring about a girls' appearance. This is natural, to want to date someone you think is hot, or at least very attractive. But I have seen some not-so-fabulous looking guys who can be brutal

..what's the deal with this? And it's no secret that men can "get away" with being less-than-in-shape a lot more than women. It's just a bizarre double standard.

Oh- and I'm interested in your comment that guys train more. Is this an actual statistic, or an observation? I recall when I went to the gym while in school, it was usually about 85-90% females working out. Maybe it was the time of day, or maybe just that more women attended the school that men, I don't really know. But now I work out much more than my boyfriend.. and that's just walking or doing stuff at home. I know someone mentioned that women can work out, but aren't necessarily at the gym.

Anyways- I know that sounded like I was attacking you, James, but really I just thought you made some interesting points/comments and wanted to respond.

shultzz · #27 12-11-2001, 03:41 PM

I dont think my girlfriend Brittany Spears is fat, but I think she is starting to collect a little junk in the trunk.. If she wants me to continue buying her CDs she better get on a treadmill..

James · #28 12-18-2001, 08:09 PM

Hmmm . . . It was my understanding that it is generally understood that more men train, do organized sports, unorganized sports (regular game play with friends), etc than women. But what is generally understood is not always true. So I'm not sure if men in general do more physical activity than women. Surveying the mebership in a gym may be misleading. In our school gym there is more women in the one complex that is heavy on machines and cardio eqipment, but ther eis more men in the free weight section in another building.

There are a lot more male members in the outside gym I belong to.

I couldn't find a statistic one way or another so I'll keep looking.

Quote:

Originally posted by G8Ralphaxi
I think the key is definitely being "fit" more than "not fat"

Everyone knows a girl who never works out, eats junk food all the time, and is still not "fat" - but isn't in shape either. My roommate calls this being a "skinny fat girl." Maybe she's a size 4 but that's more due to being petite and she has no muscle tone at all. When she is in her 40s, she's gonna be screwed!

I was a real gym bunny 2 summers ago - went several days a week, ran, yoga, weight training, etc. LOVED IT. Had so much energy all the time, great muscle tone. Ladies, I HIGHLY recommend weight training - you don't get all bulky (it's nearly impossible without drastic diet changes and mega-intense training), you just end up with nice definition everywhere. Marilyn Monroe used to train with weights and she definitively did NOT look the least bit masculine.

Then I messed up my knees - tendonitis is NOT FUN, people!

Then they got better and I started working out again, yeah!

Then I got in a car wreck. NOT FUN! I killed my poor car. RIP Roxy the Giant red Oldsmobile (1990 Royal Brougham 4 door - the Ruby Limousine!) I also did a number on my neck and back. Good thing I wasn't in a Geo, right?

So anyway, I'm just now in the last couple months being able to get running, etc. again without pain. It just sucks to feel like a little old lady at 23.

The ironic thing is, I actually lost weight from not working out. I stayed the same size but lost all my nice muscle tone. Since muscle weighs more, without it I weigh less. I'm slowly starting to get some back but it's slow.

I know I'm really lucky though, because I'm tall. Being a size 6 at 5'8" is slender - at 5'2" it can look pudgy on some figures. I can cheat.

Next summer though, when I'm home and have time and money (woo! got a job! yeah!), I'll be back at that gym...just very careful with my knees.

well, the point of this long-rambling-history-of-my-life post was that a girl who is physically fit and has some natural "curves" to her will always look better than the little scrawny girls - the "skinny fat girls."

Eirene_DGP · #29 12-18-2001, 08:29 PM

Well I must say that body tone must be a factor too. My weight is what most skinny females would consider fat, but I have a really nice shape. I have really muscular arms and legs. I love to work out. If you are skinny with little muscle tone that is NOT cute.

wishinhopin · #30 12-19-2001, 04:46 AM

I think it's admirable that people have such liberal views regarding weight here, but in real life I don't think it plays out quite like that. I would consider myself overweight- not horribly so, but I definitely need to trim down. And even though I can look in the mirror and know that I have a gorgeous face, and the hourglass, t & a figure that some people actually want, when I go out it's different. I have gone to frat parties, and hung out with the sweetest, nicest guys, but when the evening comes to a close, I'm not the one that they want to be with. It's even more irritating when I go out with my roomate, who is (and I'm being honest here, I love her to death but this is the truth) not nearly as kind, sweet, funny, smart, or attractive as me, but she has a better body, and guys go for her. When it comes down to basic, primal attraction, I haven't met very many guys who would pick a great sense of humor over a flat stomach. And girls aren't always that much better. It's wierd to go out and get recieved either as a non-threat, or else as someone not worth talking to just because you don't fit into a size six. I know this sounds really bitter but I've spent alot of time thinking about this and trying to figure out what is really going on- and please don't say it's only about confidence or how you carry yourself because we all know that it's more than that. Or maybe less, depending on how you look at it.