Coat of Arms vs. Crest

[DrPhil]

At least he didn't deny being Tom this time.

[SWTXBelle]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

At least he didn't deny being Tom this time.

Progress?

[exlurker]

People who are interested in GLO heraldry might want to be on the lookout for an old used copy of Emily Butterfield's College Fraternity Heraldry.

It includes heraldic descriptions of GLO armorial bearings, black and white pictures (like line drawings), discussion / definition of terms, and on and on. It also mentions and sometimes briefly describes "coats of arms," "crests," whatever you want to call them, that aren't, strictly speaking, correct by heraldic standards.

The book (a paperback, at least the one I have) obviously is not up-to-date -- it was published in the 1930s, I think -- but is still interesting.

And yes, this is THE Emily Butterfield who was, among many other things, one of the founders of Alpha Gamma Delta.

See Michigan Women's Hall of Fame entry at (gasp):

http://hall.michiganwomenshalloffame...95~216~166~187

[pshsx1]

Although we call it a crest when talking about the coat of arms, we know there's a crest, a shield, and a scroll. We have a whole section of our by laws detailing publications and insignia so I've never heard of any confusion.

[chopperdude]

from the lca pedagogus in a shorter verson.
the crest is made up of many parts.
1 crest is usually a decoration of the/for the helment to protect against sabre cuts.
2.helemt if used were hung above their sheilds..
3 mantling were hung ariund the sheild. mantlings were their robes.

while with the lca coat of arms there are many other parts, these are the basics. i had forgoten much of it. glad someone brought this up so i could go back and study up on it.
thang goodness for turkey day break from classes and read something more fun.

[pshsx1]

Also, I know our coat of arms was changed one time because the original design was not correct by heraldic standards.

[agzg]

Originally Posted by exlurker

And yes, this is THE Emily Butterfield who was, among many other things, one of the founders of Alpha Gamma Delta.

I don't question whether we have the right heraldry as far as our Armorial Bearings - she was indeed the creator of much of it.

I do, however, know that many members use crest, armorial bearings, etc. interchangeably. It doesn't bother me.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by agzg

I don't question whether we have the right heraldry as far as our Armorial Bearings - she was indeed the creator of much of it.

I do, however, know that many members use crest, armorial bearings, etc. interchangeably. It doesn't bother me.

But all of our official documents refer to the armorial bearings.

Emily was such an interesting woman. I would have loved to have known her. I went to the Michigan Women's Hall of Fame when it first opened the exhibit about her and on the year of Alpha Gam's centennial our International President put a medallion on her grave, which I also attended. She was also a painter and many of her paintings are displayed at the Alpha Beta chapter house at the University of Michigan, as well as at our IHQ. Yes, there are no doubts that our armorial bearings are correct regarding heraldry! She assisted several other GLOs in adjusting theirs to be correct as well. Fascinating woman.

[UofM-TKE]

Originally Posted by AGDee

Emily was such an interesting woman. I would have loved to have known her. I went to the Michigan Women's Hall of Fame when it first opened the exhibit about her and on the year of Alpha Gam's centennial our International President put a medallion on her grave, which I also attended. She was also a painter and many of her paintings are displayed at the Alpha Beta chapter house at the University of Michigan, as well as at our IHQ. Yes, there are no doubts that our armorial bearings are correct regarding heraldry! She assisted several other GLOs in adjusting theirs to be correct as well. Fascinating woman.

The TKE National site has this note about the Coat of Arms (not crest):

The TKE Coat-of-Arms ....
Modified slightly several times during the early years of Tau Kappa Epsilon, the present Coat-of-Arms, adopted in 1926, was designed by Dr. Carlton B. Pierce and Ms. Emily Butterfield.

[AGDee]

Originally Posted by UofM-TKE

The TKE National site has this note about the Coat of Arms (not crest):

The TKE Coat-of-Arms ....
Modified slightly several times during the early years of Tau Kappa Epsilon, the present Coat-of-Arms, adopted in 1926, was designed by Dr. Carlton B. Pierce and Ms. Emily Butterfield.

I thought TKE was one of them, but I wasn't positive. Now I can tell my dad about that "You know Dad, one of our founders helped to design your Coat-of-Arms!"

[pshsx1]

For a long time, however, Sigma Phi Epsilon displayed a coat of arms which was not heraldically correct. The original design was adopted in 1908 at the Chicago Conclave... In 1933, Mark D. Wilkins, Oklahoma State ’30,then a Field Secretary for the Fraternity, consulted Arthur E. DuBois, in charge of the heraldic work of the United States Government, and the new and revised coat of arms was subsequently accepted.

Anyone else have theirs corrected by DuBois?

[naraht]

Our original Coat of Arms was somewhat different than today.

Original


Current


Note, I'm not sure if the original actually was black and white or not, still investigating.

Also, for the current one, *sometimes* the drops in the squares in the upper left part of the shield are two over one rather than one over two (so they are like the Original)...

[Gusteau]

The two over one/one over two discrepency is interesting naraht - does APO specify which is correct today?

Also, I'm on an epic quest to find Butterfield's College Fraternity Heraldry via interlibrary loan so if anyone knows if their library has it I would really appreciate the tip - thanks!

[DUKyleXY]

Delta Upsilon's Coat of Arms is set forth in the Laws of the Fraternity and are thoroughly blazoned. There is generally little confusion of terms because our membership manual devotes an entire appendix to Heraldry and Insignia. The blazon is listed on the fraternity's Wiki-article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_Upsilon

The coloring on the wiki-article image is off, the best version is from the DU Educational Foundation website:

[naraht]

Originally Posted by Gusteau

The two over one/one over two discrepency is interesting naraht - does APO specify which is correct today?

Also, I'm on an epic quest to find Butterfield's College Fraternity Heraldry via interlibrary loan so if anyone knows if their library has it I would really appreciate the tip - thanks!

Not in so many words. They show the image with one over two as the correct coat of arms, but... The old one was two over one and occasionally you'll find in various places two over one. The Fraternity used to sell blankets with the Coat of Arms and the Key and on *that* it was two over one. Also, at least when I was at our National Office 15 years ago, the plaster casting of the coat of arms beside the front door was two over one... I need to get access to some of the older fraternity magazines after the change from old to new.

Also, both two over one and one over two would fulfill the description of the meaning of that fraternal element in the ritual.

As for Butterfield's book, Google has snippets at http://books.google.com/books?id=SlpDAAAAIAAJ and worldcat shows Libraries that say they have it at http://www.worldcat.org/oclc/774775