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  #16  
Old 01-30-2018, 01:40 PM
clemsongirl clemsongirl is offline
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Originally Posted by navane View Post
At the campus I used to advise at, the PNMs would register online using the ICS Recruiter system. Panhellenic uses that automated system to generate PNM groups, party schedules, etc. The individual chapters use the system to input their invite lists and such. The PNM lists that are sent to the chapters by Panhellenic include "flags" for women who are legacies for that organization. In other words, if a PNM marked that she is a Gamma Phi Beta legacy on her registration form, that "flag" will show up next to her name in the list that is sent to us. We did not receive flags for legacy status at other sororities. I can't remember if it was possible for us to manually key in a legacy flag from the chapter's end or not. I believe it is; but, I am not 100% sure.
On the campus end, we could see all flags that the legacies had put in, including not only for chapters not on campus but for fraternities as well. You'd see a woman flagged as "Alpha Delta Pi legacy, Delta Zeta legacy, Sigma Phi Epsilon legacy". That always gave me a good chuckle-I was glad PNMs put their family relations down as members of other GLOs, but it was a little more than they needed.

Last edited by clemsongirl; 01-30-2018 at 02:14 PM.
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  #17  
Old 01-30-2018, 02:05 PM
ForeverRoses ForeverRoses is online now
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Originally Posted by OldFLDDD View Post
ForeverRoses, when you say "not treated as a legacy in the system", what exactly do you mean by that? I'm confused now. The Tri Deltas will obviously know her status but that would be from the recs they'll receive ahead of time. And I guess there is some disagreement on whether or not it's good for the other houses to know where she's a legacy. I think some of this also comes down to how much of a "hot commodity" she is. I predict that she'll have a successful rush, but she's not going to be the girl everyone is going nuts over. I like to think that she'd be that, but I'm a realist!
What I mean is that we don't always get recommendations from the sister or Mom/Grandma telling us that they have a legacy going through. If we don't, but they put it down in ICS, then we can verify from that and treat them as legacies. Now if a mistake happens (such as if we accidentally release someone that is a legacy after open house rounds), if they have not registered in ICS as a legacy then we cannot "fix" a mistake. If they are in ICS as a legacy, Panhellenic has allowed us to invite them back.
There have been times when we get a recommendation, but it doesn't tell us that they are a legacy when they are. The PNM doesn't put it in ICS and then they are released. We then get angry phone calls/emails from Moms/Sisters/Grandmas about why we released their snowflake. In those cases, Panhellenic will not allow us to invite them back since they did not self-identify as a legacy.

I have also seen when women don't list themselves as a legacy. Then we get a legacy recommendation form for them, but it isn't marked in ICS. Then women in the chapter question their intentions in later rounds when they come back telling us how much they love our chapter and how they are a legacy.

As for ICS, we only get a legacy list for our chapter, not for all the other chapters. However if I go into each individual profile, I can see if they listed any other chapters.
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  #18  
Old 01-30-2018, 06:12 PM
FSUZeta FSUZeta is offline
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Panhellenic cannot dictate membership selection.
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  #19  
Old 01-30-2018, 06:13 PM
IowaPiPhi IowaPiPhi is offline
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Originally Posted by ForeverRoses View Post
I have also seen when women don't list themselves as a legacy. Then we get a legacy recommendation form for them, but it isn't marked in ICS. Then women in the chapter question their intentions in later rounds when they come back telling us how much they love our chapter and how they are a legacy.

As for ICS, we only get a legacy list for our chapter, not for all the other chapters. However if I go into each individual profile, I can see if they listed any other chapters.
ForeverRoses, I am reading this thread with great interest. As you know, my daughter just finished Recruitment. She was fortunate to have essentially full party cards (including 4 chapters that she adored) to the end, Preffed 2 of them, and accepted a bid to what became her top choice, her legacy chapter. She did, however, lose many chapters early on that she really would have liked to have gotten to know better. I know there are deep cuts early and it is very competitive. It is hard to know if her legacy status played a part in her not being asked back, or not. I have wondered about it as I have another daughter in high school. It very likely could be that they just didn't click or it came down to sheer numbers. I'm just grateful it worked out for her and that either bid would have been a very welcome sight. It was a rough 2 weeks!
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  #20  
Old 01-30-2018, 06:52 PM
carnation carnation is offline
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I feel that the new release figures have made it tougher on legacies, who are often dropped by their non-legacy chapters because the members don't want to "waste" a spot on someone who will suuuurely be pledging their legacy chapter. This has played out several times for local girls.

One of my nieces, who would have been quite in demand at her medium-sized school had she not been an in-house legacy, was left with 2 choices after first parties. I felt for her until bids came out! What if her legacy group had cut her? And I have seen this happen to girls who had a sitting sister in the house.
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  #21  
Old 01-30-2018, 08:09 PM
IowaPiPhi IowaPiPhi is offline
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Originally Posted by carnation View Post
I feel that the new release figures have made it tougher on legacies, who are often dropped by their non-legacy chapters because the members don't want to "waste" a spot on someone who will suuuurely be pledging their legacy chapter. This has played out several times for local girls.

One of my nieces, who would have been quite in demand at her medium-sized school had she not been an in-house legacy, was left with 2 choices after first parties. I felt for her until bids came out! What if her legacy group had cut her? And I have seen this happen to girls who had a sitting sister in the house.
My daughter's roommate also got cut from many houses off the bat, and I was shocked. Not only is she a stunning beauty, down to earth, and a Kelley school business major, but has a quick-witted, hilarious personality. She was also a legacy of a 'top tier' sorority that, apparently, tends to take out of state girls, which she is not. She wound up dropping out of Recruitment after they and all but 2 chapters, with whom she did not click, cut her. She may try again next year now that she has friends in many chapters, but my heart breaks for her. I don't think she was given a fair chance.
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  #22  
Old 01-30-2018, 08:19 PM
IowaPiPhi IowaPiPhi is offline
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Originally Posted by carnation View Post
I feel that the new release figures have made it tougher on legacies, who are often dropped by their non-legacy chapters because the members don't want to "waste" a spot on someone who will suuuurely be pledging their legacy chapter. This has played out several times for local girls.

One of my nieces, who would have been quite in demand at her medium-sized school had she not been an in-house legacy, was left with 2 choices after first parties. I felt for her until bids came out! What if her legacy group had cut her? And I have seen this happen to girls who had a sitting sister in the house.
My daughter's roommate also got cut from many houses off the bat, and I was shocked. Not only is she a stunning beauty, down to earth, and a Kelley school business major, but has a quick-witted, hilarious personality. She was also a legacy of a 'top tier' sorority that, apparently, tends to take out of state girls, which she is not. She wound up dropping out of Recruitment after they and all but 2 chapters, with whom she did not click, cut her. She may try again next year now that she has friends in many chapters, but my heart breaks for her. I don't think she was given a fair chance.
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  #23  
Old 01-30-2018, 09:57 PM
clemsongirl clemsongirl is offline
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We're all just sharing anecdotes, but I will say that in my chapter at no point did we ever discuss the legacy status of a PNM who was a legacy to a different house. It didn't even come up, even if we knew a PNM had a sister in a different house. I guess different chapters have different priorities on how to make cuts.

We did have a PNM who was up to be released after the first round, and someone realized she had a sister who was an active member at a nearby chapter and thus a legacy we weren't allowed to release. Why that sister didn't submit information for her or the PNM didn't mention it I'll never know, but I'm glad someone said something!
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  #24  
Old 01-31-2018, 10:51 AM
ForeverRoses ForeverRoses is online now
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Originally Posted by IowaPiPhi View Post
My daughter's roommate also got cut from many houses off the bat, and I was shocked. Not only is she a stunning beauty, down to earth, and a Kelley school business major, but has a quick-witted, hilarious personality. She was also a legacy of a 'top tier' sorority that, apparently, tends to take out of state girls, which she is not. She wound up dropping out of Recruitment after they and all but 2 chapters, with whom she did not click, cut her. She may try again next year now that she has friends in many chapters, but my heart breaks for her. I don't think she was given a fair chance.
I don't know all groups, but I can tell you if we released her it WAS NOT because she was a legacy somewhere else. (Unless she specifically said "I only want to be a XYZ because I'm a legacy there").

As I tried to explain to someone, it's not that a chapter didn't like you, it's just that they liked other people more. And heavy cuts do turn it into a numbers game.
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  #25  
Old 01-31-2018, 01:26 PM
OldFLDDD OldFLDDD is offline
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Thank you to everyone who has weighed in so far, although I will admit I'm still not completely clear on how we'll handle it. Anything coming up in conversation will be easy for her to manage, but it's all about do we want the other houses to know she's a legacy and potentially release her thinking she'd want to go to her legacy house (which is strong on the campus)? I'm just not sure yet. She'll have two recs sent in that specifically have a section for her legacy connection to be stated, so her legacy house will KNOW she's a legacy no matter what. I'm not concerned about that part.
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  #26  
Old 01-31-2018, 03:08 PM
ggforever ggforever is offline
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Everyone is assuming these “darling, smart women” are being released because they are a legacy to another house. There are many reasons for releasing women. Sometimes they are just not high enough on a list. There also may be issues that the rec writer is not aware of when she is writing a glowing recommendation. It could be behavioral concerns or her attitude in the other houses. If a chapter really likes a legacy and feels they have a chance, they will not drop her. If she has an attitude, good luck, no matter how awesome she thinks she is. Yes, RFM makes it a lot more difficult to risk keeping a legacy sometimes they are worth the risk.

OldFLDDD get recommendations for all the houses. Look on the Panhellenic website for information on the houses. Prepare your daughter as best you can. Do not have rec writers conceal her legacy. That is not right.

Give your daughter a hug and kiss then a big bottle or two of wine for yourself. It will turn out great because you have raised an awesome daughter.
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  #27  
Old 01-31-2018, 05:58 PM
NYCMS NYCMS is offline
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Originally Posted by ggforever View Post
Everyone is assuming these “darling, smart women” are being released because they are a legacy to another house. There are many reasons for releasing women. Sometimes they are just not high enough on a list. There also may be issues that the rec writer is not aware of when she is writing a glowing recommendation. It could be behavioral concerns or her attitude in the other houses. If a chapter really likes a legacy and feels they have a chance, they will not drop her. If she has an attitude, good luck, no matter how awesome she thinks she is. Yes, RFM makes it a lot more difficult to risk keeping a legacy sometimes they are worth the risk.
Bingo. It's the whole "we liked you, but we liked others better." Not that the legacy wasn't fabulous, but just not as good a fit/liked as much as other girls. There are so many legacies rushing these days that even big chapters could fill a pledge class of 100+ girls with legacies alone. I think any PNM needs to understand that when they're cut - legacy or not - that it's not personal, that it's that members found other girls to be a better fit and other girls had more actives in the house rooting for them. Sometimes a seemingly outgoing, great girl can either go "quiet" in a house (perhaps intimidated by it being their legacy house) or talk non-stop and turn everyone off. It happens.

The most important thing that I think legacies should understand is to know that legacy no longer means an automatic bid - that they're just as much in competition with other girls as a non-legacy with the exception of getting back to a 2nd party automatically. Attitude definitely can get a legacy released if they come through with a sense of entitlement. My chapter would have easily released such a legacy except that her sister was in the house.

I don't know which SEC school your daughter is attending, but I know that at Ole Miss, even chapter legacies are being released after the 2nd round - just so many legacies there and so many girls in general. Variable quota has intensified this so even more chapter and non-chapter legacies have been cut.

I wish your daughter well! Please keep us posted!

Last edited by NYCMS; 01-31-2018 at 06:11 PM.
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