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  #1  
Old 03-09-2008, 10:45 PM
dukedg dukedg is offline
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Quota and Total Question

Okay, so I didn't know what to title this thread...

I was reading the DePauw thread and thinking about some of the comments there about total, quota, etc. I believe most schools determine a quota each year based on the number of PNMs at some point during recruitment. I know some schools do a "hard total" for lack of a better term and will only allow each chapter to take new members up to that total.

Are there any schools that do a "floating total"? (These are obviously terms I'm making up as I go!) Basically, they would look at the number of PNMs still in recruitment going into pref night and then figure out a total for all the chapters. Then each chapter would have their own quota that allows them to get to the new total established based on the number of PNMs. This seems like a way to keep the bigger chapters from getting bigger and the smaller ones from getting smaller. After formal recruitment, any chapters below the new total could COB to total (or to their quota, which would be the same thing).

I'd love to hear about any schools doing this or that have tried this and how it works.
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  #2  
Old 03-09-2008, 11:02 PM
LucyKKG LucyKKG is offline
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I think I get what you're talking about. We have a "hard total" at my school (although we've only had formal recruitment once since panhel was just formed). I know our panhellenic system is still figuring itself out, so I wonder if we would ever adopt a system like the one you mentioned.

Sorry for not answering your question and just adding more questions!
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  #3  
Old 03-09-2008, 11:18 PM
nittanyalum nittanyalum is offline
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  #4  
Old 03-10-2008, 01:18 AM
violetpretty violetpretty is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dukedg View Post
Okay, so I didn't know what to title this thread...

I was reading the DePauw thread and thinking about some of the comments there about total, quota, etc. I believe most schools determine a quota each year based on the number of PNMs at some point during recruitment. I know some schools do a "hard total" for lack of a better term and will only allow each chapter to take new members up to that total.

Are there any schools that do a "floating total"? (These are obviously terms I'm making up as I go!) Basically, they would look at the number of PNMs still in recruitment going into pref night and then figure out a total for all the chapters. Then each chapter would have their own quota that allows them to get to the new total established based on the number of PNMs. This seems like a way to keep the bigger chapters from getting bigger and the smaller ones from getting smaller. After formal recruitment, any chapters below the new total could COB to total (or to their quota, which would be the same thing).

I'd love to hear about any schools doing this or that have tried this and how it works.
At most schools, total doesn't matter during formal recruitment. Quota is set the same for every chapter to allow for even growth across the board to reflect the number of PNMs participating in recruitment. At almost every campus, chapters may take quota even if it puts them over total.

Many large campuses use the release figure method (RFM) to allow for maximum placement; "popular" chapters will have fewer women on their bid list because past data indicates that more women chose their chapter. round than "less popular" chapters. Proper use of the RFM helps prevent the "big from getting bigger".

Total matters after formal recruitment. If a chapter is under total after formal recruitment, they are allowed to bid up to total. This is where smaller chapters "catch up".

Campus total is not forever and ever set in stone. It can be changed to reflect membership trends in the Panhellenic Community. For example, if every chapter is above total from taking quota during formal recruitment, then the campus Panhellenic can raise total (or perhaps look into extension). If there seems to be a decreasing trend in membership, the campus Panhellenic can lower total to level the playing field.

Ideally, total should be about 4x quota for schools that do a fall formal recruitment and about 3x quota for schools that do a spring formal recruitment. This would be a "perfect" situation, where chapters take only freshmen, retain all members, and all members graduate in exactly four years, so actual total should be slightly less than 4x or 3x quota to allow for some variation. Total should be set such that only chapters who didn't make quota or chapters who are still under total after making quota will participate in informal recruitment.

There are some exceptions. Ohio State essentially disregards quota. Campus total is 100 (Buckeyes correct me if I am wrong) and a chapter may not take quota if it puts them over total. I personally think it's silly, because if there happens to be a much larger than usual group of women going through, too bad, your chapter can only take this fixed number of women, and there will be a lot of women unmatched for no good reason. I also dislike the "bed rush" (chapters can bid as many women as there are available beds in their chapter house) used by Indiana and other schools for the same reason.

The way I like to think of different methods of recruitment is equality and equity. Equality is important during formal to reflect the size of the PNM pool. Equity is important during informal to allow smaller chapters a chance to catch up with the larger ones.

I'm not sure if this answered your question, or if I am interpreting what you were trying to say accurately, but campus Panhellenics already use methods to address the problem of "the big getting bigger".
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  #5  
Old 03-10-2008, 02:38 AM
dukedg dukedg is offline
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It's late, so hopefully my example with numbers is not wrong!

Before recruitment stats:
ABC = 75
XYZ = 55
50 PNMs still participating when quota is calculated

Under the current system, then, quota would be 25. Let's also say quota is typically 25, so total is set at 100 by panhel.

I am suggesting instead that total should be calculated as 75+55+50 = 180/2 = 90 therefore ABC’s quota would be 15 and XYZ’s would be 35. In theory, then they would be at much closer chapters sizes at the end of recruitment.

Post recruitment:
ABC = 90
XYZ = 90 (or can COB up to 90)

Under the current system used post recruitment:
ABC = 100
XYZ = 80 (and can then find 20 new PNMs -- at least -- to COB up to 100)

This would also alleviate the need to vote in panhel for changes in total, which can sometimes be divisive votes. Total would automatically adjust when there was an influx or decline in PNMs in any given year.

I am not specifically advocating this as the only numerical calculation for my "floating total", it was just the easiest one that came to mind.

Last edited by dukedg; 03-10-2008 at 02:45 AM.
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  #6  
Old 03-10-2008, 12:08 PM
violetpretty violetpretty is offline
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The only criticism I have for your "floating total" is that large differences pre-recruitment chapter size among chapters will lead to permanent size instability among all chapters. When XYZ's class of 35 NMs graduate (let's assume that they're all freshmen for the sake of argument) XYZ will have the same size "hole" to fill in 4 years. If they instead worked on making actual quota, COBing when needed, and balancing the size of each class (freshmen, sophomore, junior, senior), they will be more stable in the long run.

Also, let's not kid ourselves, not every PNM will fit into every chapter. It's unfair to the larger chapters that they can't have their equal share of the pie. For PNMs who truly fit in with ABC, if they're going through recruitment during a year where ABC can take a reduced percentage of quota, too bad. It will also lead to size instability with ABC by changing the size of their NM classes on a stable campus.
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Old 03-11-2008, 08:47 AM
gee_ess gee_ess is offline
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Violet, I may be splitting hairs here, but I am under the impression that RFM is not designed to keep the "big from getting bigger" but to level the playing field for the smaller chapters. The RFM keeps stronger chapters from carrying large numbers of girls to later rounds, thus blocking those girls from returning to the smaller houses, which in turn, keeps them from considering these houses. This keeps the small houses from making quota because those pnm's were hanging on for a bid from a big house.

The big houses aren't in danger from getting bigger, but without RFM, the smaller houses stay small. In some cases, the quota is actually getting larger due to RFM - but more houses are making quota this way.

Again, this may just be a matter of semantics, but I always understood that RFM was designed to help smaller houses and really has not effected the bigger houses - unless you count the heavy cuts made in early rounds. They make quota regardless.

Last edited by gee_ess; 03-11-2008 at 08:52 AM.
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  #8  
Old 03-11-2008, 10:46 AM
violetpretty violetpretty is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gee_ess View Post
Violet, I may be splitting hairs here, but I am under the impression that RFM is not designed to keep the "big from getting bigger" but to level the playing field for the smaller chapters. The RFM keeps stronger chapters from carrying large numbers of girls to later rounds, thus blocking those girls from returning to the smaller houses, which in turn, keeps them from considering these houses. This keeps the small houses from making quota because those pnm's were hanging on for a bid from a big house.

The big houses aren't in danger from getting bigger, but without RFM, the smaller houses stay small. In some cases, the quota is actually getting larger due to RFM - but more houses are making quota this way.

Again, this may just be a matter of semantics, but I always understood that RFM was designed to help smaller houses and really has not effected the bigger houses - unless you count the heavy cuts made in early rounds. They make quota regardless.
You are correct, the RFM does level the playing field for smaller chapters. It serves another function, though, which is what I was referring to. Some campuses guarantee a bid to a woman who ranks all chapters attended after preference (and goes to all invited parties throughout recruitment for which she has space). This guarantee is possible because of quota additions. Some people don't like QAs because they "make the big bigger", but if a chapter is getting tons of QAs, then they need to trim down their bid list next time to prevent this, a product of the RFM.
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Last edited by violetpretty; 03-11-2008 at 10:51 AM.
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  #9  
Old 03-11-2008, 04:41 PM
gee_ess gee_ess is offline
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Ahhh, I see what you mean. I'm curious, on some campuses, do houses choose how many to take in QA? On the campus I am affiliated with, we are told by PC how many and which QA's we get - and some houses take a few more or less than others. It is my understanding that after the computer matches the original quota, that the QA's are handmatched. Also, all houses seem to take the same amount of pledges (give or take one or two) except for the one house this last year that did not make quota.

Whew! When I start thinking about the whole process, it just reminds me how close fall recruitment is getting (even thought it's only March!)
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  #10  
Old 03-11-2008, 06:16 PM
sigmaceli sigmaceli is offline
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I thought RFM was now called carry-forward figures? NPC wanted to be more PC, I guess?

I always get a queasy feeling in March when I realize recruitment's only 6 months away...
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  #11  
Old 03-11-2008, 06:21 PM
jwright25 jwright25 is offline
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Originally Posted by gee_ess View Post
I'm curious, on some campuses, do houses choose how many to take in QA? On the campus I am affiliated with, we are told by PC how many and which QA's we get - and some houses take a few more or less than others. It is my understanding that after the computer matches the original quota, that the QA's are handmatched.
With a few possible exceptions, this is the way campuses do QAs. The RFM Specialist and Greek Advisor do it after the computer is done matching - chapters don't really have a say in it.... The QAs are added to the lists before chapters even see who they got through regular matching, so they just see one list. Advisors and some collegians with access to the final bid list can figure out who the QAs are, but it is not common knowledge.
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  #12  
Old 03-11-2008, 06:23 PM
jwright25 jwright25 is offline
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Originally Posted by sigmaceli View Post
I thought RFM was now called carry-forward figures? NPC wanted to be more PC, I guess?
Never heard of this.... RFM stands for "Release Figure Method" and is the general term given to the program that utilizes the complex formulas for determining "Carry Figures." Carry Figures are the numbers given to each chapter each round that is the number of women they can invite to the next round.
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  #13  
Old 03-11-2008, 06:40 PM
sigmaceli sigmaceli is offline
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Thanks for that clarification - math is hard, even when we're talking about the theory.
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