Chapter Advisor needed

[Beryana]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Read the OP. They don't want an AI, and they specify that. They want someone strong in recruitment, which is generally someone who's EXPERIENCED it. The OP might be from a struggling chapter, which is not a good place for a new AI.
There are definitely exceptions, especially for AIs who have been involved for awhile. But the poster I was refering to said that they should initiate a woman and then immediatly make her advisor. To me, that's like making a pledge president. I know that most chapters don't rely on their advisor(s) like they do their exec board, but from the OP, it looks like this chapter is expecting a lot from her.
AIs who have been a part of their sorority for awhile can make good advisors to solid chapters, but I wouldn't throw a brand new AI on a struggling chapter, that's just silly. Another reason is because I have come across AIs who don't know the basic info. I don't blame them for that, I blame whoever initiated them, but I still don't think that person would be my choice for an advisor.

Once again, I SERIOUSLY beg to disagree! Recruitment is sales - plain and simple. Recruitment is ALSO not rocket science in that sometimes all it takes is a fresh pair of eyes to realize the problem areas. You wouldn't necessarily need an initiated member to help with recruitment planning and training (membership selection, that is a different story). Basically what you are saying is that to be a recruitment advisor you need at least four years experience (one as a rushee and three as the rusher) to be worth anything?

Once again, my story as Chapter Adviser was that of a struggling chapter on a large university campus (Big Ten, not SEC). I became Chapter Adviser about 6 months or so AFTER my initiation (during that 6 months I was External programming adviser - so PR, Social, PanHel, etc). No, this was not as specifially recruitment adviser - but I sure had to know quite a bit about recruitment and membership selection!! After my year as Chapter Adviser I moved from that area to where there are no AOII chapters (collegiate or alumnae) for about a 4 hour drive. Four years later I am an international volunteer supervising 2 collegiate chapters! My recruitment experience has changed very little, but I still need to know a LOT about recruitment to help the chapters when needed! Does this lack of collegiate recruitment experience mean I won't do a good job - no. Why? Because recruitment is nothing more than sales and marketing!

[KunjaPrincess]

Originally Posted by AlphaFrog

Read the OP. They don't want an AI, and they specify that. They want someone strong in recruitment, which is generally someone who's EXPERIENCED it. The OP might be from a struggling chapter, which is not a good place for a new AI.
There are definitely exceptions, especially for AIs who have been involved for awhile. But the poster I was refering to said that they should initiate a woman and then immediatly make her advisor. To me, that's like making a pledge president. I know that most chapters don't rely on their advisor(s) like they do their exec board, but from the OP, it looks like this chapter is expecting a lot from her.
AIs who have been a part of their sorority for awhile can make good advisors to solid chapters, but I wouldn't throw a brand new AI on a struggling chapter, that's just silly. Another reason is because I have come across AIs who don't know the basic info. I don't blame them for that, I blame whoever initiated them, but I still don't think that person would be my choice for an advisor.

Problem is you are only now refering to the OP when people started getting on you about being discriminatory.

Some AI's are not going to make good advisors, BUT some "regular" alums are not going to make good advisors either. It has nothing to do with how you joined the organization but has everything to do with how committed you are to the organization and the specific chapter.

The very nature of being an AI usually means that the member is more committed than the average member. Collegiate members have this handy thing available to them called recruitment, last I checked there was no recruitment in that sense for AI's, instead the commitment to search out the organization and the membership was needed.

An AI also has a definate advantage when it comes to advising. They are not going to get caught up in the "that's not the way we did it in college" junk. THey don't have that experience and so can bring fresh new eyes to the table.

Now if the OP doesn't want an AI, that's fine but it is unfair to say no AI can be a good advisor.

[Drolefille]

She's not saying that. She's saying that a struggling chapter should not look to a NEW AI who may or may not have any other sorority experience to advise them.

AIs are great people. New AIs may not be the best choice to guide a chapter that needs a lot of help.

[AlphaFrog]

Originally Posted by Drolefille

She's not saying that. She's saying that a struggling chapter should not look to a NEW AI who may or may not have any other sorority experience to advise them.

AIs are great people. New AIs may not be the best choice to guide a chapter that needs a lot of help.

Exactly. Like I said before, I'm not talking about people who AIed years ago, I was refering to AIing someone to immediatly be an advisor. I'm aware that it does happen that Alice AI is initiated on Jan 2nd and on Jan 3rd becomes the bestest most spectacularest Advisor that Lamba Lamba Mu has ever seen, but that's an exception more then a rule.

[tunatartare]

The OP specifically stated that her sorority is looking for someone who has been a member of a sorority to become an advisor. This is because they want someone who has had experience with being in a sorority and know what sorority membership entails. Beryana, I know that you were in a local before you became an AOII, but not every AI had the same story as you. It would not be beneficial for the OP's sorority to initiate a woman just so she could be their advisor, because she would most likely not understand their needs.

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally Posted by KLPDaisy

The OP specifically stated that her sorority is looking for someone who has been a member of a sorority to become an advisor. This is because they want someone who has had experience with being in a sorority and know what sorority membership entails. Beryana, I know that you were in a local before you became an AOII, but not every AI had the same story as you. It would not be beneficial for the OP's sorority to initiate a woman just so she could be their advisor, because she would most likely not understand their needs.

So basically you are saying that an AI hasn't been a member of a sorority????

Now that's COMPLETE BS.

A woman who joined in college umpteen years ago and just happens to live in the area probably isn't going to understand their needs either. Things are a lot different now than they were even 15 years ago. And actually a mother or friend who has been around the chapter and has some ties to it probably WILL know a few things about them.

All it takes is someone willing to take the time and figure out what the girls need and how best for them to succeed. That's not rocket science.

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

Originally Posted by KunjaPrincess

Problem is you are only now refering to the OP when people started getting on you about being discriminatory.

Some AI's are not going to make good advisors, BUT some "regular" alums are not going to make good advisors either. It has nothing to do with how you joined the organization but has everything to do with how committed you are to the organization and the specific chapter.

The very nature of being an AI usually means that the member is more committed than the average member. Collegiate members have this handy thing available to them called recruitment, last I checked there was no recruitment in that sense for AI's, instead the commitment to search out the organization and the membership was needed.

An AI also has a definate advantage when it comes to advising. They are not going to get caught up in the "that's not the way we did it in college" junk. THey don't have that experience and so can bring fresh new eyes to the table.

Now if the OP doesn't want an AI, that's fine but it is unfair to say no AI can be a good advisor.

Exactly.

Have you ever thought about being an advisor???

Oh that's right, you are.

[Drolefille]

Originally Posted by SmartBlondeGPhB

So basically you are saying that an AI hasn't been a member of a sorority????

Now that's COMPLETE BS.

A woman who joined in college umpteen years ago and just happens to live in the area probably isn't going to understand their needs either. Things are a lot different now than they were even 15 years ago. And actually a mother or friend who has been around the chapter and has some ties to it probably WILL know a few things about them.

All it takes is someone willing to take the time and figure out what the girls need and how best for them to succeed. That's not rocket science.

You're getting very upset and taking things about two steps further than what was actually said.

If their chapter was thriving, I'd agree with you. But it doesn't sound like there IS time for someone figure things out. Action needs to be taken ASAP. Another sorority alumna with advising experience would be ideal. But you're ignoring that the OP wasn't looking for a NEW AI. If they had an AI who had already been around for a while, it would be different.

AIs are just as capable as anyone else. AIs are people too. We all know that. It's simply a timing and experience issue.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Beryana

Once again, I SERIOUSLY beg to disagree! Recruitment is sales - plain and simple.

Umm no.

Selling shoes at Macy's is sales, plain and simple.

There are quite a few more things (most having to do with human emotions) that go into sorority recruitment.

And you were in a sorority in college, so there's NO way you can look at it the same way that an AI who never participated in collegiate Greek life could. Even if you weren't a rush chair, you rushed women in a collegiate setting and you have that experience in your memory bank.

ETA the initiating an active sister's mom to do any sort of advising (or even a mom who is already a sister or another sorority's alum) can be fine or a complete bloody trainwreck...been there, done that, t-shirt...so proceed with extreme caution. Basically it can be like working in a family business which can be very very good or very very bad.

[Drolefille]

And let's be honest, rush can be HARD.

Advisors have to make tough decisions sometimes. They definately shouldn't be following the exec board without knowing better. If this is going to be the person to settle disputes internally and get involved with the panhellenic aspect of rush (the rush meetings at my school all involved the VPMembership (rush chair) and her advisor) she needs to know what's going on.

No one's saying that AIs never make good advisors... BUT your odds are better going with another option.

[tunatartare]

Originally Posted by SmartBlondeGPhB

So basically you are saying that an AI hasn't been a member of a sorority????

Now that's COMPLETE BS.

A woman who joined in college umpteen years ago and just happens to live in the area probably isn't going to understand their needs either. Things are a lot different now than they were even 15 years ago. And actually a mother or friend who has been around the chapter and has some ties to it probably WILL know a few things about them.

All it takes is someone willing to take the time and figure out what the girls need and how best for them to succeed. That's not rocket science.

Please re-read what I said. A woman who was just initiated as an AI is a member of a sorority but she does not know enough about sororities to make a good advisor. A woman who was initiated 15 years ago may be out of the loop, but she knows how sororities work. These girls aren't looking for a friend, they're looking for an advisor to help them out. A mother or a friend might have trouble seeing things objectively, whereas a stranger who doesn't have ties to the sorority does not. I don't understand why people are getting so worked up about this, if you owned an advertising company, you wouldn't hire a college grad who majored in bio and has zero advertising experience to be the CEO.

[Beryana]

Originally Posted by 33girl

Umm no.

Selling shoes at Macy's is sales, plain and simple.

There are quite a few more things (most having to do with human emotions) that go into sorority recruitment.

And you were in a sorority in college, so there's NO way you can look at it the same way that an AI who never participated in collegiate Greek life could. Even if you weren't a rush chair, you rushed women in a collegiate setting and you have that experience in your memory bank.

The basics of sales is that you have a product to sell to someone. That product can be overpriced shoes or a sorority. Either way, you are trying to convince someone else that they cannot live without this sorority/these shoes/etc. That's sales. Recruitment = sales.

Despite being in a sorority in college, the only thing it gave me was a desire to find a sisterhood that I could belong to (my collegiate experience was NOT the most rewarding!). I really would not consider the rush process at SNC anything close to what goes on at a Big Ten school (which is nothing like what happens at SEC schools). I had to learn ALL kinds of new things regarding policies and procedures when I became an adviser because there was NOTHING similar - oh, I knew the extension process because I was through that but otherwise there really wasn't anything similar!

To refresh the memories of those involved in this tangent, the original post by AlphaFrog states:

AIs generally DO NOT make good advisors...it's like the blind leading the blind. They'd be better off with an NPC Alum who has been through rush and ritual on both sides.

Nothing was specified about brand new AI who never were involved in Greek Life (or any college organization) would make a good recruitment adviser. Even to say that AIs do not make good advisers for a struggling chapter is just plain stupid (whether they were involved in collegiate Greek Life, another college organization, or not!).

[LPIDelta]

AIs really shouldn't be a target here. The true issue is lack of experience, plain and simple, and I think we can all agree that long term and short term members can both fall into that category.

I have been a sorority member, both local and international, for more than 12 years, and I have risen up through the ranks of my sorority's leadership--and I would never dream in a million years to be qualified to advise a big school (SEC or otherwise) on recruitment in terms of procedures and rules. Recruitment at larger school requires almost a specialization in the subject.

While I do agree with Beryana that recruitment skills are basically the same no matter the school, there is a difference between the procedures from school to school. I believe those can be learned, but I do not believe that Susie Alum from small town school could just walk in without training and truly be an effective recruitment advisor.

[33girl]

Originally Posted by Beryana

The basics of sales is that you have a product to sell to someone. That product can be overpriced shoes or a sorority. Either way, you are trying to convince someone else that they cannot live without this sorority/these shoes/etc. That's sales. Recruitment = sales.

My sorority isn't a product, it's a sisterhood.

Myself and my chapter sisters looked for women who would benefit from having that sisterhood and who in turn would bring something to the rest of the members. That was our main motivation in rush, not "selling."

But hey, different strokes for different folks.

[tunatartare]

Originally Posted by 33girl

My sorority isn't a product, it's a sisterhood.

Myself and my chapter sisters looked for women who would benefit from having that sisterhood and who in turn would bring something to the rest of the members. That was our main motivation in rush, not "selling."

But hey, different strokes for different folks.