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  #1  
Old 07-28-2006, 03:25 AM
moe.ron moe.ron is offline
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Army Dismisses Gay Arabic Linguist

A language specialist was dismissed from the U.S. Army under the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy, though he says he never admitted being gay and his accuser was never identified.

Copas, 30, told The Associated Press he is gay, but said he was "outed" by a stream of anonymous e-mails to his superiors in the 82nd Airborne Division at Fort Bragg, North Carolina.
..........
An eight-month Army investigation culminated in Copas' honorable discharge on Jan. 30 - less than four years after he enlisted, he said, out of a post-Sept. 11 sense of duty to his country.

He plans to appeal to the Army Board for Correction of Military Records.

The "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy, established in 1993, prohibits the military from inquiring about the sex lives of service members, but requires discharges of those who openly acknowledge being gay.
.......
Copas said he was never open about his sexuality in the military and suspects his accuser was someone he mistakenly befriended and apparently slighted.

More than 11,000 service members have been dismissed under the policy, including 726 last year - an 11 percent jump from 2004 and the first increase since 2001.
...........
But the GAO also noted that nearly 800 dismissed gay or lesbian service members had critical abilities, including 300 with important language skills. Fifty-five were proficient in Arabic, including Copas, a graduate of the Defense Language Institute in California.
.........
Lt. Col. James Zellmer, Copas' commanding officer in the 313th military intelligence battalion, told the AP that "the evidence clearly indicated that Sgt. Copas had engaged in homosexual acts."

Link to the Article
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  #2  
Old 07-28-2006, 09:11 AM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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rules is rules...
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  #3  
Old 07-28-2006, 09:24 AM
Drolefille Drolefille is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsnake
rules is rules...
Yeah but he didn't ask or tell. Someone who didn't like him sent in emails.

That's what I don't like. He followed the rules and someone (possibly a man scorned) got pissy.
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Old 07-28-2006, 10:50 AM
jillybean jillybean is offline
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He didn't offer up the information, thus following his end of "don't ask, don't tell," plus this guy, like 50% of others dismissed as the article says, has those critical Arabic language skills that the army desperately needs these days. Sounds counterproductive to me....
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  #5  
Old 07-28-2006, 10:56 AM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Originally Posted by jillybean
He didn't offer up the information, thus following his end of "don't ask, don't tell," plus this guy, like 50% of others dismissed as the article says, has those critical Arabic language skills that the army desperately needs these days. Sounds counterproductive to me....
So he gets to go home early with full veteran benefits, and free training in Arabic?

Sounds rough.
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  #6  
Old 07-28-2006, 11:12 AM
Drolefille Drolefille is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsnake
So he gets to go home early with full veteran benefits, and free training in Arabic?

Sounds rough.
If the guy used his gayness to get out of the army, I'd have no respect for him, seeing how he signed up. But he wanted to serve, he's needed, and they're sending him home because they don't like to think about what he does in his free time.

I'm pretty sure you go into the army with Arabic knowledge if you're a linguist. It's not an easy language to pick up in a few years especially if you're going to be negotiating etc.

Sounds like he's getting screwed out of a career and greater benefits if he was career military.
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  #7  
Old 07-28-2006, 11:40 AM
Rudey Rudey is offline
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I think they should just create a gay batallion for now and deal with the issue in 30 years.

I think it's great to defend your country and home and if this was a straight guy we'd be honoring him.

-Rudey
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  #8  
Old 07-28-2006, 12:26 PM
Kevin Kevin is offline
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Originally Posted by Drolefille
If the guy used his gayness to get out of the army, I'd have no respect for him, seeing how he signed up. But he wanted to serve, he's needed, and they're sending him home because they don't like to think about what he does in his free time.

I'm pretty sure you go into the army with Arabic knowledge if you're a linguist. It's not an easy language to pick up in a few years especially if you're going to be negotiating etc.

Sounds like he's getting screwed out of a career and greater benefits if he was career military.
Actually, it indicates that he was a graduate of the Army's language school. My firm has a client who is currently enrolled in that school. It's a high intensity program. True, many people enter the military with knowledge of the language, but the graduates of this school often learn it from scratch. Case in point, the client I mentioned -- she's up there right now learning some obscure dialect spoken in Northern Afghanistan.

I guarantee you, she had no prior experience with this language/dialect.

The policy really is pretty stupid. Gay or straight, these people are needed. Their sexual orientation isn't hurting their work, so I really don't see the problem. Clinton's policy was simply a method of deferring the tough decision to a later date and another person.
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  #9  
Old 07-28-2006, 11:40 PM
RU OX Alum RU OX Alum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsnake
rules is rules...

family guy? awesome, and how apropro
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  #10  
Old 07-28-2006, 11:44 PM
RU OX Alum RU OX Alum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsnake
The policy really is pretty stupid. Gay or straight, these people are needed. Their sexual orientation isn't hurting their work, so I really don't see the problem. Clinton's policy was simply a method of deferring the tough decision to a later date and another person.

right. hijack:

both Clinton and Bush, Jr. seem to have groups of fananatical devotees, and just as fanatical opposition. Am the I only one who thinks that they are both pretty much just sort of okay. I mean, I wouldn't call either one of them the worst, but neither of them are anywhere near the best either. They're both right in the middle.

/end hijack.
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  #11  
Old 07-29-2006, 01:06 AM
DeltAlum DeltAlum is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drolefille
I'm pretty sure you go into the army with Arabic knowledge if you're a linguist. It's not an easy language to pick up in a few years especially if you're going to be negotiating etc.
The daughter of some close friends of ours is in the Army language school at The Presidio studying Arabic, in which she had no background.

From what I've read (no personal experience), it's the finest language school in the world.

As for, "Don't ask, don't tell," as Snake says, "Rules is rules," no matter how misguided.

Then again, there's a right way and a wrong way and the Army way.
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  #12  
Old 07-29-2006, 01:19 AM
squirrely girl squirrely girl is offline
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why must we kick ourselves in the ass like this - once again what somebody does legally behind closed doors is more important than our ability to communicate with the citizens of the country we are occupying - special!
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  #13  
Old 07-29-2006, 01:38 AM
DeltAlum DeltAlum is offline
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Originally Posted by squirrely girl
...communicate with the citizens of the country we are occupying - special!
Wash your mouth out with soap! We aren't "occupying" a country, we're "liberating" it.

Sigh.
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  #14  
Old 07-29-2006, 02:06 AM
macallan25 macallan25 is offline
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^nice
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  #15  
Old 07-29-2006, 10:05 AM
AOII_LB93 AOII_LB93 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ktsnake
The policy really is pretty stupid. Gay or straight, these people are needed. Their sexual orientation isn't hurting their work, so I really don't see the problem. Clinton's policy was simply a method of deferring the tough decision to a later date and another person.
I thought this needed to be highlighted, esp the part about being needed.
Who cares if the guy next to you in the tank is gay or straight? If he can do his job he should get to stay. Being straight doesn't make one a better soldier.
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