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  #16  
Old 09-09-2007, 05:20 AM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKA_Monet View Post
Most groups have potential new members (PMN) or candidates for Membership Intake Processes (MIP). I believe Ariesrising runs the "Greekpages" site that explains the variations of each group.
PMNs generally are recruited and are freshman upon initiation. MIP candidates select their organization and pursue membership independently, rarely some are freshman upon initiation.
Ah, thank you for the explanation

Well, in German students´corporations there are 4 status for the members:

Fux/Fuchs/Fähe/Renonce: Is a new member of the corporation who has just entered and therefore doesn´t have full rights or obligations. Usually you are have this status for 2 semesters. It is a kind of probation time where the new member and the corporation can find out if they fit together. After this time (and in the fencing fraternities after a first fencing duel), the new member will pass an exam (oral test about the history of students´corporation in Germany, about the history of the own fraternity/sorority, about the students´corporations in the same town etc.) and then he/she will be accept as

Aktiver Bursch/aktive Dame/Mädel: This are members with full rights and obligations who will take over positions within the corporation.

Inaktiver Bursch/inaktive Dame/Mädel: At the end of your studies you will become "inactive" which means you will have less obligations. This is because your studies are always on No. 1 and at the end of your studies you need the time to prepare for exams.

Alter Herr/Hohe Dame/Philister: After finishing your studies and entering working life, you will become alter Herr/hohe Dame/Philister. From this time onwards you will mainly support your corporation with money.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AKA_Monet View Post
Hazing is illegal in most states with jail time. People should never do it. I do not condone it. But the actions of few ruin it for all.
Good to know Well, as you can see in my former posts: We do have the same reputation problem here in Germany. But it IS a problem: The good times are over and it isn´t easy to find new member to keep your corporation alive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AKA_Monet View Post
Did you want to have this discussion "top side"? Because it is helping me observing it from another country's POV. Also, there is a graduate (alumnae) chapter of my sorority in Frankfurt, Germany near the US Military Base.
Sorry, don´t know what you mean with "top side".

There are sorority sisters of your in Germany? Cool! Do you think there´s a way to get in touch with them? Maybe one of them is interested in giving a speech about sororities in the US?
My sorority has - as the only sorority in Germany - the goal to pratise and support the English language as it is the new "lingua franca". We therefore would love to have someone here to give us a lecture - even if it is in English
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  #17  
Old 09-09-2007, 05:42 AM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carnation View Post
Singen Sie ”Die Lorelei”? Ich weiss nicht was soll es bedeuten....
Do your sororities have symbols, colors, and flowers? Do they allow all who want to join to do so or do they have selective membership? You could find out more about us by going to this link: www.npcwomen.org or you could look on the websites of various universities.
Hi carnation!

Oh, you speak German? Well, actually we didn´t sing this songs so far, but this are folk songs and we also sing some folk songs beside the traditional student´s songs.

On http://www.studentenlieder.de.vu you will find several German student´s songs for download. Very popular are e.g. the following songs:

- Oh alte Burschenherrlichkeit
- Student sein, wenn die Veilchen blühen
- Gaudeamus Igitur
- Nicht der Pflicht nur zu genügen

Yes, your sororities and fraternities have own symbols and colours (but we don´t have flowers). Every corporation has its own "Zirkel" (e.g. http://www.noricagraz.com/download/zirkel.jpg). Originally a Zirkel was a kind of a secret symbol for a fraternity. I goes back to the brotherhoods in the mid-age. A Zirkel is a mixture of different letters which usually refer to a whole sentence. E.g. my sorority´s Zirkel has the letters V, v, s and c. It stands for the latin sentence:

Circulus sororum victoriae vivat! (The circle of the victoria sisters may live)

The Zirkel is usually written after your name in any corporation related issues. As long as your corporation does exist, it is followed by an exclamation mark.
If you are currently in a specific position within your corporation, you will put a shortcut of your position behind the exclamation mark, e.g.

Hans Wurst Z! x

The positions vary a lot from corporation to corporation, therefore I will not list them here. In General, x stands for the first representive of the corporation. Other positions (e.g. responsible for finance or written communication) will have shortcuts like xx, xxx or xxxx. The person responsible for the education of new members will have the shortcut FM.
Well, as I said: In general.

German corporation do not accept all members. Beside the gender, there are other criterias that depend on the corporation of course. The catholic corporation only accept catholics. The Burschenschaften mainly only except Germans with German roots (e.g. a guy born in Germany which parents are from Turkey won´t be accepted in some Burschenschaften) and guys who didn´t deny liability for military service.
And of course you have to study to be accepted in most fraternities/sororities (except the ones at schools).
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  #18  
Old 09-09-2007, 07:58 AM
KyleMcGuire1983 KyleMcGuire1983 is offline
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[QUOTE=VictoriaGermany;1515706]
The "Burschenschaften" are politically oriented. The developed in the first half of the 19th century and were fighting for a free nation. They were strongly involved in the "Wartburgfest" and the "Hambacher Fest". Sorry, I need to fresh up my history knowledge before I can go in detail.
Today, the "Burschenschaften" are more conservative and unfortunately some are very "German oriented". Yes, I guess some of them are nazis... Unfortunately these people give all fraternities/sororities a bad reputation.
QUOTE]

I don't think there is anything wrong about being a nationalist or a patriot. I don't think a love of Germany and wanting to preserve German culture has anything to do with being a Nazi. Nazis are thugs and murderers....Nationalists just want to preserve their nation.

As for the comment about the Philippines......their Greek system is based on ours. For those of you who don't know the Philippines were an American colony from 1898 to 1946 and from what I understand their culture is to this day heavily effected by the United States.
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  #19  
Old 09-09-2007, 08:20 AM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KyleMcGuire1983 View Post
I don't think there is anything wrong about being a nationalist or a patriot. I don't think a love of Germany and wanting to preserve German culture has anything to do with being a Nazi. Nazis are thugs and murderers....Nationalists just want to preserve their nation.

As for the comment about the Philippines......their Greek system is based on ours. For those of you who don't know the Philippines were an American colony from 1898 to 1946 and from what I understand their culture is to this day heavily effected by the United States.
In fact you are right: Most guys in fraternity have a stronger love for our country, they are more patriotic. But as I said: Some of them have opinions that have nothing to do with patriotism.

I heard this morning that there are also American oriented fraternities in Brasil. In Chile, however, they are having German oriented fraternities (Burschenschaften) which were founded by German immigrants.
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  #20  
Old 09-09-2007, 02:37 PM
tld221 tld221 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VictoriaGermany View Post
Well, in German students´corporations there are 4 status for the members:

Fux/Fuchs/Fähe/Renonce: Is a new member of the corporation who has just entered and therefore doesn´t have full rights or obligations. Usually you are have this status for 2 semesters. It is a kind of probation time where the new member and the corporation can find out if they fit together. After this time (and in the fencing fraternities after a first fencing duel), the new member will pass an exam (oral test about the history of students´corporation in Germany, about the history of the own fraternity/sorority, about the students´corporations in the same town etc.) and then he/she will be accept as

Aktiver Bursch/aktive Dame/Mädel: This are members with full rights and obligations who will take over positions within the corporation.

Inaktiver Bursch/inaktive Dame/Mädel: At the end of your studies you will become "inactive" which means you will have less obligations. This is because your studies are always on No. 1 and at the end of your studies you need the time to prepare for exams.

Alter Herr/Hohe Dame/Philister: After finishing your studies and entering working life, you will become alter Herr/hohe Dame/Philister. From this time onwards you will mainly support your corporation with money.
a couple of questions (on the bolded parts):

when the new members are in that "probationary" period, is it understood that the fit is/will be good? in other words, a person wouldnt be a new member of more than one corporation? or a person wouldnt be a member of one corporation, then decide after 2 semester "hey this isnt for me!" and then pursue another corporation?

also, when a member finishes their studies and moves on to working life, do they support the corporation ONLY with money? there are people who run the corporation overall that have finished school, right? and curious, are there other ways that a "alter Herr/hohe Dame/Philister" WOULD support their corporations aside from writing checks/giving donations?
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  #21  
Old 09-09-2007, 02:59 PM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tld221 View Post
a couple of questions (on the bolded parts):

when the new members are in that "probationary" period, is it understood that the fit is/will be good? in other words, a person wouldnt be a new member of more than one corporation? or a person wouldnt be a member of one corporation, then decide after 2 semester "hey this isnt for me!" and then pursue another corporation?
Usually the active and inactive members of a corporation decide whether to accept a new member or not. Of course, if there are strong doubts from the beginning, you need to discuss. In a friend´s fraternity they only let new members enter as long as ALL active and inactive members agree with it.
When you enter one corporation as a new member, you are not able to enter another one. Of course, when you have finally been accepted and move to another town, you can ask your corporation for permission to enter another corporation. During the 2 semester of probation, you can leave the corporation without giving any reasons. The corporation has the same right. If you decide to leave your corporation (no matter if you are only on probation or fully accepted), you are allowed to enter a new corporation.
If your corporation threw you out, it is quite likely that no other corporation will accept you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tld221 View Post
also, when a member finishes their studies and moves on to working life, do they support the corporation ONLY with money? there are people who run the corporation overall that have finished school, right? and curious, are there other ways that a "alter Herr/hohe Dame/Philister" WOULD support their corporations aside from writing checks/giving donations?
Yes, sorry, it was only scratching the edge: Of course, they will help the studying members and they do have their own organisation who e.g. is dealing about the house (as far as the corporation has one) etc.
But most working members are no longer in their university city, therefore their main support will be money. Of course, sometimes you will receive support for your start at work, but to be honest: It is no longer common to get a good job from a frat brother/sorority sister. Corporations do not have the same standing they had a century ago.
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  #22  
Old 09-09-2007, 06:33 PM
DUKyleXY DUKyleXY is offline
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A little off topic, but just to clear things up.

Quote:
As for the comment about the Philippines......their Greek system is based on ours. For those of you who don't know the Philippines were an American colony from 1898 to 1946 and from what I understand their culture is to this day heavily effected by the United States.
Unfortunately, many of the Philippines organizations decide to affiliate with an existing GLO without informing the GLO's HQ. We have/had a group in the Philippines claiming to be a chapter of Delta Upsilon International Fraternity. IHQ didn't know anything about them until I let them know that this group is even using our insignia and our trademarks. I do not know what has happened since I let our IHQ know, but they are not recognized by my Fraternity.
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  #23  
Old 09-09-2007, 07:44 PM
tld221 tld221 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DUKyleXY View Post
Unfortunately, many of the Philippines organizations decide to affiliate with an existing GLO without informing the GLO's HQ. We have/had a group in the Philippines claiming to be a chapter of Delta Upsilon International Fraternity. IHQ didn't know anything about them until I let them know that this group is even using our insignia and our trademarks. I do not know what has happened since I let our IHQ know, but they are not recognized by my Fraternity.
is this the case within this story: http://www.gmanews.tv/story/59553/Fr...rs-slam-hazing

i see APhiO listed-is it a legit chapter or maybe the name was used for a local?
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  #24  
Old 09-09-2007, 07:56 PM
Senusret I Senusret I is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tld221 View Post
is this the case within this story: http://www.gmanews.tv/story/59553/Fr...rs-slam-hazing

i see APhiO listed-is it a legit chapter or maybe the name was used for a local?
APO Philippines and APO USA are both members of the International Council of Alpha Phi Omega.

We are essentially two separate organizations bound by ritual and history but not by governance. http://www.apo.org/show/National_Pro...he_World/ICAPO
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  #25  
Old 09-09-2007, 08:40 PM
KAPital PHINUst KAPital PHINUst is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VictoriaGermany View Post
Today, I depends on the city if you can wear the colours of your fraternity/sorority in public. In the main student´s town, the student parliament is governed by the left wing who is more progessive and believing in any fraternity are only nazis. If you wear your colours in public (especially the ribbon) you will quite sure get beaten up.
Are you for real?

Well, ich bin verde ein schmutzinger vogel sein *lol*
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  #26  
Old 09-10-2007, 03:30 AM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAPital PHINUst View Post
Are you for real?

Well, ich bin verde ein schmutzinger vogel sein *lol*
I was refering to the typical university cities in Germany, e.g. Marburg, Göttingen, Heidelberg...

Sorry, but your German sentence doesn´t make sense. What do you mean by saying this?
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  #27  
Old 09-10-2007, 06:28 AM
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AOII Angel AOII Angel is offline
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VictoriaGermany,

I can only speak for NPC sororities (you can look them up on google.) Women go through recruitment which is an organized event that allows women to get to know the sororities and the sororities to get to know the women. After this week, women are offered a "bid" to join. They are then known as New Members (formerly pledges.) The new member time for NPC groups was formerly one semester, but this has been shortened universally to 6-10 weeks (give or take a week.) This gives women time to get to know the history and traditions of their new sorority. If they do not like what they are learning, they can "disaffiliate." They would not be allowed to join another group (ie take another bid) for a full calendar year. Like German sororities, if you are kicked out of a chapter, you are not likely to get a bid from another. Initiation occurs after the New member period. At this time, the women are full members of the sorority. If you decide to disaffiliate after initiation, you may not join any other NPC sorority. Alumna status is conferred when a woman graduates or leaves school. If the woman marries or has children, she is also offered the choice to become an alumna rather than stay active. We hope that alumna stay involved for life. Our national/international organizations are run by our dedicated alumnae. We have many alumnae chapters throughout the US that allow women to meet with other alumnae in their area. Alumnae also support the local collegiate chapters. If you go to the NPC website, it has links to each NPC sorority. These sites can be very informative. Thanks for the information about German sororities. It has been fascinating!
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  #28  
Old 09-10-2007, 07:30 AM
KAPital PHINUst KAPital PHINUst is offline
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Originally Posted by VictoriaGermany View Post
I was refering to the typical university cities in Germany, e.g. Marburg, Göttingen, Heidelberg...

Sorry, but your German sentence doesn´t make sense. What do you mean by saying this?
It was based on a phrase used by a former American comedian as his trademark.

Never mind, it was a poor attempt at humor.

ETA: My fraternity also has brothers located in Germany as well.
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Last edited by KAPital PHINUst; 09-10-2007 at 07:33 AM.
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  #29  
Old 09-10-2007, 10:38 AM
VictoriaGermany VictoriaGermany is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel View Post
Women go through recruitment which is an organized event that allows women to get to know the sororities and the sororities to get to know the women. After this week, women are offered a "bid" to join. They are then known as New Members (formerly pledges.)
Alright. Our recruitment period is during the whole year, but - of course - in Autumn we have the best chances to get new members.
There isn´t really an event week or something, but we will have a booth at university this week as it is registration week.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel View Post
The new member time for NPC groups was formerly one semester, but this has been shortened universally to 6-10 weeks (give or take a week.) This gives women time to get to know the history and traditions of their new sorority.
How do they learn about history and traditions of their new sorority? In Germany, one member of the sorority is responsible for the education of new members. She will give them regular lessons (once a week or once every fortnight). As I mentioned in another post: At the end they will have to pass an exam to proof they know enough about the sorority. As long as you are not fully accepted, you will only wear a ribbon with 2 colours. This will show other members of fraternities or sororities, that you are not fully accepted. And as long as you are "Fux/Fuchs/Fähe...", you are not allowed to visit other corporations on your own.
If you do so, the members of the other corporation can catch you and your sisters or brother have to buy you off with a lot of beer


Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel View Post
If they do not like what they are learning, they can "disaffiliate." They would not be allowed to join another group (ie take another bid) for a full calendar year. Like German sororities, if you are kicked out of a chapter, you are not likely to get a bid from another.
I guess I wasn´t clear about that: As long as you left the sorority because it was your will, you can ask for acceptance at any other mixed corporation or sorority. And you don´t have to wait until next autumn or anything.


Quote:
Originally Posted by AOII Angel View Post
We hope that alumna stay involved for life.
We do as well ;-)

quote=AOII Angel;1516247]We have many alumnae chapters throughout the US that allow women to meet with other alumnae in their area. [/quote]

As there is no umbrella organisation for the sororities in Germany, we do not have something like local chapters. But alumnae as well as active members are free to visit other sororities´events.
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  #30  
Old 09-10-2007, 11:05 AM
AlphaFrog AlphaFrog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KAPital PHINUst View Post
Are you for real?

Well, ich bin verde ein schmutzinger vogel sein *lol*
"Verde" is Spanish.
"Schmutzinger" is a surname.


Quote:
Originally Posted by VictoriaGermany View Post
I was refering to the typical university cities in Germany, e.g. Marburg, Göttingen, Heidelberg...

Sorry, but your German sentence doesn´t make sense. What do you mean by saying this?
What he was TRYING to say was "Ich bin werde ein schmutziger vogel sein".

Not that it's any funnier. And I think the sentence structure is still a little weak.
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Last edited by AlphaFrog; 09-10-2007 at 11:26 AM.
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