E-Mails Suggest Paterno Role in Silence on Sandusky

[DeltaBetaBaby]

They keep dropping Joe Pa's name because it gets headlines, but that's not what this is really about. It is about the institutional power that would allow something like this to happen without anyone speaking up, and that deserves an investigation. From a very-big-picture standpoint, it's not even about Penn State, as we will likely see changes at schools across the country.

That said, I don't think there is any reason to let sleeping dogs lie. When this is all said and done, there should be no stone unturned, IMO.

[NutBrnHair]

Originally Posted by als463

I hope I didn't offend you. I did not mean to hurt your feelings. I was just saying that we don't always see eye-to-eye on certain issues (tiers/ rankings). It was not a slight against you. I still think you are a wonderful person. I apologize if I hurt your feelings.

No, no we're cool. I should have copied GreekGeek's quote, but it was so nasty I didn't want to repost it.

[als463]

Originally Posted by NutBrnHair

No, no we're cool. I should have copied GreekGeek's quote, but it was so nasty I didn't want to repost it.

Okay, good. I do not purposely go out of my way to offend people on here (unless they sit around and start bashing various sororities/ fraternities). I really like what DeltaBetaBaby said. She hit the nail on the head. I'm sure we will see many things come from these horrible events. I pray for the victims.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

Originally Posted by als463

Okay, good. I do not purposely go out of my way to offend people on here (unless they sit around and start bashing various sororities/ fraternities). I really like what DeltaBetaBaby said. She hit the nail on the head. I'm sure we will see many things come from these horrible events. I pray for the victims.

Illinois has already passed a new law that greatly expands the number of state employees who are mandated reporters. I've been notified that I should expect further information on training to arrive shortly.

[Senusret I]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

They keep dropping Joe Pa's name because it gets headlines, but that's not what this is really about. It is about the institutional power that would allow something like this to happen without anyone speaking up, and that deserves an investigation. From a very-big-picture standpoint, it's not even about Penn State, as we will likely see changes at schools across the country.

That said, I don't think there is any reason to let sleeping dogs lie. When this is all said and done, there should be no stone unturned, IMO.

From time to time, I notice that GC still has rational and reasonable people left on it. Thank you.

[AnchorAlum]

If any of you ever follow fan boards such as Rivals.com, you'd perhaps see the sort of "deniers" who are hell bent on what they see as their job to come to the defense of PSU, mainly the football program, and at the bottom line, the resultant blowback from fans and alums of other schools has made the University an object of scorn and ridicule.

Penn State is a fine University, one that will have to endure an enormous hit to its reputation for years to come. Sadly, part of that is the result of the reaction that some fans and alumni had when the news broke. I'm thinking it will change the culture in such a small town, and I hope it's for the better.

[DrPhil]

I think we had an earlier thread that addressed how this is about institutional dynamics and not about Penn State specifically. I, for one, have never given a damn about Penn State and did not start giving a damn because of this situation. I care about those kids, Sandusky being found guilty, and the institutional dynamics that made this possible at Penn State and any institution.

Originally Posted by als463

I don't always agree with anything she says (practically never) but, resorting to name-calling because someone disagrees with you? It's pretty hard to take your stance seriously when you act like that. Yes, you were ASSUMING that Penn Staters were concerned about our "football program/ hero" and to think that people who currently attend or have attended aren't being shaken by this as well, is pretty ignorant on your part (see, I can name-call too). Do you have ANY IDEA how many of my sisters have been harassed by strangers or, in some cases, by co-workers and supervisors because of everything going on? No, you don't! So, maybe you should take that into account before you start acting like this doesn't affect MANY people on a grand scale. For those of us who work with at-risk youth (many of whom have been victimized) don't try telling me that we all care about our program and NOT about kids.

There are Penn Staters who are only concerned with the football team, reputation of the school, and other things of minimal importance. Penn Staters are not monolithic and cannot be painted with a broad brush.

As for your sisters, if they fear for their safety tell them to call 911. If they fear for their Penn State pride or inconvenience tell them to brush it off and get over it.

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by groovypq

I think I see what NutBrnHair is getting at, after reading the article.

"But in one e-mail, Curley wrote that after talking to Paterno, he no longer wanted to go forward with that plan."

and

"Wick Sollers, a lawyer for the Paterno family, said in a statement: “To be clear, the e-mails in question did not originate with Joe Paterno or go to him, as he never personally utilized e-mail. "

This article is pretty vague. Nothing concrete is said. It's not revealing some email from Paterno to Spanier, Curley, etc. that says "Leave Sandusky alone." It's speculation, and reads pretty weakly to me.

I'm not a Paterno/Penn State apologist, and if more comes out to this, I'm not going to stick my head in the sand about it. But all of the FB postings I've seen to the effect of "ZOMG JoePa covered it up! Penn State should kill off its football team! The NCAA should kill off the Penn State team," well, if they're based on this article, it's sensationalism and a huge rush to judgment. Sorry, I want something more substantial.

There's obviously room for reasonable people to disagree, but here's what we do know from the emails currently released:

1 - The emails are "encoded" in a CYA maneuver by three men who know their emails are a matter of public record - because of that, it's reasonable to infer that there is more than the "surface" reading going on.

2 - The emails say that the decision to effectively bury the Sandusky matter (by going to HIM rather than the POLICE) occurs after a meeting with Paterno, and likely that meeting was basis in part for the decision. True, there's no evidence that Paterno said "Don't go to the police, please" - but there's pretty solid evidence he did not say "Please go to the police" given the nature of the emails and subsequent actions.

It's not necessarily damning, but it's clear there was a coverup, and given Paterno's stature, he's at least involved as a University representative (and friend of Sandusky), if not directly. And it very well could be read as he was directly involved in the coverup as well.

[ASTalumna06]

Originally Posted by DeltaBetaBaby

They keep dropping Joe Pa's name because it gets headlines, but that's not what this is really about. It is about the institutional power that would allow something like this to happen without anyone speaking up, and that deserves an investigation. From a very-big-picture standpoint, it's not even about Penn State, as we will likely see changes at schools across the country.

Exactly. And arguments being made on both sides of the fence are quite ridiculous...

Trying to eliminate the football program won't help. Attempting to defend the football program won't either.

This isn't about football.. or Penn State.. or whatever else people seem to associate it with. This is about someone abusing his power, and in turn, abusing kids. And other people in positions of power decided not to act appropriately. It's sad. And disgusting. As a Penn Stater, I wanted so badly to believe that no one attempted to cover it up. However, reality eventually sets in, people are fired or resign, and trials take place. The school will eventually get past this and things will return to normal. Unfortunately, for some of those kids, they may never again know what "normal" is.

I HOPE the investigation continues, and I hope that every detail about what happened and who was involved comes to the surface. No one should get away with ANYTHING in this case. Paterno passing away doesn't change that.

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Exactly. And arguments being made on both sides of the fence are quite ridiculous...

Trying to eliminate the football program won't help. Attempting to defend the football program won't either.

This isn't about football.. or Penn State.. or whatever else people seem to associate it with. This is about someone abusing his power, and in turn, abusing kids. And other people in positions of power decided not to act appropriately. It's sad. And disgusting. As a Penn Stater, I wanted so badly to believe that no one attempted to cover it up. However, reality eventually sets in, people are fired or resign, and trials take place. The school will eventually get past this and things will return to normal. Unfortunately, for some of those kids, they may never again know what "normal" is.

I HOPE the investigation continues, and I hope that every detail about what happened and who was involved comes to the surface. No one should get away with ANYTHING in this case. Paterno passing away doesn't change that.

The sad thing is, this could have happened anywhere in any sports program. It's not unique to Penn State. It's not unique to sports. It happens anytime people in power sacrifice the weak for the benefit of those who are strong. We see it all the time. It will never change. Sadly, otherwise good people justify covering up these heinous actions. We've seen it now with the church and with officials at Penn State. God only knows where else this ugliness breeds.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by ASTalumna06

Exactly. And arguments being made on both sides of the fence are quite ridiculous...

Trying to eliminate the football program won't help. Attempting to defend the football program won't either.

This isn't about football.. or Penn State.. or whatever else people seem to associate it with. This is about someone abusing his power, and in turn, abusing kids. And other people in positions of power decided not to act appropriately. It's sad. And disgusting. As a Penn Stater, I wanted so badly to believe that no one attempted to cover it up. However, reality eventually sets in, people are fired or resign, and trials take place. The school will eventually get past this and things will return to normal. Unfortunately, for some of those kids, they may never again know what "normal" is.

I HOPE the investigation continues, and I hope that every detail about what happened and who was involved comes to the surface. No one should get away with ANYTHING in this case. Paterno passing away doesn't change that.

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

The sad thing is, this could have happened anywhere in any sports program. It's not unique to Penn State. It's not unique to sports. It happens anytime people in power sacrifice the weak for the benefit of those who are strong. We see it all the time. It will never change. Sadly, otherwise good people justify covering up these heinous actions. We've seen it now with the church and with officials at Penn State. God only knows where else this ugliness breeds.

This is where we keep saying the same thing over and over again. Yes, this can happen at any institution. Yes, this is about power dynamics. No, this is not just about college athletics. No, this is not just about Penn State.

Now that we have appeased some of the Penn Staters and anti-Penn Staters who needed this redundancy (they know who they are--I do not think they are in this thread):

Jerry Sandusky Case: Paterno family urges release of all Penn State memos in scandal

[AOII Angel]

Originally Posted by DrPhil

This is where we keep saying the same thing over and over again. Yes, this can happen at any institution. Yes, this is about power dynamics. No, this is not just about college athletics. No, this is not just about Penn State.

Now that we have appeased some of the Penn Staters and anti-Penn Staters who needed this redundancy (they know who they are--I do not think they are in this thread):

Jerry Sandusky Case: Paterno family urges release of all Penn State memos in scandal

BTW...don't know where the smiley face came from. It popped up on my post and when you're on an iPad, it's too big of a pain in the ass to get rid of it.

Now that we're done petting the Penn Staters, I'm sick of hearing people jump to Paterno's defense to the detriment of the entire case. Being a good coach with a great reputation, dying of cancer before the end of the investigation and being an institution in the State of Pennsylvania do not earn you a pass. He may come out fine in the end, but IF he was involved in a cover up, all his good work deserves a nice thick coat of tarnish.

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

BTW...don't know where the smiley face came from. It popped up on my post and when you're on an iPad, it's too big of a pain in the ass to get rid of it.

I was intrigued by " The sad thing is...."

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

Now that we're done petting the Penn Staters, I'm sick of hearing people jump to Paterno's defense to the detriment of the entire case. Being a good coach with a great reputation, dying of cancer before the end of the investigation and being an institution in the State of Pennsylvania do not earn you a pass. He may come out fine in the end, but IF he was involved in a cover up, all his good work deserves a nice thick coat of tarnish.

From the general public's perspective (since we only know the after the fact cliff notes of Sandusky's offenses, Paterno's health, and the institutional dynamics) this all happened so darn quickly. Those who are in shock and awe (and who feel the need to pick a side) will make some...interesting...comments. I think Paterno's family just wants the truth to be told if there will be an investigation at the institution-level. They want ALL the emails to be released rather than a biased selection of emails.

Redundancy/

The-institution-that-shall-not-be-named did what many institutions have done/would do/will do by responding almost too darn quickly (i.e., replacing Sandusky on the mural and alleged debate over Paterno statue). This made it seem as though they were saving face, protecting their brand, keeping their money, etc. It made some people think the officials at The-institution-that-shall-not-be-named were more "oh snap, what was in the dark is now in the light" rather than "darn, we never knew the alleged incidents were happening...omg."

Again, perception.

/Redundancy

[als463]

Originally Posted by AOII Angel

BTW...don't know where the smiley face came from. It popped up on my post and when you're on an iPad, it's too big of a pain in the ass to get rid of it.

Now that we're done petting the Penn Staters, I'm sick of hearing people jump to Paterno's defense to the detriment of the entire case. Being a good coach with a great reputation, dying of cancer before the end of the investigation and being an institution in the State of Pennsylvania do not earn you a pass. He may come out fine in the end, but IF he was involved in a cover up, all his good work deserves a nice thick coat of tarnish.

Seriously, what is your problem? So, Penn Staters are not allowed to be upset about this whole thing? What holier-than-thou school did you attend that you think it is okay to talk about us like we are a bunch of children who need our egos stroked?

[DrPhil]

Originally Posted by als463

Seriously, what is your problem? So, Penn Staters are not allowed to be upset about this whole thing? What holier-than-thou school did you attend that you think it is okay to talk about us like we are a bunch of children who need our egos stroked?

Certainly your reading comprehension is better than this. Take off your Penn State Goggles for a second.