GreekChat.com Forums  

Go Back   GreekChat.com Forums > General Chat Topics > News & Politics


Register Now for FREE!
Join GreekChat.com, The Fraternity & Sorority Greek Chat Network. To sign up for your FREE account INSTANTLY fill out the form below!

Username: Password: Confirm Password: E-Mail: Confirm E-Mail:
 
Image Verification
Please enter the six letters or digits that appear in the image opposite.

  I agree to forum rules 

» GC Stats
Members: 325,122
Threads: 115,503
Posts: 2,196,035
Welcome to our newest member, haledarkz870
» Online Users: 2,131
0 members and 2,131 guests
No Members online
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 02-27-2012, 08:58 AM
AlphaFrog AlphaFrog is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: The Ozdust Ballroom
Posts: 14,799
Bullycide

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobile...b_1214436.html

While I didn't find the word used in the article, the place where it was linked used the term "bullycide". It's an interesting concept, but I think it goes too far. Unless the bully is supplying the means of death, it's still the victim's choice to take their life. Yes, there are people that FEEL that there is no other way out, but there are other options. Counseling, getting adults involved, moving - if a parent had to decide between packing up and moving this instant and losing their child, I think I know what a good many would pick.

I said this in another thread, but I really think much of this has to do with the heli-parents who want to fix everything for their child. The child never learns to "fend for themselves" and I really feel like it makes them an overall weaker person when it comes to problem-solving and attacks on personal worth. I know the internet has increased the available resources and mediums for bullys to get at their victim, but I can't blame it all on that. We got AOL when I was 12, so I grew up at the beginning of keyboard courage. I had some hateful things done and said to me back then, but I learned to deal with it.

I am sad that there are those that see no other way and choose to end their life. It's a terrible thing, and I hate that it's happening. But can we really place the blame square enough to call it "bullycide"?


ETA: http://www.bullycide.org/ When I Googled "bullycide", this was the first website at the top. Unfortunately, they seem more interested in selling books than anything. Just the name of the website (Bullycide: Moms Speak Out) though sort of highlights my point. There is a mom on there that was quoted as wanting to mass-murder the bullies. I understand the sentiment, but it strikes me as them STILL post-humously trying to "fix" their child's problem.
__________________
Facile remedium est ubertati; sterilia nullo labore vincuntur.
I think pearls are lovely, especially when you need something to clutch. ~ AzTheta
The Real World Can't Hear You ~ GC Troll

Last edited by AlphaFrog; 02-27-2012 at 09:10 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 02-27-2012, 09:10 AM
HQWest HQWest is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,027
Quote:
Originally Posted by AlphaFrog View Post
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobile...b_1214436.html

While I didn't find the word used in the article, the place where it was linked used the term "bullycide". It's an interesting concept, but I think it goes too far. Unless the bully is supplying the means of death, it's still the victim's choice to take their life. Yes, there are people that FEEL that there is no other way out, but there are other options. Counseling, getting adults involved, moving - if a parent had to decide between packing up and moving this instant and losing their child, I think I know what a good many would pick.

I said this in another thread, but I really think much of this has to do with the heli-parents who want to fix everything for their child. The child never learns to "fend for themselves" and I really feel like it makes them an overall weaker person when it comes to problem-solving and attacks on personal worth. I know the internet has increased the available resources and mediums for bullys to get at their victim, but I can't blame it all on that. We got AOL when I was 12, so I grew up at the beginning of keyboard courage. I had some hateful things done and said to me back then, but I learned to deal with it.

I am sad that there are those that see no other way and choose to end their life. It's a terrible thing, and I hate that it's happening. But can we really place the blame square enough to call it "bullycide"?
I think you are right. I think we need to do a better job of talking to children or getting someone in there to figure out the real reason about why the bully is the way they are. Unfortunately, just like the arts, because of budget cuts, student counseling has taken a big hit in recent years. Most counselors are doing all they can to try to keep up. They don't have time to take to the quiet kids who may be having problems, because they have so much else to deal with.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 02-27-2012, 09:34 AM
AGDee AGDee is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 15,390
This is going to be a long post... about a girl I grew up with who was bullied endlessly by many kids in the school. There always seem to be a few who are just the victims in a class, that the majority of the kids picked on and she was "that girl". I never directly bullied anybody, it's just not in my nature, but some of my good friends bullied this girl and I stood by and watched. I always felt some guilt about not standing up for her ever or telling other people to leave her alone. There was something about her that was odd. You couldn't really put your finger on it, but she didn't quite have the social skills to maneuver in society with her peers. There were a couple other girls she hung out and they were all kind of "odd". I'm going to call this girl LM, for ease.

So you all know I worked in mental health for a long time, inpatient psych. I did work with adults for a few years of my career although most of it was in child & adolescent pscyh. I worked at a hospital on the east side of Detroit, not far from when I grew up. My routine every morning was to put my stuff away, and head to the nursing station to get names of new admissions so I could plan who I needed to do an assessment for each day. So one day, I walk out to the board and see LM's name. She had an unusual name so I knew it had to be her. I was immediately struck with "Oh my gosh, what did we do to her over all those years?" I wracked my brain, trying to remember if I was ever actually mean to her and couldn't remember ever saying or doing anything to make fun of her like others did. So I went and introduced myself, not sure she'd recognize me (of course she would, we lived on the same street for 18 years). I said "Hi, I'm Dee and I'm your Occupational Therapist while you're here in the hospital." She said "You're not my OT, you're my neighbor!" She actually sounded happy about that, so I breathed a little sigh of relief, gave her the OT schedule and told her I'd see her in groups later in the day and we'd talk more later. I went to read her chart and discovered she suffered schizophrenia. I really felt a lot of guilt the first few days she was in the hospital and it was awkward for me. I was so incredibly uncomfortable and put a lot of thought into what had gone wrong for LM. Schizophrenia is usually not diagnose until the early 20s and we were 28 at this time. I came to the realization during her hospitalization that the bullying obviously didn't cause her to be schizophrenic. Even though childhood schizophrenia is rare, when I think about her own behavior throughout our school years, she was "odd". It became obvious to me that she had some schizoaffective traits her whole life, which is why she seemed so "odd" to everybody. Kids pick up that people are "different" and don't know quite how to deal with that.

I've thought a lot about the kinds of kids who get bullied, especially after working in adolescent psych. They are the kids who are "odd" in some way, the kids who don't have self esteem. There were kids who picked on me for some things and some of their comments affected me for years, but I was definitely a kid who didn't have much self esteem. I was able to outwardly stand up for myself and make it stop, but at the same time, it affected me internally. LM didn't have the ability to make it stop. I'm sure it affected her internally, but it wasn't the cause of her mental illness. It was actually more a symptom of her mental illness.

People who commit suicide are mentally ill. Period. They either don't have the coping skills, don't have the support environment, or are too depressed to deal with things in general. Sometimes they can't see other solutions. For some of them, the reasons for mental illness are situational but for others, it is truly a chemical imbalance in the brain that requires meds. Does that make bullying ok? No, absolutely not. We should make every effort to teach our kids to be tolerant of others who might be "odd" and to have empathy toward others rather than to prey on them. But bullies...well, they have their own issues.

Bullies usually bully because they, themselves, feel inferior and they prey on the few who are weaker than they are. I don't believe that people are mean or predatory by nature. I believe they too have a form of mental illness. I worked with the bullied kids who were hospitalized for mental illness but I worked with just as many of the bullies. In the hospital, interestingly, they were all kind of on the same playing field and I believe, sometimes, they did learn about the dynamics and come to understand that none of them felt very good about who they were, but they handled it in opposite ways. I can honestly say that 97% of the kids I worked with, both the bullies and the bullied, were NOT from supportive, loving home environments. The bullies need help, just as the bullied need help. Deep inside, both are hurting a lot.

I don't like the term bullycide at all. It's suicide, no matter how you word it.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 02-27-2012, 07:37 PM
madoug madoug is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 177
Wow AGDee that a lot of generalizations going on in that posting.

I was bullied and guess what, I was not then nor now "Odd". I was younger and perceived as weaker by my tormentors. My freshman year of high school was ruined by those two. They had issues, sure, and just having moved into the district wanted to gain friends by stepping over me. Not sure that really worked out for them in the long run. My mom was handy with an encouraging word, but didn't step in to solve the situation for me.

The thing I hated the most about it though was the few friends that witness it and didn't speak up. They didn't add to the torments, but they just kept quiet. talk about feeling alone in a crowd.

Please keep in mind in your professional setting you are seeing the extreme, not the majority.
__________________
Will love diamonds til I die!
My Beta and I have a Beta son, a Sig Ep son and a my, my, little ADPi
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 02-27-2012, 11:15 PM
AGDee AGDee is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 15,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by madoug View Post
Wow AGDee that a lot of generalizations going on in that posting.

I was bullied and guess what, I was not then nor now "Odd". I was younger and perceived as weaker by my tormentors. My freshman year of high school was ruined by those two. They had issues, sure, and just having moved into the district wanted to gain friends by stepping over me. Not sure that really worked out for them in the long run. My mom was handy with an encouraging word, but didn't step in to solve the situation for me.

The thing I hated the most about it though was the few friends that witness it and didn't speak up. They didn't add to the torments, but they just kept quiet. talk about feeling alone in a crowd.

Please keep in mind in your professional setting you are seeing the extreme, not the majority.
But you obviously didn't commit suicide... which is the extreme reaction, which is what you see in the professional setting.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 02-27-2012, 11:53 PM
AOII Angel AOII Angel is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Santa Monica/Beverly Hills
Posts: 8,636
Quote:
Originally Posted by AGDee View Post

I've thought a lot about the kinds of kids who get bullied, especially after working in adolescent psych. They are the kids who are "odd" in some way, the kids who don't have self esteem. There were kids who picked on me for some things and some of their comments affected me for years, but I was definitely a kid who didn't have much self esteem. I was able to outwardly stand up for myself and make it stop, but at the same time, it affected me internally. LM didn't have the ability to make it stop. I'm sure it affected her internally, but it wasn't the cause of her mental illness. It was actually more a symptom of her mental illness.

People who commit suicide are mentally ill. Period. They either don't have the coping skills, don't have the support environment, or are too depressed to deal with things in general. Sometimes they can't see other solutions. For some of them, the reasons for mental illness are situational but for others, it is truly a chemical imbalance in the brain that requires meds. Does that make bullying ok? No, absolutely not. We should make every effort to teach our kids to be tolerant of others who might be "odd" and to have empathy toward others rather than to prey on them. But bullies...well, they have their own issues.

Bullies usually bully because they, themselves, feel inferior and they prey on the few who are weaker than they are. I don't believe that people are mean or predatory by nature. I believe they too have a form of mental illness. I worked with the bullied kids who were hospitalized for mental illness but I worked with just as many of the bullies. In the hospital, interestingly, they were all kind of on the same playing field and I believe, sometimes, they did learn about the dynamics and come to understand that none of them felt very good about who they were, but they handled it in opposite ways. I can honestly say that 97% of the kids I worked with, both the bullies and the bullied, were NOT from supportive, loving home environments. The bullies need help, just as the bullied need help. Deep inside, both are hurting a lot.

I don't like the term bullycide at all. It's suicide, no matter how you word it.
I think you missed this part of her point, madoug. She wasn't saying that every kid that is bullied is mentally ill. She's saying that some of this kids have mental issues that make handling bullying impossible. We need to reinforce with kids that teasing and picking on others can lead to suicide in vulnerable people (ie. those with underlying mental illness.)
__________________

AOII

One Motto, One Badge, One Bond and Singleness of Heart!




Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 02-28-2012, 01:29 PM
ZTAOnlytheBest ZTAOnlytheBest is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 55
Question for AGDee:
In one of my classes we were told that someone may have the genetic disposition to develop a mental illness, but that does not necessarily mean they will. That external factors can contribute to the development of such illnesses. Under this belief, an argument could be made that the bullying contributed to her development of schizophrenia, but was not the full reason. Is this accurate? I am still in college so I will not even pretend to know enough about these things to make any real judgments. You obviously have a lot more experience with these things lol.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:13 PM
AGDee AGDee is offline
GreekChat Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 15,390
Quote:
Originally Posted by ZTAOnlytheBest View Post
Question for AGDee:
In one of my classes we were told that someone may have the genetic disposition to develop a mental illness, but that does not necessarily mean they will. That external factors can contribute to the development of such illnesses. Under this belief, an argument could be made that the bullying contributed to her development of schizophrenia, but was not the full reason. Is this accurate? I am still in college so I will not even pretend to know enough about these things to make any real judgments. You obviously have a lot more experience with these things lol.
There is some truth to that, just like with cancers, even my Crohn's Disease. If I hadn't gotten a really bad intestinal infection, the Crohn's might not have ever reared its ugly head. But I did, so my immune system in my gastro system went into high gear and didn't know when to stop.. which is Crohn's. An autoimmune disease that makes your own immune system believe that your real organs are actually invaders so it attacks them. Anyway... back to the mental illness factor...

You're right, that can happen. There can be triggers. In LM's case, when I think about her actual behavior as a kid, I can see some of the mild signs of schizophrenia though. I think the bullies do tend to seek out the ones they perceive as weak. How much support those kids have and how well they end up handling it is determined by a lot of factors.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 02-28-2012, 06:48 PM
DrPhil DrPhil is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 14,730
An interdisciplinary/interoccupational approach to the study of suicide and self-harming behavior has been used for over 100 years to examine suicide beyond mental illness.

Some forms and incidents of suicide are a result of mental illness. Not all and I would not even say most. When we study suicide across cultures, we find that it spans beyond feeling as though one does not have proper coping skills and therefore must retreat through suicide (or other self-harming behaviors). For instance, there are cultures in which suicide is seen as heroic.

The mental health association here has community programs on bullying and suicide (unfortunately, now called "bullycide"). Bullying will never go away, it will simply receive more attention due to the Internet/facebook/twitttter/more access to dumb people. Childhood and just plain being a human has had its ups and downs since the dawn of humanity. To address the issue of suicide and self-harm, there needs to be social and psychological resources so that it is considered more than an issue of mental health. There are cons to telling people (including Suicide Attempters and Survivors of Suicide) that those who commit suicide are mentally ill as though it is so cut and dry.

Last edited by DrPhil; 02-28-2012 at 07:03 PM.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.