The Murder of Trayvon Martin

[PiKA2001]

Originally Posted by DaemonSeid

Pssst Jon Stewart is not admissable in a court of public opinion

Oh but Nancy Grace is??? The last segment with the animal clips is PRICELESS!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6zxAAmJZuJ8

[DaemonSeid]

I will allow it....hehehe

[WhiteRose1912]

Is anyone here familiar with the case of John McNeil in Georgia? I'm curious if all this attention to the Stand Your Ground laws will bring his case back to light.

[Kevin]

Originally Posted by WhiteRose1912

Is anyone here familiar with the case of John McNeil in Georgia? I'm curious if all this attention to the Stand Your Ground laws will bring his case back to light.

Never followed it in the first place, but I'm not expecting a totally fair treatment from an editorial on salon.com. A jury voted to convict and the highest Georgia court of appeals only had one dissent from the majority which upheld the conviction.

What did that jury and court of appeals see which wasn't presented in these articles? It wouldn't be the first case of the media attempting to mislead in order to get page clicks and viewers in a racially charged story (even if the media has to fan the flames a bit to turn it into a controversy).

[TonyB06]

Originally Posted by WhiteRose1912

Is anyone here familiar with the case of John McNeil in Georgia? I'm curious if all this attention to the Stand Your Ground laws will bring his case back to light.

This sounds terrible. I have to wonder how closely the Georgia statute tracks to the horrible Fla. law. There has to be something more than what's been reported here. Letters, some of them anonymous, led a DA to take this action?

Ultimately, despite its claim to the contrary, the legal process is as subject to infection by politics, race, money and other factors, as any other.

[SOM]

I had not followed this story either. So I took a few seconds Kevin to do a rather fast search on it outside of Salon (which YVHO seems to be less than perfect source of informantion)
Based on following, maybe worth some time looking into as a parrell case to Zimmerman and Martin.
Stand Your Ground: Before Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman, there was John McNeil

http://www.republicmagazine.com/news...hn-mcneil.html

Is John McNeil the Black George Zimmerman?
http://loop21.com/life/john-mcneil-g...orge-zimmerman

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by SOM

I had not followed this story either. So I took a few seconds Kevin to do a rather fast search on it outside of Salon (which YVHO seems to be less than perfect source of informantion)
Based on following, maybe worth some time looking into as a parrell case to Zimmerman and Martin.
Stand Your Ground: Before Trayvon Martin and George Zimmerman, there was John McNeil

http://www.republicmagazine.com/news...hn-mcneil.html

Is John McNeil the Black George Zimmerman?
http://loop21.com/life/john-mcneil-g...orge-zimmerman

You do know that Republic Magazine is not in fact New Republic Magazine, right?

[SOM]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

You do know that Republic Magazine is not in fact New Republic Magazine, right?

KSig RC: not at all too sure what to make of your posting. Not that it really matters to me.
All I was indicating was that several posters or postings perked up my interest in John McNeil's case enough to do a fast, quick, down and dirty search on it. And that was enough to place it on my list of things to follow-up on when I have some time to do so.

[SOM]

Two rather interesting, well written and long articles on the back-stories and back-histories of the NRA and Gun Control:
Trayvon Martin and America's Gun Laws:
Battleground America One nation, under the gun
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2...urrentPage=all

The Secret History of Guns
The Ku Klux Klan, Ronald Reagan, and, for most of its history, the NRA all worked to control guns. The Founding Fathers? They required gun ownership-and regulated it. And no group has more fiercely advocated the right to bear loaded weapons in public than the Black Panthers-the true pioneers of the modern pro-gun movement. In the battle over gun rights in America, both sides have distorted history and the law, and there's no resolution in sight.
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/...-of-guns/8608/

[SOM]

The Real Injustice at the Heart of the Trayvon Martin Case-Did George Zimmerman Break the Law?
http://www.thenation.com/article/167...on-martin-case

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by SOM

KSig RC: not at all too sure what to make of your posting. Not that it really matters to me.
All I was indicating was that several posters or postings perked up my interest in John McNeil's case enough to do a fast, quick, down and dirty search on it. And that was enough to place it on my list of things to follow-up on when I have some time to do so.

What you posted was an abominably sourced and insanely biased "rundown" - something that was borderline intellectually dishonest. The New Republic is a fairly well-regarded magazine, while the site you posted is a bizarre tea party-oriented opinion site. I figured you thought you'd posted something from a real news source - my bad.

I was surprised to see you bump this thread today with something that literally calls the question ("Did he break the law?") instead of the most important leak in the case to date (the photo of the bloody back of Zimmerman's head).

[I2K Beta Mu]

Originally Posted by SOM

Your question has been covered by several reports. I would suggest reading some of stories of the past few days. IIRC Lionel did a segment or two on matter this week.

I see why it would be 2nd degree murder now. At first, I was confused on the two.

[SOM]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

What you posted was an abominably sourced and insanely biased "rundown" - something that was borderline intellectually dishonest. The New Republic is a fairly well-regarded magazine, while the site you posted is a bizarre tea party-oriented opinion site. I figured you thought you'd posted something from a real news source - my bad.

I was surprised to see you bump this thread today with something that literally calls the question ("Did he break the law?") instead of the most important leak in the case to date (the photo of the bloody back of Zimmerman's head).

Simple: No one, no story, no article, no pundit has been able to move me from Zimmerman becoming the only pure aggressor once he made his own mind up to leave his truck. To me, everything else that happened, that occurred is the result of that one conscious decision of Zimmerman's. Or what that wonderful phase from may an old cop show "Fruit of the poisonous vine" Which in turn would make Martin the only one standing his ground IF he was, it fact and truth, doing any sort of attacking. Or simply defending himself against someone attacking him with a visible gun. We could ague this but lets all see what the circus brings to town next ;>%

[KSig RC]

Originally Posted by SOM

Simple: No one, no story, no article, no pundit has been able to move me from Zimmerman becoming the only pure aggressor once he made his own mind up to leave his truck. To me, everything else that happened, that occurred is the result of that one conscious decision of Zimmerman's. Or what that wonderful phase from may an old cop show "Fruit of the poisonous vine" Which in turn would make Martin the only one standing his ground IF he was, it fact and truth, doing any sort of attacking. Or simply defending himself against someone attacking him with a visible gun. We could ague this but lets all see what the circus brings to town next ;>%

I actually agree with your sentiment, for the most part, but I'm just not sure how it aligns with Florida law, specifically with how jurors (on average) interpret those types of law.

I agree, also, that there's likely more to come ... hopefully it can be handled in a civil and positive manner. Also, I appreciate this bit of insight from you - the links are fine in and of themselves, but it's generally more interesting and useful to get an opinion based on them. Thanks, it's an interesting one.

[SOM]

Originally Posted by KSig RC

I actually agree with your sentiment, for the most part, but I'm just not sure how it aligns with Florida law, specifically with how jurors (on average) interpret those types of law.

I agree, also, that there's likely more to come ... hopefully it can be handled in a civil and positive manner. Also, I appreciate this bit of insight from you - the links are fine in and of themselves, but it's generally more interesting and useful to get an opinion based on them. Thanks, it's an interesting one.

My understanding of Stand you Ground is that once someone becomes the "aggressor", they stay the "aggressor". Even when/if they start to lose the very "fight" they started. In other words, one can not flip-flop and claim to be to aggrieved if they lose the fight they started. Or in this case, perhaps, self-defense/protecting ones own life after making a threat on another.