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  #61  
Old 05-06-2005, 04:36 PM
kddani kddani is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by carnation
I've always felt like the reason that many Southern schools put out a booklet with pictures and suggestions of what to wear is because they want all the PNMs to feel prepared and not be embarrassed by feeling underdressed. If you didn't have the booklet, you might have several girls, maybe from small country towns, perhaps showing up at parties in casual sundresses on Pref Day or (name other situation that would embarrass the PNM). No one wants PNMs to be humiliated....I think the booklets are for the benefit of the PNMs, not to come off like Nazis.
That's all well and good, but from what everyone says here it seems that what the girls actually dress like is above what is shown in the booklets. So the girls who actually dress like what's suggested are still underdressed compared to everyone else
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  #62  
Old 05-06-2005, 04:43 PM
carnation carnation is offline
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I think you're right, Dani, but some girls will always do that in any situation--dress a notch above what the situation requires--and I don't know what can be done about that. I recall that many PNMs on GC have been advised to do just that!

Panhellenic can't win--if they don't publish a booklet, girls feel unprepared and gauche. If they do, some people dress up more than required and still leave PNMs feeling unprepared and gauche.
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  #63  
Old 05-06-2005, 04:46 PM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by kddani
That's all well and good, but from what everyone says here it seems that what the girls actually dress like is above what is shown in the booklets. So the girls who actually dress like what's suggested are still underdressed compared to everyone else
And I think the only way to eliminate that WOULD be to say "you must wear shorts, you must not wear a black dress, or you cannot participate in rush." But if they said that, they'd get accused of hazing or something.

In a competitive rush environment, the only way to get changes made is to make them mandatory.
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  #64  
Old 05-06-2005, 04:55 PM
bekibug bekibug is offline
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Exactly. Not to mention, sometimes it is too hot for even capris down here. Especially up there with the river not far away...humidity off the charts. Nobody wants swamp-butt during recruitment!
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  #65  
Old 05-06-2005, 08:00 PM
Wine&SilverBlue Wine&SilverBlue is offline
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The problem with me and shorts is:

The only khaki shorts I really see are:

a) the pleated soccer-mom "knee length" shorts
b) the super-short cut-off "hollister type" shorts which I would assume are not appropriate for rush

nice jeans, a knee length skirt etc are preferable to khaki shorts... even a khaki skirt is better (although I don't have one of those either)

at my school the "recommended" dress code was:

day 1: jeans w/ a provided t-shirt when I rushed, jeans w/ a white t-shirt last year

day 2: nice jeans or khakis with a nice shirt

day 3: dress pants/somewhat dressy skirt etc

prefs: dress/skirt ("what you'd wear to temple or church" but no evening gowns or anything)

I wore nice jeans on day 2 since I feel more comfortable in them than khakis
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  #66  
Old 05-07-2005, 02:33 AM
alphaalpha alphaalpha is offline
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I wear shorts all the time, there is something in between the soccer mom and the "daisy Duke" shorts. I perconnally love shorts that come about half way to my knees and i have many styles that are very flattering and also really nice looking especially with a sweater. I would think saying to wear khaki shorts would imply more of a syle rather than a color. UP here in washington we use the word, incorrectly, khaki to describe a style that can be a variety of colors.

just a thought. debbie

ps, i also thought that the no black dress thing was so that the PNMs did not blend in the the sorority women cause they will be wearing black???
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  #67  
Old 05-07-2005, 04:00 AM
Buttonz Buttonz is offline
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I can't believe I've missed this thread! As far as I know, SDT did get a few girls from COB. I haven't heard anything about the chapter closing. I am going to be trying to get in contact with my friend so I can give you all the latest information.
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  #68  
Old 05-08-2005, 03:42 AM
SDTSarah SDTSarah is offline
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This is unofficial, but the chapter did get some girls through COB and will not be closing, as far as I know. I met one of their girls at our Leadership Convention this February, and she seemed really enthusiastic and positive about the chapter.
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  #69  
Old 05-10-2005, 01:54 AM
LightBulb LightBulb is offline
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My sister said that she met the SDTs at Panhellenic Weekend or something like that, and she said that there are about 20 of them. Good job SDT, and I hope you continue to grow again!
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  #70  
Old 05-28-2005, 11:45 AM
Zillini Zillini is offline
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I'm new to this BB and just read through this thread. I'll tell you what I know about the attire change as well as some other stuff.

Let me give you a little history first for those who don't know about UA. 6, maybe 7 years ago Panhellenic, at the strong urging of the Administration, started taking steps to move towards a no-frills Recruitment. That first year a budget cap was placed on Recruitment and it was lowered the following year. Philanthropy Day was incorporated for 2nd round (used to be called 10 party day here) in place of what was an additional skit day. Some additional minor restrictions were placed like no balloons. But then the no-frills progression stopped for some unknown reason.

Now this year the Admin is once again pursuing no-frills. In the Spring there was a Panhellenic Recruitment meeting where a poll was taken asking what the chapters would like to see PNMs wear for 1st round. (In the past PNMs typically wore sundresses.) We were given 2 options: shorts or nice capri outfits. Of course all the actives were very upset by the proposed changes but given only these choices, they went with capris. Apparently this poll was disregarded because we were informed that PNMs would be instructed to wear shorts on 1st round (formerly known as Ice Water Tea and now called Open House). I'm told that the decision came from the Admin.

I asked my Recruitment Team (I'm a Chapter Advisor here) if they thought we should change what our actives wear for 1st round so that the PNMs wouldn't feel underdressed. They unanimously said no. For this year they don't believe PNMs will follow the guidelines, at least those who know the history of Bama Recruitment which most of them do. The team was afraid the actives would appear underdressed. Plus, most of the actives have already spent money on their attire and we it wouldn't be fair to require them to go out and buy something else. After this year, we'll re-evaluate what we wear.

As another poster said (apologies for not remembering who), the University is making efforts to dramatically increase student enrollment. Interesting tidbit is that most of the University's additional recruiting efforts are of out-of-state students. That could mean that some of the old "traditions" may change simply because these new members won't be locked into the past unlike in-state students.

The other expected result of this student population increase is that PNM numbers will also significantly increase in the years to come. Last year was the largest pool of PNMs we've ever experienced and was just shy of 1,000. Quota ended up being (I think) 58, 4 of which were upper classman. Rumors have been running around that this year it may be 2,000-2,500. Based on past year's rumors vs actual, I anticipate maybe 1,200-1,500.

Like anything else in life, this brings good news and bad. The good news is obviously the Greek system here will remain strong, unlike alot of campuses throughout the country where Greek numbers are dwindling. Again as another poster stated, average actual membership total is around 140 while Panhellenic Chapter Total is still set at 125. Last year a Panhellenic proposal was made to increase Chapter Total to 140, but was abandoned due to the fact that it was too soon. It was decided that we need to experience a few years of large numbers before changing Chapter Total and when we do, it should be increased slowly and not all at once. (The NPC Green Book used to state that increases/decreases should only be made in increments of 5, but apparently that was eliminated.) Another valid point was that we shouldn't change Chapter Total until all houses are at least within "striking range" of total and there are still some houses that are struggling. If we increase it before that, then it would make it even harder for those chapters to achieve Total.

Also, assuming these increases continue I wouldn't be surprised if Panhellenic looks to invite another GLO to colonize here. The numbers are potentially so large that the current houses can't handle them all. But at this time there is no real discussion of that, merely speculation.

Another plus for the system has obviously been financial. The more members you have, the more money you have. Most of the fixed costs in running a chapter with a house don't increase (or decrease) regardless of the number of members you have. So larger house totals have allowed many of the sororities to have additional money for house maintenance and other expenses. With the exception of only a couple, most of the houses are pretty old and eat up money in maintenance.

Something else, a little more than a year ago the Tuscaloosa City Council passed an ordinance requiring all student housing, including sororities and fraternities, to have fire sprinkler systems. I've heard the lowest estimate was $80,000 and that was for one of the smallest houses (meaning physical size). The only thing delaying this is that the University's water system must be upgraded before it can be implemented, so we have a few years reprieve. But obviously everyone needs to be saving now or will need to take out loans.

Now for the bad news. The physical houses simply cannot hold this many members. Almost all the chapters have been told by the Fire Inspector that they cannot hold Chapter Meetings in their houses because they exceed capacity. At this time it's not stopping anyone, but soon no one will physically be able to fit all their members in their house at one time. We'll all need to look for alternative meeting locations on campus, which are also somewhat limited. Sororities may have to stagger scheduling for meetings. Both of these things violate strong traditions on this campus and nobody wants to change, although soon we'll have no choice.

Another problem is simply having such a large pledge class. For us and I'm sure other chapters, we had to have some actives take on multiple little sisters. We also recruited upperclassmen to take another one. Normally we have minimum GPA requirements for big sisters because it is a privillege and we want good role models. But we had to relax that simply because we didn't have the numbers.

Then there is the problem of recruiting with huge PNM parties. We're one of the larger houses and every single active had to recruit. Sometimes we couldn't have rotation groups because there weren't enough members left to start the bumps. I'm sure the smaller houses had to double or triple up the PNMs. It's difficult enough to determine if one PNM is a good fit in only 15 minutes or so, imagine how hard it must be to rate 3 or 4? Plus, I'm sure it's only a matter of time before the Fire Inspector puts a stop to these massive numbers in the houses at once.

Personally, I think we need to add additional parties to each round but so far that's not in the cards. This year we will be implementing the new NPC Release Figure system, so we'll just have to wait and see how it affects the size of each party. But as I understand how this new system works, the smallest houses are still going to have the largest parties while the large houses will have the smaller ones. That's still going to make it hard for the small houses to effectively recruit simply due to the numbers.

Finally, one pledge class being so large completely throws off the balance of a Chapter. This can really come into play during officer elections, membership selection voting and such. You've got the most inexperienced class that if they present a united front can completely control any vote. As the newest members they don't fully grasp the history of a chapter, it's goals and (at least in regards to elections) the history of various individual members.

Oops, almost forgot that freshman tend to have the lowest GPAs since it's their first time away from home and "Wow, you mean I don't have to go to class if I don't want to? Party time!" This can trash a chapter's GPA. Hey, we all have scholarship programs but you can't make someone study or go to class if they don't to. (Personally this is the biggest reason why I don't like initiating after only 6-8 weeks. Making someone pull grades before getting initiated was a huge incentive.)

Oh my, I had no intention of creating such a long post. Stuff just kept popping into my head that I wanted to talk about.
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  #71  
Old 05-28-2005, 02:45 PM
FSUZeta FSUZeta is offline
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zillini, welcome to greekchat!! and thanks for such an interesting, informative post. i don't know which sorority you are an advisor for, but they are one lucky house. you definately have a grasp on all aspects of sorority life. i am sure that you know that several colleges(uga and fsu, i know) use the new release figures and it seems to be too early to tell if it is helping the smaller chapters to grow(not enough years to give good statistics). i do know that at fsu it has not negatively impacted the larger houses. please keep us updated on changes at bama.

and i agree. a large majority of admin. seem to be pushing for no frills recruitment-but the sororities and pnms keep doing their own thing. i do feel sorry for the young woman who takes the recruitment info. from the school verbatim, and shows up for recruitment without recs, in her shorts. the admin. should just stay out of it.

Last edited by FSUZeta; 05-28-2005 at 02:48 PM.
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  #72  
Old 05-29-2005, 09:58 AM
Zillini Zillini is offline
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Thanks for the welcome! Sorry I forgot to mention I'm an ADPi.
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  #73  
Old 05-30-2005, 12:05 AM
33girl 33girl is offline
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Originally posted by FSUZeta
and i agree. a large majority of admin. seem to be pushing for no frills recruitment-but the sororities and pnms keep doing their own thing. i do feel sorry for the young woman who takes the recruitment info. from the school verbatim, and shows up for recruitment without recs, in her shorts. the admin. should just stay out of it.
Actually, NPC passed a resolution about 10 years ago that all campuses should move toward a less frilly rush, with less emphasis on costumes and skits and more on conversation. Obviously that hasn't happened. The only thing that has happened is more rules about whether you go over the amount of balloons you can have in the room and increased infraction penalties, which defeats the entire concept. It was a resolution with very little teeth in it that should have never been passed if the member groups didn't intend to enforce it.

If administrations have begun pushing for a less frilly rush, perhaps it's because they are tired of NPC talking out of both sides of their mouth.
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  #74  
Old 05-30-2005, 11:00 AM
Zillini Zillini is offline
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As a Financial Advisor I'm all for moving to a no-frills Recruitment. Every year I look around at the parties and while everything is incredibly beautiful, all I can think of is how that money could have been spent on something more useful than flowers, equipment rental, etc. Or we might even be able to reduce dues. But I'm enough of a realist to know that we need to be competitive, so I keep signing those checks.

IMHO, Panhellenics and Admins have things backwards. If they truly want to go no frills, then cut the budgets. Then address the piddly stuff like wardrobe after you eliminate the out of control spending.

The first thing I'd like to see is Bama's Panhellenic and/or Admin do is crack down on alumnae donations for Recruitment. They're not supposed to, but it still happens. If you're fortunate to have an active and generous Alumnae Association you've got a real leg up on everyone else. Sadly, we don't so all expenses come out of the actives pocket.

Second, I'd like to see some sort of auditing of each sororities Recruitment budgets they turn in. Even though there's an official spending cap there are ways around it. Just because you turn something in doesn't mean it accurately reflects what was spent.
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