msl2008, have you considered creating a point system (excluding hazing) that incorporates your organizations central values? For example, the chapter I advise uses a point system that awards a pledge points for:
1) academic achievement (A's or B's on tests, 2.8+ GPA, etc.)
2) community service (number of hours, etc.)
3) participation in intramurals (spectating/supporting, participating as an athlete, etc.)
4) participation in other student organizations (leadership roles, membership, etc.)
5) recruitment of future members (providing names, bringing interested men out to events, etc.)
6) knowledge of history/lore/songs (grades on quizzes and final exam)
7) participation in chapter, pledge class, or University events.
8) Chapter/Brotherhood vote that rank the pledges in last week of pledging.
9) Financial responsibility (payment of dues early or on time)
Each section has a minimum point requirement and there is an overall minimum that must be met to be considered for initiation. As you can see, this system still requires a large effort on their part to to get the points, but all while being a GOOD member. The highest number of points gets the lowest roll number in the pledge class.
Ok...assuming you do use the point system right? How does that show any type of brotherhood. That just means that you have time to give to the organization. Good, but why should I trust or treat this person any differently then anyone I could've met in any random club?
Again, you are wrong.
Chico State's "A Fraternity Hazing Gone Wrong"
Fraternity Man Guilty of Hazing in a Death[/quote]
These 2 deaths aren't b/c of pushups. One is b/c of water intoxication and one is b/c he was basically beaten to death.
KSUviolet, I voted for Obama back in November b/c I thought he was better than McCain. However, I do not think we need the bailout or healthcare for everyone. What we need is to let people be responsible for themselves. I am sick and tired of Americans constantly complaining about everything and anything like little kids. If you bought a house you can't afford. Tough. It was your choice. If you didn't save anything for retirement. Tough. The next generation is probably going to have to take care of themselves b/c Medicare and Social Security (which is a giant Ponzi Scheme btw) so as Americans we should learn to be responsible and take responsibility for our actions. Likewise, if you're truly an adult at 18, I would think you would know right from wrong so I would assume you know when to quit.
And as I said, this thread is assuming hazing involves pushups/situps whatever so please don't show me things about getting beaten to death or water poisoning b/c I'm already sold on those.
I like to compare it to a football practice or any sport for that matter. If you're hydrated and pushed yet people are more careful, what exactly is the problem? I agree things get out of hand. However, let's assume they don't. Would your thoughts be any different? Say those kids never died? Would we still be having this discussion?
