Of the 3 Big Ten schools of which I'm pretty familiar, I'd say it's in a PNM's best interest to try and get recs at Northwestern. This is mainly because recruitment is deferred, and if you don't already know a handful of women in each house, recs may help. A significant percentage (near 40) of students are Greek at NU, and I'm sure the majority of them did not have rec letters, but if you don't already know a ton of folks in all the chapters, you're going to want to get those introduction letters.
So, in short, I'd stick NU on the "Up For Debate" list

Does anyone have more info about other UC's? I've heard UCLA and Cal, as well as Merced and Santa Cruz mentioned, but I'm curious about the more middle-tier ones, like SB, Davis, Irvine, etc. Just because I'm going to one in the fall and I know a lot of girls who are going to UCs, too. Also maybe SDSU, Northridge or Long Beach? Thanks! :)

No. It's helpful at DPU, but not required.

Okay, so I'll be headed to Washington and Lee next year, and I just really want to know what exactly i should have/how many recs and which pictures I should send in.

I'm from Texas and I was prepping for UT rush just in case, so now I think that I have way more than is needed. I talked to a person in charge there and she told me that she could always tell the Texas girls from the size of their envelopes...but she didn't tell me what I specifically needed. I'll probably call her later this week, but here's what I have:

Portraits: full length, 3/4 length, headshot, and wallet size professional pictures
Social resume completed
transcripts and SAT/ACT scores on hand
at least three people who will write a good letter of rec for each sorority

any advice? Thanks!

As far as I know most of the mid-level UC's and all the CSU's I know of don't really do recs. I am sure they take them but it will not hurt you if you do not have them. Please correct me if I am wrong. I know at SJSU you do not need recs at least right now.

I'd recommend PMing breathesgelatin if she doesn't pop by this thread. She is a W&L alum and now a grad student at UT.

I can't speak for the other UCs, for sure, but recs are not important at Irvine. :)

As a W&L alum, my 2c. I went in knowing NOTHING, no recs, nothing. I ended up where I belonged. I'm pretty sure my chapter is one that "finds" recs for people. However, I don't know about other chapters.

I would say that recs are not imperitive but help. My chapter and at least two others do not require them, but we did accept them and look at them.

FWIW I heard a girl from one chapter say "God, we hate recs because it makes more work for us." I don't honestly know how much of this is hyperbole.





ETA -- Also, on closer reading of your post, it's generally way more than you need. Because of Winter Term rush, the girls will know you and your REAL resume (the W&L one) and probably won't even look at your high school resume. Who cares what you did in high school if everyone already knows you as "that girl"? Best Advice: Go out, be seen, be friendly. Join clubs. Go on EVERY rushdate you're offered no matter what you think of the sorority as a whole (the girls who take you may change your mind). DO NOT BE THAT GIRL. Keep yourself under control when you go out.

thanks for all of the advice! I kind of assumed that I'm over-prepared, but it's hard not to be with all of the information that's been thrown at me for big southern state school type recruitment, so this is a wonderful relief! I'm not going to include everything I have because I really feel like it's excessive.

I'm really excited about rushing and W&L in general. I can hardly wait! thanks again!

I would go ahead and submit a rec for every chapter, esp if you already have them. Despite what I heard, I really don't think it would hurt and we definitely DO get girls, esp from the deep south, who submit one or more. But anything else is unnecessary. Greek life at W&L is wonderful and there are great girls in EVERY srat (as you will hear them called). I would love to hear a recruitment story from you when the time comes.

I didn't see it listed. But, Southern Miss is also a school where recs are required.

Most of Big 12 yes but you definitely do not need recs at colorado

totally agree with you violet!

yesterday i was looking on a few college panhellenic websites and i was shocked to see on a particular sorority's site the following paraphrased statement,"it is our responsibility to find a recommendation for any pnm who does not have one." while it is politically correct to say this, it is so far from the truth it's not funny. on top of that, it is one of the most sought after chapters at that particular college, which has a very competitive recruitment. they should be ashamed of themselves.

I wanted to add my two cents about CU. They're certainly not mandatory, but they are really really helpful and my chapter tended to get a bunch of them and that was really nice, especially when recruitment numbers are about to hit one thousand or so.

But then again, I worked with reference every year I was active, so maybe that's the only reason I find them so helpful. haha.

How much would it hurt you to not have recs at USC. No one in my family at all has gone greek, and I don't know anyone that has either even outside of my family.

southern cal or south carolina?

Actually, FSUZeta, recs are highly desirable / essential at either one, right?

you are right, exlurker.

if the poster will tell us which "usc" she is referring to, she might get better, more specific information.

Hi Beeish!!!!

(I sort of know her). As you know my daughter went through at USC last fall. She had 3 recs (not the four that I thought she had) going into recruitment. My daughter pledged a house where she did not have a rec. They did get one for her. But she knew a girl in the house already, so that helped.

Do you know anyone from the dorms who can help you? Sometimes they have access to alums who are willing to help. Depending on the house it may be necessary to have them. I know that my daughter went into Pref with one with and one without a rec. She had other options but these were her top choices. She was lucky. But in general, they help.

Email me and I will be more specific. Have a WONDERFUL summer (err, winter) vacation.

Ellebud

Southern California sorry, I forget there are two

What about Miami of Ohio?

Another Thread?
 

This is just a thought so anyone please feel free to shoot down the idea. It won't bother me. Since we have a thread about Schools where you need recs, would it be acceptable to maybe make a thread for PNMs about various schools (in one thread)?

Example:
(A.) School Name / (# of sororities on campus)
(B.) (need or don't need recs)
(C.) For specific information regarding recruitment, please refer to-
(1.) "Specific Current Members/ Alumnae" of Kentucky
(D.) # of Sororities on campus doing Rush (Fall)-possibly names
(E.) # of Sororities on campus doing Rush (Spring)-possibly names
(F.) Anything else of an important nature

We would put it in the same way we do the recruitment dates. I just think it would be helpful to get ideas from members of those schools. For example, if I wanted to learn more about Kentucky recruitment, I would ask Sydney B. If I wanted to know about Florida State, I know I could ask FSUZeta. It just makes sense to know who might have more insider knowledge. That way, people wouldn't be stepping on other people's toes with suggestions. I wouldn't think of giving advice for Ole Miss just as our Ole Miss members wouldn't feel comfortable handing out information about Penn State.

This is just a suggestion. Thoughts?

No one would ever search it, they'll just make their own posts anyway and the experts can get paged/showup as they do now.

I totally agree.

Plus, if the young 'uns were wise enough to do a search to find that post then likely they were likely wise enough to just do a search and find their greek life website (which has most of the proposed info anyway).

But where would they find out who's hot and who's not and who has the best reputation and hangs out with the sexy guys and not the nerds?

At least PNMs would know exactly who to ask for recs...:)...just kidding!

Please tell me you are kidding.

I'm allowed to say this cause I'm ancient.

Just because I went to XYZ U 20 years ago doesn't mean I necessarily know diddly about what goes on now. This was pointed up by the person's mom (possibly apocryphal) who told her to wait and rush her junior year at a SEC school, because heck, there was no problem for juniors to join when she went to school in the 70s. If we did this, I'm sure a person just like that would get hella annoyed that she wasn't the "go-to."

Older GCers I'm sure can think of some people who while they are very enthusiastic alums of their schools/Greek systems aren't the best to go to for "expert advice."

Yeah, not essential -- my chapter usually received about 50 recs, with around 900-1100 PNMs. It's a competitive recruitment so it can help you get a leg up, but most do fine without them.

Alright. I just figured it was a good idea if anyone wanted to start a thread like that. I'm sure everyone knows I couldn't start it because I have no idea how rush works at many of the other schools and as 33girl pointed out (for those of us who have since graduated), I graduated from Penn State a few years ago and I wouldn't be the best person to ask because there are CURRENT PSU students on here.

Nevermind. No worries. It was just a suggestion.

If any veteran GCers could possibly help me find recs for my competitive ACC school, please PM me! (Yes, I have already scoured the Greek Life website, as well as each chapter's local site, and while it does have an address of where to send recs, it offers absolutely no help as to whom I should obtain them from).

Best ways to find recs:

*Absolutely EXHAUST ALL of your personal contacts. You never know WHO is a sorority alumna or KNOWS a sorority alumna who may be willing to write recs.

Who should you ask?

Teachers
Coaches
Family members (cousins, etc)
Parents' friends/coworkers (even Dad's friends)
women in your church/temple/etc.
Former camp counselors and such

This isn't an all inclusive list, but it should get you started.

Also:

*Contact the alumnae panhellenic closest to you:

http://www.npcwomen.org/alumnae-panhellenics/directory.aspx

Many of them routinely help with recs (esp. if they are near a competitive school). They will let you know what they need from you (info, resume, etc) in order to help.

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what is the point of recs? On my school website, it says they are not necessary and we will not be penalized if you don't have them. Yet, on here, it says my school is a place where we absolutely positively need them. Thankfully, I've already gotten recs for almost every sorority, but I was just wondering WHY we need them? Do they help us not get cut or something?

The purpose of a rec is for the chapter to get to know a little about a PNM before recruitment. Sounds simple and non-controversial.

You go to a competitive school. Almost every PNM has recs from alumnae so chapters know how wonderful they are before recruitment.

NPC has devised a system where each chapter is asked to invite back a certain number of women for each round to maximize the number of women placed (RFM). Some chapters are forced to make steep cuts after the first round. Say 1,000 women are going through and a chapter has to cut 500 after round 1. All they have to go on is twenty-ish minutes of conversation time---and a rec---if you don't already know women in the chapter. Chapters like this have to hunt for a reason to cut PNMs sometimes. Maybe they don't consciously decide to cut all PNMs without a rec, but in the case of two PNMs with similar stats and similar quality conversations, only one has a rec, and the other doesn't, who will get cut? That's right, the girl without the rec. Sure, it happens that PNMs without recs get bids even at top chapters at competitive schools, but no one should count on being that lucky.

There is actually some NPC policy that requires Campus Panhellenics to de-emphasize the importance of recs. They are doing a huge disservice to PNMs from areas where Greek life is not as big and few understand the importance of recs (like a Northern girl at an SEC school).

My guess as to the reasons for this policy is that recs, a "get to know you" tool, can be interpreted as a "who you know" game, and that recruitment should be about who you are rather than who you know.

It also sounds ridiculous to me how Panhellenic can say "you won't be penalized" for not having a rec. Panhellenic can mandate how many women a chapter may invite back, but they can't tell a chapter how to choose those women. Sounds like a flat out lie to me.

OK! Great, thanks to you and KSUViolet for answering my question. That's the part I was most confused about. I don't get why they stated that on the website because it makes it sound like you won't get cut for not having a rec...

It's also like when Panhellenics say "you won't be penalized for missing parties with an excused absence". It'd be totally unfair for women missing parties to be automatically invited back to every chapter from the previous round. Again, it's an issue of the amount of information a chapter has about a PNM.

After us talking about this dichotomy umpteen times, I think part of it is also - Panhellenic can make rules or statements about ITS OWN policies but it can't make them about the policies of its member groups.

If you don't have recs - Panhellenic won't or can't penalize you. They won't keep you from going to as many parties as girls who do have them. They won't charge you more $$. They won't drop you from rush.

But Panhellenic as an entity doesn't know the policies of each sorority and what it does with recs. They don't know that XYZ could care less about them and makes paper hats out of them and that ABC won't give a girl a bid if she doesn't have a rec from an alumna of the chapter she is pledging. (Hypothetical examples.)

So they really are telling the truth when they say recs aren't necessary to go through rush (a Panhellenic sponsored activity). It would be interesting if the actual sorority chapters mentioned that recs are beneficial to have on their individual websites - but then you have the people saying "I had a rec, why wasn't I bid?"

Not that any of this is fair in the least to the girls, but if you look at it abstractly, it's understandable why they use the attitude and verbiage they use.