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-   -   Schools where you absolutely positively need recs (http://www.greekchat.com/gcforums/showthread.php?t=112718)

Titchou 10-02-2012 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zillini (Post 2182568)
I've also seen examples where Annie Active's rush crush doesn't have a Rec and so Annie scrambles to get her one. Annie calls alumnae she knows, asks other actives from the PNM's hometown if they know alumnae who might know the PNM, searches through the alumnae directory in that hometown, etc. I doubt those PNMs ever knew they suddenly had a Rec submitted on their behalf.

Love those late night calls!

abbylouise 11-04-2012 07:54 PM

so just to be clear for my own sake, recs are going to be make or break at University of Alabama right?

thetalady 11-04-2012 08:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abbylouise (Post 2187868)
so just to be clear for my own sake, recs are going to be make or break at University of Alabama right?

As stated really clearly on this list, YES you absolutely, positively must have recs for NPC rush at Alabama:

Quote:

Originally Posted by violetpretty
You Must Have Recs If You Are Attending Any Of These Schools:
All SEC schools (no exceptions!): Kentucky, Tennessee, South Carolina, Georgia, Florida, Auburn, Alabama, Ole Miss, Miss State, Arkansas, Vandy, LSU, Texas A&M


ladybug12 11-05-2012 02:17 PM

And, if any way possible, go for Panhellenic Weekend in the spring.

33girl 11-05-2012 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by abbylouise (Post 2187868)
so just to be clear for my own sake, recs are going to be make or break at University of Alabama right?

"Make or break" is not the phrase to use. You probably will get cut if you don't have them, but having them does NOT mean you WON'T get cut.

gatorgeneration 11-09-2012 07:28 AM

May seem like a dumb question, but for SEC school's spring recruitment, would recs be considered more or less important? And how much more value are placed personal recs vs info only recs?

Titchou 11-09-2012 07:43 AM

Not to be snarky, but what part of "absolutely positively need" don't you understand????
Yes, they are needed in the spring. And yes, personal recs are needed. Info only doesn't cut it. They can get that same info from your registration form, FB page, school yearbook. The really true reason for the rec is the intangible - your character. And it isn't a recommendation unless the writer recommends you for membership - and an info only one does carry that recommendation.

gatorgeneration 11-09-2012 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188627)
Not to be snarky, but what part of "absolutely positively need" don't you understand????
Yes, they are needed in the spring. And yes, personal recs are needed. Info only doesn't cut it. They can get that same info from your registration form, FB page, school yearbook. The really true reason for the rec is the intangible - your character. And it isn't a recommendation unless the writer recommends you for membership - and an info only one does carry that recommendation.

Again, I acknowledge it may have come off as a dumb question, but I know at SEC schools informal spring recruitment is completely different from the formal recruitment held in the fall. Thought it couldn't hurt to ask.

FSUZeta 11-09-2012 09:58 AM

The structure of Spring Recruitment at UF is different than Fall Formal Recruitment, in as much as PNMs won't visit every chapter, because not every chapter will be able to take new members because those chapters are above campus total. Despite that difference, as Titchou suggested, a PNM going through Spring Recruitment at UF should make sure she has recommendations. It is the format of the parties that is different in the spring, not the "requirements" that the PNMs need to meet to receive a bid.

Titchou 11-09-2012 08:30 PM

Exactly, FSUZeta. Only the format is different. All other rules apply.

Hartofsec 11-09-2012 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188627)
Not to be snarky, but what part of "absolutely positively need" don't you understand????
Yes, they are needed in the spring. And yes, personal recs are needed. Info only doesn't cut it. They can get that same info from your registration form, FB page, school yearbook. The really true reason for the rec is the intangible - your character. And it isn't a recommendation unless the writer recommends you for membership - and an info only one does carry that recommendation.

Chances are, for a PNM who has already been on campus for a semester, a lot more is already known about her "character" than some lady who taught her in Sunday school can vouch for. Just sayin'.

FWIW, for the more recently colonized chapters at UofA, for instance, it is not necessarily easy for PNMs (instate, anyway) to find alums of those chapters who have known them forever, such that the alum can vouch for their "character," anyway.

I know girls have pledged these chapters with informational recs that were submitted by alums who did not know them well (even in fall formal rush). For spring recruitment, these recs would be better than not having a recommendation at all.

Titchou 11-09-2012 11:19 PM

Not to get another argument going with you, Hart, but this is not true for us in Alabama. As I write this, you may be very surprised to know that we have 727 alumnae listed in the Birmingham area. I just checked the database. The latest state info I have is from May and there were 2,078 alumnae listed.

Just saying, we are around - people assume that since we've been gone from Alabama since 1978 that we've faded out. They forget that we have 4 other chapters in the state and people who move in.

33girl 11-10-2012 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2188718)
Chances are, for a PNM who has already been on campus for a semester, a lot more is already known about her "character" than some lady who taught her in Sunday school can vouch for. Just sayin'.

Couldn't the same apply to a girl who knows/is known by many people on campus before she even starts school her first semester?

DubaiSis 11-10-2012 12:50 AM

I really think at some point the rec is just checking a box. Yes, if the girl has a semester worth of grades, friendships and college activities, I can't see what good a rec will do. But the sad but truth is they are still required. Just because (IMO) it's a ridiculous, time consuming and unhelpful step, it is still necessary. Once you have joined a sorority, graduated and transitioned into alumnae membership and leadership, then you can start to work toward eliminating this step. But until then, you have to keep playing the game.

Hartofsec 11-10-2012 01:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188727)
Not to get another argument going with you, Hart, but this is not true for us in Alabama. As I write this, you may be very surprised to know that we have 727 alumnae listed in the Birmingham area. I just checked the database. The latest state info I have is from May and there were 2,078 alumnae listed.

Just saying, we are around - people assume that since we've been gone from Alabama since 1978 that we've faded out. They forget that we have 4 other chapters in the state and people who move in.


I am surprised to hear that there are that many alumnae in B’ham. I’m just responding from my POV of knowing PNMs here over the years (including my daughter) who gathered recs – alums of huge chapters from huge schools are more abundant, and happening to know an alum (well) from one of these chapters is more likely.

I’m not sure that the Bama chapter will have a huge impact on the alum numbers in B’ham in the very near future (I think 5 girls from the Birmingham Metro area combined pledged DG this year). But considering the alum numbers you quoted, you all can and should be making your presence known!

Apparently Alpha Phi alums are really difficult to locate here – I assume that this chapter understands and doesn’t view an informational rec in a negative light (I know several girls who pledged a few years ago without personally knowing an alum who could vouch for their "character").

It may be far easier for out-of-state PNMs to locate alums they know well for some of the newer chapters at Bama (Gamma Phi Beta included – which probably has far greater alum numbers in other states as compared to Alabama).

.

Hartofsec 11-10-2012 01:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 33girl (Post 2188732)
Couldn't the same apply to a girl who knows/is known by many people on campus before she even starts school her first semester?

Yes, it can. I'm sure plenty of PNMs have been dropped because they were known by girls in a chapter -- even with recs on file vouching for their "character."

Titchou 11-10-2012 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2188739)
I am surprised to hear that there are that many alumnae in Bíham. Iím just responding from my POV of knowing PNMs here over the years (including my daughter) who gathered recs Ė alums of huge chapters from huge schools are more abundant, and happening to know an alum (well) from one of these chapters is more likely.

Iím not sure that the Bama chapter will have a huge impact on the alum numbers in Bíham in the very near future (I think 5 girls from the Birmingham Metro area combined pledged DG this year). But considering the alum numbers you quoted, you all can and should be making your presence known!

.

I think I can comfortably say that we have at least one teacher in every OTM high school here - Mtn Brk, Vestavia, Oak Mtn, Hoover, Spain Park, Pelham, etc not to mention several other school systems and some who have taught in the past and know people in these schools or teach elsewhere int he school system.

What I found this past year is that the PNMs assume - and you know what happens when you do that! - there are few or none of us here. I had a mother contact me thru the alum web site asking for a rec as we are "new and don't have any alums here." I asked what school her daughter went to and where they lived. Turned out they knew 2 women they "assumed" were members of another group but were actually DGs. She had not asked a single one of the other alums who were doing recs for the daughter if they knew a DG. Poor networking.

LXA SE285 11-10-2012 05:09 PM

Alpha Phi has a Birmingham/Tuscaloosa alumnae chapter:

http://bhamalphaphi.tripod.com

DubaiSis 11-10-2012 07:16 PM

Also, using my current geography as an example, I'm in Southern California. We have just 2 collegiate chapters within a couple hours' drive. I went to my first alumnae meeting last weekend. The schools represented were Michigan, Illinois, Iowa, Iowa Wesleyan, Nebraska, Texas State, UNLV, Sonoma State and San Diego State (and not a single member from the 2 local chapters). So in short, just because a region doesn't have a collegiate chapter doesn't mean there aren't alumnae. We live in a very mobile society! Network Network Network!

ComradesTrue 11-10-2012 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DubaiSis (Post 2188803)
Also, using my current geography as an example, I'm in Southern California. We have just 2 collegiate chapters within a couple hours' drive. I went to my first alumnae meeting last weekend. The schools represented were Michigan, Illinois, Iowa, Iowa Wesleyan, Nebraska, Texas State, UNLV, Sonoma State and San Diego State (and not a single member from the 2 local chapters). So in short, just because a region doesn't have a collegiate chapter doesn't mean there aren't alumnae. We live in a very mobile society! Network Network Network!

Exactly! My alumnae chapter has members from over 30 different college chapters, stretching from Florida to Washington state. Why would people think that just because a town/area doesn't have a college chapter that there are no alumnae?

Hartofsec 11-10-2012 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blondie93 (Post 2188811)
Exactly! My alumnae chapter has members from over 30 different college chapters, stretching from Florida to Washington state. Why would people think that just because a town/area doesn't have a college chapter that there are no alumnae?

I donít think anyone would.

I was discussing locating an alum who knows the PNM well enough to write the type of recommendation that Titchou referred to as preferable in SEC recruitments, not to just locating any alum who can send along an info-only rec:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188627)
Yes, they are needed in the spring. And yes, personal recs are needed. Info only doesn't cut it. They can get that same info from your registration form, FB page, school yearbook. The really true reason for the rec is the intangible - your character. And it isn't a recommendation unless the writer recommends you for membership - and an info only one does carry that recommendation.

(emphasis mine)

Gathering this type of recommendation for such a large number of chapters may not be an issue in recruitments elsewhere, but locating several alums, from each of 17 chapters, who also personally know you, can be difficult and take quite a bit of time.

As with the Alpha Phi example -- even though an alum group exists in the B'ham/Tuscaloosa area, the number of those alums who personally know girls graduating from high schools in B'ham may be small. If the alum numbers are not abundant -- especially among women who may be connected to girls this age (like moms of high school girls) -- then PNMs may have difficulty locating an alum from that GLO who knows them personally.

Considering the task, I figure that the membership chairs at Alabama, for instance, receive a lot of info-only recs (which are certainly far preferable to no rec at all).

.

Hartofsec 11-10-2012 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188757)
I think I can comfortably say that we have at least one teacher in every OTM high school here - Mtn Brk, Vestavia, Oak Mtn, Hoover, Spain Park, Pelham, etc not to mention several other school systems and some who have taught in the past and know people in these schools or teach elsewhere int he school system.

Yikes! That could put the responsibility of upwards of 100 recs for some of those schools on one teacher (total -- written to chapters at various universities)! And considering the size of many of those schools, a single teacher would only have taught (and potentially personally know) probably 20% or less of those girls.

A number of teachers in my daughter's high school asked her if she planned to go through recruitment and offered to write a recommendation. I would be surprised if they did so to students they didn't know, however.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188757)
What I found this past year is that the PNMs assume - and you know what happens when you do that! - there are few or none of us here. I had a mother contact me thru the alum web site asking for a rec as we are "new and don't have any alums here." I asked what school her daughter went to and where they lived. Turned out they knew 2 women they "assumed" were members of another group but were actually DGs. She had not asked a single one of the other alums who were doing recs for the daughter if they knew a DG. Poor networking.

I think a lot of PNMs aren't really aware of how much time and networking this can involve -- especially if mom is not Greek. My observation has been that it is mostly the moms doing all the networking anyway. ;)

Have you all considered taking the game to the PNMs somewhat? If those alums were contacted and organized according to school district, then perhaps they could contact the potential (qualified) PNMs they know and offer to write recommendations. This might help get the word out about who the alums are in various communities.

Titchou 11-11-2012 12:02 AM

Well, that's the function of an Alum PH. And we have one now in Bham and are having an event for high school seniors in March at Samford. Two sessions....AM and PM and will have reps from most of the colleges in Alabama. We have contacted all high schools in Birmingham and will be providing flyers,etc to each. We will have fashion shows, speakers on various topics (most if not all are current or former Council members of their NPC groups). So it should be very beneficial....no Rush Biddies needed. Come see us for free.

Hartofsec 11-11-2012 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LXA SE285 (Post 2188788)
Alpha Phi has a Birmingham/Tuscaloosa alumnae chapter:

http://bhamalphaphi.tripod.com


Yes, but according to their September 2012 newsletter, they only have 20 members in the cities of Birmingham and Tuscaloosa combined, and this is probably the only alumnae chapter in the state.

That helps explain why in-state PNMs have a difficult time locating Alpha Phi alums they know.

Hartofsec 11-11-2012 12:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188826)
Well, that's the function of an Alum PH. And we have one now in Bham and are having an event for high school seniors in March at Samford. Two sessions....AM and PM and will have reps from most of the colleges in Alabama. We have contacted all high schools in Birmingham and will be providing flyers,etc to each. We will have fashion shows, speakers on various topics (most if not all are current or former Council members of their NPC groups). So it should be very beneficial....no Rush Biddies needed. Come see us for free.

Terrific! I didn't know the PH group had finally come to fruition and gotten "off the ground" so to speak.

Thanks for the info -- that really is a win/win. Will this include info on locating alums in the various communities that can write personal recommendations (like a list or something?).

The Rush Biddies will probably want to set up a booth. :rolleyes:

Titchou 11-11-2012 12:27 AM

If anyone in the Bham area needs an Alpha Phi rec, PM me as I can put them in touch with one of their alums here. And keep in mind that we don't need to know you personally. We just need to know someone who does that we trust.

And yes, Hart, we get together and go over the lists of women from various schools who are going thru recruitment. We may be "new again" at Alabama but we do know how it works.

Titchou 11-11-2012 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2188834)
Terrific! I didn't know the PH group had finally come to fruition and gotten "off the ground" so to speak.

Thanks for the info -- that really is a win/win. Will this include info on locating alums in the various communities that can write personal recommendations (like a list or something?).

The Rush Biddies will probably want to set up a booth. :rolleyes:

Yes, they will be able to "register" for future rec possibilities. They can presently do that...and we had several who contacted APH this fall. The president would simply email the groups on the PNM's campus and we'd take care of it. If you're in town, perhaps you should talk with your alum president. Am sure she knows all about us as we have contacted every NPC group in town.

Titchou 11-11-2012 09:24 AM

Alum PH has a FB page and a web site if they need other groups as well. And very few Bham girls went without a rec from us this year. They may not have know about it - but we had one.

AOII Angel 11-11-2012 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188856)
Alum PH has a FB page and a web site if they need other groups as well. And very few Bham girls went without a rec from us this year. They may not have know about it - but we had one.

LOL. Isn't that what we say on GC all the time?

Titchou 11-11-2012 01:40 PM

http://birminghampanhellenic.yolasite.com/

This is the web site. Hart failed to notice the one she posted is not Birmingham, AL.

Please do direct any Birmingham, ALABAMA area women to this one.

HQWest 11-11-2012 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188878)
http://birminghampanhellenic.yolasite.com/

This is the web site. Hart failed to notice the one she posted is not Birmingham, AL.

Please do direct any Birmingham, ALABAMA area women to this one.

LOL - yes it may be very difficult to learn about BAMA recruitment on the Birmingham MICHIGAN site. Although they can probably get plenty of good help from Michigan DGs and Gamma Phis?

HQWest 11-11-2012 04:08 PM

Before everyone got all worked up about the websites - remember having good recs from someone that knows you well from each sorority just makes you a BETTER candidate. Not having a rec from a sorority puts you at a disadvantage - it doesn't eliminate you (thanks in part to the hard work behind the scenes of alums like Titchou.)

The other thing to remember might be (especially if you are OOS) that if you are going to a school and you don't know anyone in the sorority and you don't know anyone at home from the sorority that you might really benefit from looking hard at the sororities where you do know someone. It might help later with having friends when you go home for the summer or with networking? Just my 2 cents worth...

Hartofsec 11-11-2012 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HQWest (Post 2188897)
Before everyone got all worked up about the websites - remember having good recs from someone that knows you well from each sorority just makes you a BETTER candidate. Not having a rec from a sorority puts you at a disadvantage - it doesn't eliminate you (thanks in part to the hard work behind the scenes of alums like Titchou.)

I actually kind of agree with you.

But that is not what is preached on this absolutely, positively must have a personal rec/what-do-you-not-understand-about-this/ MAKE-or-BREAK thread:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Titchou (Post 2188627)
Not to be snarky, but what part of "absolutely positively need" don't you understand????
Yes, they are needed in the spring. And yes, personal recs are needed. Info only doesn't cut it. They can get that same info from your registration form, FB page, school yearbook. The really true reason for the rec is the intangible - your character. And it isn't a recommendation unless the writer recommends you for membership - and an info only one does carry that recommendation.


Regarding rec-writing practices of which girls are unaware -- those questions/points were ignored:

Notwithstanding the eleventh-hour calls just prior to and during rush, regarding girls that a chapter is interested in but who do not have a rec, I donít totally understand the practice of writing recs on girls who are unaware that this is being done. If you preach to girls that they must have a rec from someone who can vouch for them personally, then why doesnít the alum writing the rec just call the girl and request the information from her?

At what point do these skate the edge of the ďinfo onlyĒ recs that you say are not acceptable?

Also -- if a PNM is unaware that she has a rec -- and knows that a rec is necessary to pledge -- isn't it possible that she may take this into consideration when ranking her invites?

WCsweet<3 11-11-2012 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2188900)
I actually kind of agree with you.

But that is not what is preached on this absolutely, positively must have a personal rec/what-do-you-not-understand-about-this/ MAKE-or-BREAK thread:




Regarding rec-writing practices of which girls are unaware -- those questions/points were ignored:

Notwithstanding the eleventh-hour calls just prior to and during rush, regarding girls that a chapter is interested in but who do not have a rec, I donít totally understand the practice of writing recs on girls who are unaware that this is being done. If you preach to girls that they must have a rec from someone who can vouch for them personally, then why doesnít the alum writing the rec just call the girl and request the information from her?

At what point do these skate the edge of the ďinfo onlyĒ recs that you say are not acceptable?

Also -- if a PNM is unaware that she has a rec -- and knows that a rec is necessary to pledge -- isn't it possible that she may take this into consideration when ranking her invites?

She could hope to be the exception if she falls in love with a house. Think of all the stories we have heard. If she likes it well enough putting it higher with ranking won't necessarily hurt her.

HQWest 11-11-2012 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hartofsec (Post 2188900)
I actually kind of agree with you.

But that is not what is preached on this absolutely, positively must have a personal rec/what-do-you-not-understand-about-this/ MAKE-or-BREAK thread:




Regarding rec-writing practices of which girls are unaware -- those questions/points were ignored:

Notwithstanding the eleventh-hour calls just prior to and during rush, regarding girls that a chapter is interested in but who do not have a rec, I donít totally understand the practice of writing recs on girls who are unaware that this is being done. If you preach to girls that they must have a rec from someone who can vouch for them personally, then why doesnít the alum writing the rec just call the girl and request the information from her?

At what point do these skate the edge of the ďinfo onlyĒ recs that you say are not acceptable?

Also -- if a PNM is unaware that she has a rec -- and knows that a rec is necessary to pledge -- isn't it possible that she may take this into consideration when ranking her invites?

So that if she falls in love with a chapter AND the chapter falls in love with her she can still get a bid.

Think of the "info only" rec like a background check. If a chapter wants to have a good mix of people or wants to build on their existing strengths they might take a chance on someone who is awesome but they just met day one of recruitment.

So Hartofsec - since encouraging young women and promoting your sorority is obviously of interest to you - have you volunteered with a chapter or to help your area Panhellenic?

brighteyedgirl 11-15-2012 06:54 PM

.

Titchou 11-15-2012 07:24 PM

Well, that's what a rec is - an introduction. So if you want the chapter members to know how wonderful you are before you step foot in the house, get recs!

FSUZeta 11-15-2012 07:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brighteyedgirl (Post 2189590)
I know everyone has said that you need them at Indiana, but I had my Rho Gamma meeting last night, and when I brought up the questions, the girls in my group looked pretty confused. My Rho Gamma told me that while I could send them, most girls actually didn't have them and they were only for introduction.


Is this true??

No. What you were told is the standard party line.

IUHoosiergirl88 11-15-2012 09:25 PM

Recs at Indiana are a great way to get your foot in the door before rush, but the vast majority of PNMs coming through don't have them.

AZTheta 11-16-2012 02:04 AM

excuse me, IUHoosiergirl88, can you please clarify something for me? When you write that "the vast majority of PNMs coming through don't have" recs, do you mean only in reference to your own chapter?

I ask, honestly, because I wouldn't know if a PNM had a rec for ADPi or any other chapter; only for my own chapter.


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