Initiation

[DSigKid]

Initiation is coming up... and I'm worried about it. Worried about the hazing. Advice?

[knight_shadow]

...the hell? :confused:

[skylark]

Be afraid... be verrry afraid.

On the off-chance that the OP is genuine...

Why do you think you will be hazed? Have you been told so? Are you just assuming that all fraternities haze so you will be hazed?

Odds are, you belong to an organization that either doesn't haze or "hazes" fairly lightly. My personal belief from knowing fraternity men and from reading articles is that the truly dangerous hazing is extremely rare. If you are hazed to the point that you feel uncomfortable ... refuse to do it and report them. It is as simple as that.

[APhi4Ever]

Have you experienced hazing during your new member period? Why are you scared about hazing during Initiation?

[tri deezy]

i don't think the op is legit

[APhi4Ever]

Me neither!

[DSigKid]

The Post is legitimate. I see the situations when people are severely injured and it scares the hell out of me. I do know they haze, because members often say so, but i don't know the extent.

[tri deezy]

well then that's not the real initiation. at least not if it's NPC or IFC. i guess maybe if it's a local...

[knight_shadow]

The Post is legitimate. I see the situations when people are severely injured and it scares the hell out of me. I do know they haze, because members often say so, but i don't know the extent.

If you're really nervous about hazing, why would you continue in your pursuit of this organization? If this organization is giving you the impression that they will haze you, GET OUT.

Also, we aren't in your organization, so we wouldn't know the extent either.

well then that's not the real initiation. at least not if it's NPC or IFC. i guess maybe if it's a local...

Not NALFO either. Initiation in my organization was a moving experience, ie. no hazing.

[DeltAlum]

I find it difficult to believe that any national organization has hazing as part of its ritual.

[ree-Xi]

The Post is legitimate. I see the situations when people are severely injured and it scares the hell out of me. I do know they haze, because members often say so, but i don't know the extent.


If inititation is something to be feared, then you need to re-think becoming a member of the organization. I am guessing much of what you "hear" is simply "rumour" - sometimes, the sheer mystery of initiation puts you in such a mental state that you don't know what to expect, and therefore subject to feeling intimidated and nervous.

If you are for real, and actually scared, talk to your pledge educator. Initiation should be exciting, and something to look forward to, not feared.

I have to say that in both cases, initiation for me was amazingly poignant. To me, it was a culmination of learning and experiencing, and solidifying the union of who I was to begin with, and the person I can become.

[Kevin]

Report the activity to your national for your safety and the safety of everyone after you.

If people are being injured, it's not worth it. Be courageous enough to do what is right rather than what is popular.

[tri deezy]

i bet the misconception comes from high school and sports team "initiations" in the news in the past several years. there's also the "initiation" into high school from the movie dazed and confused. it includes a paddle for the boys, so i bet that's what a lot of people picture when they imagine initiation into a frat or sorority

[texas*princess]

I find it difficult to believe that any national organization has hazing as part of its ritual.

While I agree with you, it's not completely unheard of to have "renegade" chapters that do not follow the National's rules.

To the OP: It is possible that the active members are just trying to mess around with your head. Not saying that's OK or right in any way, but it's a possibility.

[macallan25]

I find it difficult to believe that any national organization has hazing as part of its ritual.

I think he's talking about things like Hell Week.

[Kevin]

While I agree with you, it's not completely unheard of to have "renegade" chapters that do not follow the National's rules.

To the OP: It is possible that the active members are just trying to mess around with your head. Not saying that's OK or right in any way, but it's a possibility.

At one time, I knew of a chapter which actually inflicted physical harm on members during initiation. Sorry, this isn't so far-fetched that it's unbelievable.

[ladygreek]

At one time, I knew of a chapter which actually inflicted physical harm on members during initiation. Sorry, this isn't so far-fetched that it's unbelievable.
Thank you. I wondered why people were acting so naive. It obviously isn't an official part of the initiation ritual, but we all know it does happen unofficially.

[baci]

Agreed.^^

Ultimately, your safety is of primary importance. If it doesn't seem right at any point, leave.

Quite possibly, it is the fear of the unknown. Trust yourself and you should be fine.

[Kevin]

Agreed.^^

Ultimately, your safety is of primary importance. If it doesn't seem right at any point, leave.

Quite possibly, it is the fear of the unknown. Trust yourself and you should be fine.

I disagree.

I say tell anyone who will listen.

Your safety is of primary importance, but how about those who come after you? They may not be so courageous. If you fear serious injury, you can be certain that if not you, someone else will be injured by this practice.

Call your headquarters.

What is happening is not part of the ritual, it's a local tradition which needs to be eliminated.

[Elephant Walk]

I disagree.

I say tell anyone who will listen.

Your safety is of primary importance, but how about those who come after you? They may not be so courageous. If you fear serious injury, you can be certain that if not you, someone else will be injured by this practice.

Call your headquarters.

What is happening is not part of the ritual, it's a local tradition which needs to be eliminated.
No.

Quit if you're scared of it. If you aren't scared, don't quit. Walk out if they make you do something you don't want to. But for christsakes' don't call nationals or the university.

If people would for once take responsibility for their own actions, our insurance wouldn't be near as high. Good lord.

[ladygreek]

No.

Quit if you're scared of it. If you aren't scared, don't quit. Walk out if they make you do something you don't want to. But for christsakes' don't call nationals or the university.

If people would for once take responsibility for their own actions, our insurance wouldn't be near as high. Good lord.
Interesting. In DST if you DO NOT report hazing you could be barred from membership. We take it very seriously regardless of insurance costs.

[Kevin]

If people would for once take responsibility for their own actions, our insurance wouldn't be near as high. Good lord.

Who should be taking responsibility for themselves? Perhaps the individuals who are committing possible felonies? Exposing their organizations to liability?

No. Reporting is not only preserving your organization's financial and moral integrity, it is also taking responsibility for yourself and others. You should feel a moral obligation to protect yourself and your fellow pledges from brutality, not to mention future pledges.

One day someone might get hurt. If you haven't reported, that's on your hands.

[baci]

DSigKid states he is worried/nervous.

His post was very brief. Is this something he is creating in his mind OR does he have solid facts that hazing will occur at his initiation? These are very different situations and they would be handled quite differently.

We are all only making assumptions here and before we can give solid advice we would really need more true and complete information from him.

I stand by my statement that he does need to walk out and leave at any point if he does not feel safe. However, if he has solid information prior to initiation, there is a responsibility on his part to go forward to report this through proper channels. He should take this evidence to chapter level immediately and speak to anyone who will listen. If he does not receive the proper responses/actions taken, then he must step up to the next level.

[Thetagirl218]

Actually as weird as it may seem many outsiders believe that initiation is when you were hazed. I remember telling my parents that I had just been initiated and their response was "oh is that when they haze you really bad?"

The uneducated just don't know any better.

If I got a dollar for every time some non-greek as me that, I would be rich! :rolleyes:

[violetpretty]

If I got a dollar for every time some non-greek as me that, I would be rich! :rolleyes:

Probably every Greek could say that. I was guilty of the confusion before I was Greek as well, thank you Dazed and Confused. Also, with the word "ritual", some people hear the word and think of human sacrifice and torture so they think that ritual=hazing. For the OP, a quick definition of a few important and often confused terms....

Initiation: A ceremony that makes pledges/new members into full members for life. Almost all GLOs reveal secrets in the initiation ceremony (except DU). Of course I only have experience with my own GLO's initiation ceremony, but I would bet that the founders of every National GLO, and most locals, designed a beautiful, moving initiation ceremony that does not involve hazing.

Ritual: An all-encompassing term for several ceremonies that are limited to initiated members and pledges/new members (except DU). Some GLOs only consider initiation to be ritual. Ceremonies held usually include an official beginning to the pledge/new member period, initiation, and a ceremony to induct graduating members into the alumni/alumnae phase of membership. These rituals were designed by the founders of your organization and have likely changed very little if at all since the founding of the organization. Again, I would bet that hazing was not intended to be a part of any ritual ceremony. Whether a chapter follows their ritual book may be another story, like Kevin mentioned.

Hazing: Many people disagree on the exact definition of hazing, but I think most would agree that hazing is any activity, action, or attitude (usually directed toward new members) that causes or has the potential to cause physical or mental discomfort or harm. Hazing is against the values of any GLO founded on brotherhood or sisterhood (which is all of them), which is why it is not a part of rituals designed by founders. As if being counter to the ideals of every GLO isn't enough, hazing is also illegal.

[notyouraverage]

Initiation: I would bet that the founders of every National GLO, and most locals, designed a beautiful, moving initiation ceremony that does not involve hazing.

which is why it is not a part of rituals designed by founders. As if being counter to the ideals of every GLO isn't enough, hazing is also illegal.

I'm going to have to very respectfully disagree. We all like to believe that our rituals are as old as our organizations... and while some *elements* of them may be the same, I don't think it's all that uncommon for the rituals to change and be re-written based on the social and political climate. I think we romanticize our founders, but which of them actually knew what they were doing? How many just thought it would be fun to form a club that promised to be friends until death? How many made up a silly "initiation ritual" because they had heard about other organizations? I'm not saying that those rituals haven't come to mean more, but thats doesn't mean our founders started them that way. I've seen minutes from conventions in 1885 that ruled to ban hazing. Kudos to the convention for banning hazing, but what was going on before then in an organization less than decades old?

[DeltAlum]

Just a couple of quick things. There are other ceremonies, but our "Ritual" is our initiation.

The founder who was most responsible for our Ritual was a Mason, and as it is with a number of other fraternities, that experience helped guide the establishment of our own initiation ceremony. That is not a secret, and is spoken of openly in the history of our organization at www.delts.org.

Finally, changes in our Ritual are are not taken lightly, but are fairly common and voted on and instituted usually at our Karnea (international conference) every two years.

There is no hazing in our Ritual.

[violetpretty]

I'm going to have to very respectfully disagree. We all like to believe that our rituals are as old as our organizations... and while some *elements* of them may be the same, I don't think it's all that uncommon for the rituals to change and be re-written based on the social and political climate. I think we romanticize our founders, but which of them actually knew what they were doing? How many just thought it would be fun to form a club that promised to be friends until death? How many made up a silly "initiation ritual" because they had heard about other organizations? I'm not saying that those rituals haven't come to mean more, but thats doesn't mean our founders started them that way. I've seen minutes from conventions in 1885 that ruled to ban hazing. Kudos to the convention for banning hazing, but what was going on before then in an organization less than decades old?

Sigma Kappa's ritual is not 100% the same as it was 1874, but there have been few changes, things that are taken seriously and approved at Convention, not just changing with the whim of a chapter. What is the point of having a ritual for all of your members to share a common bond if "it's [not] uncommon for the rituals to change and be re-written based on the social and political climate"? I guess not everyone's ritual is timeless.

[Drolefille]

Sigma Kappa's ritual is not 100% the same as it was 1874, but there have been few changes, things that are taken seriously and approved at Convention, not just changing with the whim of a chapter. What is the point of having a ritual for all of your members to share a common bond if "it's [not] uncommon for the rituals to change and be re-written based on the social and political climate"? I guess not everyone's ritual is timeless.
And those changes are documented for us to see and trace!

Also, I agree 100%.

[notyouraverage]

no need to get upset; I'm only saying that 14 and 15 year old founders don't always come up with inspiring and timeless rituals. They're just as likely to come up with silly rituals that might be considered hazing now. It doesn't mean that some other dedicated sister didn't come along a few years later and add more meaning and I'm not saying that sisters in some sororities don't share something meaningful - just that founders maybe didn't take their sorority as seriously when it was founded as one today might take it when one is initiated.

disclaimer: obviously I know that there are founders ranging in ages from 14 to 24 and that organizations were founded for a variety of reasons. Some may have been extremely serious at the time, some may have not. In fact, I can think of at least three that were not so seriously founded. I'm not trying to insult anyone's ritual or history. I just think the attitude of the founders is an interesting addition to the discussion of initiation. :)

[ISUKappa]

just that founders maybe didn't take their sorority as seriously when it was founded as one today might take it when one is initiated.

I think most founders took their organizations seriously, but didn't either have the creativity to develop a huge, elaborate ritual or didn't think their little group would become so inter/national in scale and their first rituals probably reflect that.

I don't disagree that many group's rituals have changed, some probably very significantly since their founding, but also think others may have changed little.