Northern Woman Getting Bids at an SEC School

[KillarneyRose]

Having gone to a college with a smaller greek system, I am endlessly fascinated by SEC rush. It's just a whole other planet from what I experienced.

Which brings me to this observation:

When I was checking out the Alabama pledge list Carnation was kind enough to post the link to, I noticed that, although the vast, vast majority of pledges were from the deep south, there were some from up north. Even a few even from, gasp, my home state of Pennsylvania!

I'd love to know how these young women managed to have a successful rush. I wonder if they recent transplants to the north who decided to head back "home" for college? Are their moms SEC rush veterans who knew how to guide them through the process? Were they just so outstanding that it didn't matter if no one knew their people - they just *had* to have them?

I certainly wouldn't expect anyone to divulge specifics regarding their new member selection, but maybe one of you SEC ladies can give me a general idea of the "fish out of water" rushees who end up getting bids?

[dvs-dz]

Here are my guesses about the situation -

1. I would think that if someone from the north chooses to go to a southern school (paying out of state tuition), then there must be some kind of family connection to that southern state and/or college.

2. The "exotic" factor. Maybe even a bit of "mystery" thrown in.

[BamaDad]

This is something I may know a little about. My daughter rushed Alabama as an incoming freshman non-legacy from Northern Virginia (even the folks in Richmond think we are a separate entity). Quite a few of our Northern neighbors living in the surrounding Washington, DC area.

We knew nothing about recruitment or recommendations. After much research, we learned about recommendations, but we did not know many local alumnae. So, we went on-line to locate local sorority alumnae associations and national sorority headquarters staff. They were incredible! Alumnae offered to have coffee or lunch with my daughter, then eventually offered her encouragement during recruitment itself. One offered to speak to my wife just to discuss the sadness associated with sending your oldest daughter away to college a zillion miles away. Their recommendation letters were outstanding! If we could not find an alum, another an alum from another different sorority would help us track one down - anything to help Kristen. In one case, a very high up staff member at a sorority national headquarters office offered to write my daughter a rec because she realy was interested in her sorority. Best of all, the tips these alumnae gave were outstanding to the unitiated! Clothes, conversation, manners, protocol, you name it.

Her recruitment at the very competitive University of Alabama (I heard they set an SEC record this year) was an awesome experience and she is now with Delta Zeta, which I understand is a well-respected Bama sorority. If we can help, just let us know.

Fir the third time, at least, I wish to express my admiration and appreciation to all the fantastic alumnae out there in sorority world who made the difference in my daughter's successful recruitment. I am not certain she would have won a bid without the assistance of these total package alumnae. Am I grateful? Yeah!

[AlphaFrog]

WOW BamaDad!!!!

I bet that helps your heart knowing that there is a network of women who will be "taking care of your baby" while she is at college. There's nothing like coming home to a sorority house and knowing that when you get there, you're never alone.

[KillarneyRose]

BamaDad, your daughter is probably one of the girls on the list that inspired me to start this thread!

Congratulations to her; she's part of a wonderful sisterhood! ;)

[AlphaFrog]

she's part of a wonderful sisterhood! ;)


And you're not the least bit biased, are you??;) ;)

[KillarneyRose]

And you're not the least bit biased, are you??;) ;)


Who, ME????? :D

[alum]

Now that we have the internet, it may be easier than before to get the scoop on recs, proper dress, etc. If the girls are willing to do the research, a ton of information (and misinformation) is out there. The websites of the nationals of course focus on the wonderful philanthropies that they support while individual chapter websites provide a quick peek into the way the girls look and what they do.

I came from the northeast which was very anti-greek in my area. Nobody's sibs or parents were greek, or if they were, it wasn't discussed. If I had gone to a deep Southern school, I would have been lost and probably cut on Day 1 from everybody because I would not have been able to prepare properly. Then again I would have been lost anyway at a really big school.

The new Alabama DZ is the perfect example of how careful research can help. As related by her dad (with his formidable atty research skills :) ) they were able to do all the necessary prep work.

[BamaDad]

Kristen is really into DZ. She is a Northern Virginian looking to quickly make friends with her new (mostly) Alabama sisters at a fine Southern University. From all indications everything is working out perfectly. It may be tougher to win a sorority bid in the South, but the rewards offered by a strong Greek system appear to make the effort worthwhile.

One interesting note. My wife's best friend wrote a rec and asked the Bama chapter "not to hold the fact that Kristen was from the Northern Virginia area against her." Not too diplomatic perhaps, but likely founded on perceptions real or not that recruitment challenges for the Northern-born are more difficult.

[NUBlue&Blue]

I know we don't get the publicity that the SEC gets, but there are a lot of the midwestern schools where rush is very competitive....just not so "openly competitive". You know how we are, we don't like to attract attention to ourselves;) !!

I said this in a different thread that sometimes being from out of state is a big advantage....it's a big feather in your hat to have an out of state girl in your pledge class in some areas where everybody is from the same place. I remember one girl in our house who was from Chicago......oooh aaaah, very cool!

So while sometimes you could be a fish out of water, a lot of times just being different is a good thing. And I do agree that the internet and cable tv has made the world very, very small, so we're really not so different as we used to be.

[33girl]

There are lots of transplants in NoVa - I know that our alumnae chapter there is huge, for that reason. It has members from literally across the country (which isn't always the case w/ our alum chapters).

[FloridaTish]

When I was checking out the Alabama pledge list Carnation was kind enough to post the link to

Where was the Alabama Pledge list link that Carnation posted? I would love to see it!

[alum]

Nothern VA is definitely an eclectic place. It seems as if nearly everybody is orginally from someplace else. This isn't terribly surprising considering that the District is just across the river.

I have been a member of several of my sorority's alumnae associations across the country due to GEN Alum's reassignments. As a brand-new 2LT wife 3 weeks after graduation, I joined the Louisville alumnae association. They were the sweetest, most welcoming women. Most had graduated from UK with a couple of IU and Vandy grads as well. KC was like this as well where most of the members hailed from the state flagship schools. Other associations in Boston, Northern VA, and Westchester County, NY had alumnae from many areas.

Each of these alumnae associations has been wonderful in their own way. Whatever group my daughter joins this spring (if she even goes through recruitment at all) will hopefully have a strong alumnae network as I did.

[Speechpath]

I takes research and planning if you "aren't from around here" to know what to expect. I had a very similar situation, growing up in northern VA and going to UGA. Luckily, my brother had attended UGA and hooked me up with his friends who were greek. They were an invaluable source of information as to what to really expect. I'm not sure, if I hadn't had their advice, I wouldn've made it through rush. I must say, however, that I had several pledge sisters from out of state. I think it just takes education on your part to know what to really expect and I think in these situations, recs are really essential. My mother spent a good part of the summer getting one for every group on campus via any avenue she could. :)

[OleMissGlitter]

You see lots of out-of-state girls going Greek at Ole Miss. I know AOII has girls from CA, VA, NC, SC, PA, VT, NH...other houses are the same way. I think it is totally possible for a Notherner to have a wonderful recruitment.

[PenguinTrax]

Where was the Alabama Pledge list link that Carnation posted? I would love to see it!

Actually, I posted it and it is in the top-level Recruitment forum.

[tunatartare]

I don't know if Vanderbilt is considered SEC or not, but the daughter of a woman that I work with is a Tri Delt there.

[AUDeltaGam]

I don't know if Vanderbilt is considered SEC or not, but the daughter of a woman that I work with is a Tri Delt there.

It is :)

[NutBrnHair]

I don't know if Vanderbilt is considered SEC or not...
(Except during football season!) ;)

[SmartBlondeGPhB]

I know we don't get the publicity that the SEC gets, but there are a lot of the midwestern schools where rush is very competitive....just not so "openly competitive". You know how we are, we don't like to attract attention to ourselves;) !!

I said this in a different thread that sometimes being from out of state is a big advantage....it's a big feather in your hat to have an out of state girl in your pledge class in some areas where everybody is from the same place. I remember one girl in our house who was from Chicago......oooh aaaah, very cool!

So while sometimes you could be a fish out of water, a lot of times just being different is a good thing. And I do agree that the internet and cable tv has made the world very, very small, so we're really not so different as we used to be.

And a lot of times it gives you something unique that helps them remember you......(as one of 2 girls from the state of WA when I went through recruitment)

[KillarneyRose]

Actually, I posted it and it is in the top-level Recruitment forum.


Oops, sorry Barb!!! You know, you Recruitment Mods all look alike :p

[BamaDad]

The U of Alabama website lists the names by sorority for all 1,024. That is quite an impressive number. I understand there were over 1,400 who registered for recruitment. The site shows the hometown and state of each young lady.

[BamaDad]

The U. of Alabama had 1,024 new members (UA website). I heard there were over 1,400 young ladies that were registered by the first Open House. The site lists each by sorority, name, hometown and state.

[Zillini]

Here's a little explanation about Bama as I've seen in over the past decade or so. When I first started working with my Chapter there were very few out of state members. Those that we did have were usually "transplants" that had lived in Bama but their families moved. The others were from surrounding states of GA, MS, LA, FLA and TN. Usually they had some sorto of Bama ties as well such as maybe Mom or Dad were from here or went to school here, etc. But on the whole, it was a very small percentage of members that didn't live in Bama.

Seeing as I wasn't born and raised in Bama or even from the South yet was welcomed with open arms, of course I asked why? The answer was simple enough and had nothing to do with prejudice or anti-Yankee/non-Bama feelings. It was simply that the actives didn't know the girls. They were hesitant to take a chance on an "unknown" girl especially when there were so many "known" girls they already loved.

Then a few women from other states came through with spectacular resumes, sparkling personalities and had some friends that were able to vouch for them. It was like these women were able to break down the barrier. The actives started realizing that they had probably been missing out on amazing women by not looking beyond their own backyard. Things started to slowly open up.

Add to the mix that the University Admin has been steadily increasing the size of the student population over the past few years. Much of their recruiting efforts have been out of state, so obviously that has translated in more out of state women going through NPC recruitment. All of this combined has really started to open the Chapters up to members from all states.

I'll admit it's still harder on out of state women going through recruitment, but as we've all seen it's no longer impossible to get into a fabulous Chapter. Just keep in mind that at the same time it's also hard on a girl from Smalltown, AL who is the first person in her family to go to college, that doesn't know anyone who is Greek, etc.

[AnchorAlumna]

Re: out of state new members at Bama (and any other school)
We have a wonderful Mississippi member in her...I guess 70s now, or maybe 80s, who has been a recruitment consultant for many, many chapters. She really stresses pledging in-state girls, especially from small towns. That doesn't mean she throws out ALL the out-of-state girls, but she really pushes for 75% of the new member class to be in-state girls. Her reasoning is that these girls will more than likely marry their hometown sweetheart, go back to that area and can send more new members. Another aspect is that it gives you more local alumnae to draw from for advisors. I have seen her theories proved right in many locales.

[WVU alpha phi]

Re: out of state new members at Bama (and any other school)
We have a wonderful Mississippi member in her...I guess 70s now, or maybe 80s, who has been a recruitment consultant for many, many chapters. She really stresses pledging in-state girls, especially from small towns. That doesn't mean she throws out ALL the out-of-state girls, but she really pushes for 75% of the new member class to be in-state girls. Her reasoning is that these girls will more than likely marry their hometown sweetheart, go back to that area and can send more new members. Another aspect is that it gives you more local alumnae to draw from for advisors. I have seen her theories proved right in many locales.

I can see why this theory makes sense, but what about the counterpoint of it.. I've found in my experience that many in-state girls rushing are the ones who go home frequently on the weekends (to see that high school love) and who sometimes ultimately drop out of school to return home. In fact, we kind of mark it as a negative when a girl talks about her boyfriend who is still at home, because we figure she'll be going home a lot on the weekends and won't be involved in the sorority.

[Zillini]

Here's something to throw in the mix. The Georgia Hope scholarship has made it harder on GA girls going through Recruitment at Bama and probably elsewhere as well. Chapters have been "burned" by pledging GA girls who: 1) Only attend long enough to get their grades up enough to transfer back home for the free tuition. 2) After a year of paying out of state tuition Mom and Dad tell her they can't afford it or simply don't want to pay it anymore and she must move back home because it's free.

For the record I'm not saying GA girls won't be extended bids on Bama's campus. Just look at the UA Panhellenic pledge list and you'll see many. We have several that are wonderful members, past and current. All I'm saying is that is that these girls are looked at more closely than in the years prior to the Hope scholarship coming into place.

[CutiePie2000]

BamaDad,
You and your family are a beautiful example of a rushee (and her family) who did not know any alumnae personally, and you got off your behinds, did your research, and DID SOMETHING ABOUT IT and are reaping the rewards from it.

There are way too many rushees who come onto GC and say "wah wah wah, I don't know any alumnae personally...please do the work for me to secure my recommendations for me!"

I LOVE PROACTIVE PEOPLE who create their own opportunities!
:D
*MWAH*

BamaDad, your daughter is probably one of the girls on the list that inspired me to start this thread!

Congratulations to her; she's part of a wonderful sisterhood! ;)
ha ha!! KillarneyRose,
When (not if) your daughter becomes a DG, she'll be part of a wonderful sisterhood also! :p ;)

[Jill1228]

bama dad, i used to live in alexandria, va....MAN HOW I MISS NORTHERN VA

/end hijack

Kristen is really into DZ. She is a Northern Virginian looking to quickly make friends with her new (mostly) Alabama sisters at a fine Southern University. From all indications everything is working out perfectly. It may be tougher to win a sorority bid in the South, but the rewards offered by a strong Greek system appear to make the effort worthwhile.

One interesting note. My wife's best friend wrote a rec and asked the Bama chapter "not to hold the fact that Kristen was from the Northern Virginia area against her." Not too diplomatic perhaps, but likely founded on perceptions real or not that recruitment challenges for the Northern-born are more difficult.

[NUBlue&Blue]

"Here's something to throw in the mix. The Georgia Hope scholarship has made it harder on GA girls going through Recruitment at Bama and probably elsewhere as well. Chapters have been "burned" by pledging GA girls who: 1) Only attend long enough to get their grades up enough to transfer back home for the free tuition. 2) After a year of paying out of state tuition Mom and Dad tell her they can't afford it or simply don't want to pay it anymore and she must move back home because it's free".

Auburn and Alabama are also not getting the best girls from Georgia, either, because these are the girls that can't get into UGA and it's their back up school. A lot of the girls going to Bama, Missippippi and Auburn from our HS couldn't qualify for HOPE anyway, and may or may not ever get their grades up. But they definitely aren't getting Georgia's top students.

[Elephant Walk]

Phi Delt pledged a guy from Jersey...and he was like a typical Jersey kid. I think he must of had connections because there is no way we would have pledged a guy from the north, furthermore from that state.

[kathykd2005]

I'm not really sure why it is so shocking that someone from the north may want to go to a school in the South. I am myself from NY, and I went to college in Charlotte, NC. One reason a lot of people decide to go to southern schools as opposed to northern ones is because they are often a lot cheaper. Particularly with reference to private colleges, the difference in tuition is exponential (I know this because I worked for my school's Admissions office for four years). I had no prior connection to my southern university--I was simply recruited well. Also, with reference to my Greek experience, many of the Panhellenic sororities on my campus recruited northern women, because they recognized traits in these women that they sought to add to their sisterhood. I'm actually somewhat surprised that where someone is from has anything to do with whether or not they will be recruited by certain organizations. :confused:

[Tom Earp]

Phi Delt pledged a guy from Jersey...and he was like a typical Jersey kid. I think he must of had connections because there is no way we would have pledged a guy from the north, furthermore from that state.


Hm, it may be interesting to learn from others instead of being In Bred so to speak!

It is a lot bigger wolrd than you may think!

That is why I Talk via Phone dailey with Members of other GLOs besides mine.

Expand or be a ????

Live and learn, You may live in NJ some day!

Learn the Lingo!

[alum]

Isn't it more difficult to get into a state school as an out-of-state (OOS) student vs an instate (ISS) assuming that the national rankings are relatively close? So even if a Georgia girl doesn't get the Hope Scholarship, wouldn't it still be easier and cheaper for her to go to UGa or GaTech vs OOS to Ole Miss/Alabama etc?

North Carolina has it mandated through the state legislature that no more than 15-18% of students at each public university (to include the flagship, Chapel Hill) can be OOS. I think that's great for NC residents. After all, state taxes are partially used to subsidize the public school system. Most of the people in VA wish our commonwealth would legislate the maximum percentage of OOSers at our public colleges and universities, but the politicians in Charlottesville haven't done so.

"Here's something to throw in the mix. The Georgia Hope scholarship has made it harder on GA girls going through Recruitment at Bama and probably elsewhere as well. Chapters have been "burned" by pledging GA girls who: 1) Only attend long enough to get their grades up enough to transfer back home for the free tuition. 2) After a year of paying out of state tuition Mom and Dad tell her they can't afford it or simply don't want to pay it anymore and she must move back home because it's free".

Auburn and Alabama are also not getting the best girls from Georgia, either, because these are the girls that can't get into UGA and it's their back up school. A lot of the girls going to Bama, Missippippi and Auburn from our HS couldn't qualify for HOPE anyway, and may or may not ever get their grades up. But they definitely aren't getting Georgia's top students.

[NUBlue&Blue]

Totally depends on the school.

Yes, it's cheaper to go to UGA or Tech, but they aren't getting in because the HOPE has made the admissions much more competitive for in state students. Students who would've gone out of state or private are staying here. It is getting to be "big d@mn deal" to get into UGA these days. Plenty of people my age who went there say they could never get in now. This opinion is totally anecdotal, but at our HS, if you can't get into UGA, you go to Auburn/Alabama/OleMiss, not the other way around.

To get in to UNC-Chapel Hill or UVA, you need to be in the high 1400's to 1500 and in the top one or two in your class. We've had 3 from our HS get into UNC the last two years and only one get into UVA. I've heard UT-Austin is difficult, too, but not too many people head that far out from our HS.

[UF56]

The same thing is occurring in Florida because of our Bright Futures scholarship. I have taught HS for the past three years and have noticed every year that is it is harder for the students to get into UF. I haven't noticed the trend with FSU but I am sure it is happening. This past year the valedictorian and salutitorian did not get into UF however they did get into FSU. The sad thing is that they both had like 4.5's and over 1400 on their SATS as well as tons of volunteering and extracirriculars. I think more and more Florida students are going to Auburn. I know quite a few girls who have gone without recs and have become Phi Mus and DZs. But sometimes I think SEC schools consider students from SEC states as locals and not necessairly the same as someone from say New York.

[alum]

Interesting...We know lots of Virginians who didn't get into UVa &/or William and Mary who end up going to Penn State (the one in State College) instead of the next level of VA schools of Tech, JMU, now GMU etc. I have no idea if they try to transfer back or not. Luckily my D's friends who wanted a large instate public school were accepted to the schools of their choice.

I hear a lot of parents of college aged kids say they could never get accepted to their alma mater (no matter if it's public or private) based on today's standards. I do alumni interviews for my undergraduate school's admissions as does my H for his and we are both truly impressed at what is in these hs applicants' resumes.

I can't imagine that Chapel Hill/Berkeley/Ann Arbor being much different than UVa and W&M....These are why these schools are in top rankings of the country. Based on the way my neighbors speak, I think they would gladly downgrade the national ranking of our flagship public schools if it would mean more instate kids would be admitted.


Totally depends on the school.

Yes, it's cheaper to go to UGA or Tech, but they aren't getting in because the HOPE has made the admissions much more competitive for in state students. Students who would've gone out of state or private are staying here. It is getting to be "big d@mn deal" to get into UGA these days. Plenty of people my age who went there say they could never get in now. This opinion is totally anecdotal, but at our HS, if you can't get into UGA, you go to Auburn/Alabama/OleMiss, not the other way around.

To get in to UNC-Chapel Hill or UVA, you need to be in the high 1400's to 1500 and in the top one or two in your class. We've had 3 from our HS get into UNC the last two years and only one get into UVA. I've heard UT-Austin is difficult, too, but not too many people head that far out from our HS.

[NUBlue&Blue]

It kind of goes in cycles at our HS. Last 2 years a big bunch went to Auburn. This year we had more at Alabama, but it was mostly boys. A few years ago Florida was big, then it was Clemson.

Auburn is pretty popular because we are on the west side of the metro area, it's only a couple hours away and the largest out of state alumni club is in the Atlanta area.

'course it's nuthin like lovin' them dawgs.....;)

[alum]

They say applications will go WAY up at George Mason for the class of 2007 because of the Patriots' performance in the NCAA basketball tournament. It's great for GMU but I wish the increase would be due to the 2 faculty members that recently received the Nobel Prizes in their academic fields.

[Elephant Walk]

Hm, it may be interesting to learn from others instead of being In Bred so to speak!

It is a lot bigger wolrd than you may think!

That is why I Talk via Phone dailey with Members of other GLOs besides mine.

Expand or be a ????

Live and learn, You may live in NJ some day!

Learn the Lingo!
Mr. Earp, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

If I had to live in Jersey, I would rather become a slave somewhere in Mississippi than move there. "Dailey" is spelled "daily" and "In Bred" is one word, "inbred". I spend wayy too much time talking to members of other GLO's besides mine, seeing as I my graduating high school class was over 1/5 my graduating class was Greek (excluding hispanics and blacks, who do not have a chance of primarily white GLO's...no offense, that's how it is in the south, i'm not going to justify it). Learn what lingo man?

[blueangel]

Phi Delt pledged a guy from Jersey...and he was like a typical Jersey kid. I think he must of had connections because there is no way we would have pledged a guy from the north, furthermore from that state.

So you don't like people from the Channel Islands? Why not? They have charming British accents. :p

[blueangel]

I'm not really sure why it is so shocking that someone from the north may want to go to a school in the South. I am myself from NY, and I went to college in Charlotte, NC. One reason a lot of people decide to go to southern schools as opposed to northern ones is because they are often a lot cheaper. Particularly with reference to private colleges, the difference in tuition is exponential (I know this because I worked for my school's Admissions office for four years). I had no prior connection to my southern university--I was simply recruited well. Also, with reference to my Greek experience, many of the Panhellenic sororities on my campus recruited northern women, because they recognized traits in these women that they sought to add to their sisterhood. I'm actually somewhat surprised that where someone is from has anything to do with whether or not they will be recruited by certain organizations. :confused:

I am also from your area. I decided to go to the University of Florida because it has one of the best broadcast journalism programs in the country. And.. you can't beat the weather! ;)

When I went through rush, I found most of the sororities were completely open to women from anywhere. There were only two out of all of them at the time which looked for southerners.. one was comprised of very "deep south" women (ala "The Southern Belle Primer") and another sorority that seemed to take in only women from in-state. I checked that chapter's website out of curiosity not too long ago for the members and their hometowns, and sure enough.. they're still all from Florida.

It wasn't until I moved to Florida that I realized for the first time that some people haven't gotten word yet that the civil war is over. :D

[KillarneyRose]

ha ha!! KillarneyRose,
When (not if) your daughter becomes a DG, she'll be part of a wonderful sisterhood also! :p ;)


Hey, now! I still have seven years left to brainwash, er, I mean discuss the matter with, her :D

[KillarneyRose]

I have taught HS for the past three years and have noticed every year that is it is harder for the students to get into UF.


Have you really been out of college for three years???? It doesn't seem that long ago that you were colonizing your chapter!

[kdonline]

The same thing is occurring in Florida because of our Bright Futures scholarship. I have taught HS for the past three years and have noticed every year that is it is harder for the students to get into UF.


Yes, this is so true. At the high school I taught @ in Miami, probably 90% of the students in the IB program went to UF, rather than going out of state, because of the free tuition from the Bright Futures scholarships, etc...

I was shocked when one of my students turned down Harvard to go to UF for free. Personally, I'd WANT my kid to choose Harvard over UF - and I'm a die-hard Gator - I will gladly take out loans (if I have to) to pay for an Ivy League education.

[alum]

The same thing is occurring in Florida because of our Bright Futures scholarship. I have taught HS for the past three years and have noticed every year that is it is harder for the students to get into UF.
Yes, this is so true. At the high school I taught @ in Miami, probably 90% of the students in the IB program went to UF, rather than going out of state, because of the free tuition from the Bright Futures scholarships, etc...

I was shocked when one of my students turned down Harvard to go to UF for free. Personally, I'd WANT my kid to choose Harvard over UF - and I'm a die-hard Gator - I will gladly take out loans (if I have to) to pay for an Ivy League education.

Here is a link to an article regarding the issue of whether some state universities are admitting too many out of state students, while excluding students from the home state.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/educati...es-cover_x.htm (http://www.usatoday.com/news/educati...es-cover_x.htm)

Kdonline, I definitely agree with your opinion. An education from a top LAC or research university is well worth the cost.

[Zillini]

While I understand your point about the top notch Ivy League schools, I have to disagree. Ok, maybe not completely disagree but I'd certainly have to think long and hard about it.

Free education at a highly respected in state school vs. $42,500+ per year for out of state at Harvard (tuition, room & board, books and supplies cost listed at http://www.collegetoolkit.com/Colleges/Tuition-Financial-Aid/166027.aspx). Of course that's without any financial assistance that may be available and accumulated savings which would have to be factored in to the decision.

I don't know what my Hubby, my son and I would decide if we were in this situation. I don't want to see my son saddled with massive loan payments for the rest of his life. Nor do I want to jeopardize my Hubby's and my future by taking on massive debt as we near retirement age. We're not planning on retiring in luxury. We simply don't want to end up in the poorhouse and have to rely on our son to take care of us financially either.

[BamaDad DZ]

We have many students from Northern Virginia heading South for college. Many spend a semester or two away, build up their GPA. then transfer into schools like the University of Virginia or William & Mary. Coming from high schools in Northern Virginia, we actually have a set a quota for students from Fairfax, Loudon, Prince William and Fauqier counties in relation to the remainder of the Commonwealth.

My daughter had decent SAT scores, grades, extracurriculars, etc., but chose to apply only at the University of Alabama after being on campus four hours! No University of Virginia, Virginia Tech, Williams & Mary, or George Mason University for her - with all due respect to those fine schools. She felt a university from the Deep South with its lure of a traditional Greek system, great football history and tradition, architecture, Southern people, among other reasons, was for her.

Fairfax High School sent nine students to Bama last year, although I believe three went this year. We personally know several students the past few years who went to Auburn And I discovered that several more are heading further south to my alma mater of the University of South Florida, which is growing by leaps and bounds.

Lots of reasons to head to Dixie....

[alum]

We have many students from Northern Virginia heading South for college. Many spend a semester or two away, build up their GPA. then transfer into schools like the University of Virginia or William & Mary. Coming from high schools in Northern Virginia, we actually have a set a quota for students from Fairfax, Loudon, Prince William and Fauqier counties in relation to the remainder of the Commonwealth.

Fairfax High School sent nine students to Bama last year, although I believe three went this year. ...Lots of reasons to head to Dixie....

Northern VA is so much different than the rest of VA. As a broad generalization, it is is much more multicultural, politically liberal, highly educated, densely populated than areas outside the counties mentioned above. This is not necessarily a good thing, but it is what it is.

This is reflected in the students that come from the area. They are driven, hard-charging kids just like their parents.

State schools want the student bodies to represent the entire state not just one area. I wouldn't resent a student from the Norfolk area taking "my kid's spot" assuming they had the same raw score assessed to their application package but I certainly would be angry if it was an OOS applicant.

In terms of where kids go OOS from VA especially to a different state's public school, I think much has to do with the guidance and career offices at the schools. Fairfax HS clearly has a relationship now with UA. The Alabama admissions office is seeing the performance of these former Virginians in relation to the student body.

For some reason my neighborhood's local FCPS high school routinely sends between 4-6 kids every year to the University of Montana. I know one student is going there for the film school (apparently Robert Redford and Sundance have given a lot of $ to the department) but no idea on the rest.

[Angels&Arrows]

[QUOTE=Zillini]
Free education at a highly respected in state school vs. $42,500+ per year for out of state at Harvard (tuition, room & board, books and supplies cost listed at http://www.collegetoolkit.com/Colleges/Tuition-Financial-Aid/166027.aspx). Of course that's without any financial assistance that may be available and accumulated savings which would have to be factored in to the decision.
QUOTE]

The endowment at an IL is large enough, that students do not pay the full tuition. Often, (ex. Harvard), if your parents make under a set income school is free; if you go into a public service type position your loans are paid in full, etc. I would wager, that a senior from a state school vs. senior from an IL would owe the same upon graduation. (I am not including state schools where free tuition is given to all students with a certain GPA).

That is only the beginning... Many large firms do not even recruit anywhere but IL or the equivilent. Prior to returning to school for Nursing, I worked as the Admin Manager for a mid-sized Cap. Mkts group. Starting salary w/ bonus for new assoc. was close to 100k. (that was five years ago). Unless you had an in.. we did not look at resumes from State schools and/or many Private schools. I would argue w/ the type of network that ILs offer, the earning potential is far greater on base.

[FuzzieAlum]

Public-College Graduates Accrue Almost as Much Student-Loan Debt as Private-College Peers, Report Says

By STEPHEN BURD
http://chronicle.com/daily/2006/08/2006083003n.htm

Students who attend public universities and state colleges graduate with nearly as much student-loan debt as those at private colleges on average, according to a report released on Tuesday.

The report, "Student Debt and the Class of 2005," is the work of the Project on Student Debt, an effort being led by Robert M. Shireman, a former senior education-policy adviser in the Clinton administration. The project, which is being financed by the Pew Charitable Trusts, is working to develop public-policy proposals to reduce the burden of student debt on those least able to afford it.

The report's authors analyzed data on the average debt levels of college students who graduated in 2005, as reported by more than 1,400 four-year colleges around the country to Peterson's, a publisher of college guidebooks.

The authors found that the average debt for seniors graduating from public colleges ranged from $23,198 in Iowa to $11,067 in Utah; the average debt of those from private colleges ranged from $32,504 in Arizona to $13,309 in Utah.

While in most states the average debt of graduates from public colleges is lower than that of private-college graduates, the reverse is true in seven states: Arkansas, Delaware, Iowa, Kentucky, North Dakota, South Carolina, and Tennessee.

The report also found that just because a state college is relatively inexpensive does not mean that its students are not taking on large debt loads. And conversely, just because a private college is costly does not mean its students are assuming unmanageable levels of debt.

In many cases, students from low-income families who attend low-cost institutions have no other option but to take out loans to pay for books, food, rent, and other living expenses. As a result, "a number of campuses with low in-state tuition," of less than $3,500, and high proportions of low-income students report having "average student debt levels of more than $20,000," the report says. Those colleges include Florida A&M University, Grambling State University, North Carolina A&T State University, and Texas Southern University.

At the same time, some of the costliest private colleges provide such generous amounts of institutional need-based aid that financially needy students do not need to borrow as much as they otherwise would if they attended lower-priced institutions.

According to the report, more than 30 private colleges "charge more than $20,000 in tuition yet report that the average debt of their graduates is $15,000 or less." Those include Amherst College, Bard College, Colgate University, the Johns Hopkins University, Macalester College, Sarah Lawrence College, Swarthmore College, Tufts University, and Williams College.

Along with the report, the project has posted on its Web site an interactive map that provides statewide averages and campus-by-campus data.

[KillarneyRose]

My sister went to an Ivy League university and, things may be different now but back then if you were granted admission, the school made sure you were given enough in grants and scholarships to get through. I understand that it also helped that our family was spectacularly poor.

So she got through college with very little debt but her debt from medical school? YIKES :eek:

[MSKKG]

My son was interested in Princeton. A representative came down for a presentation, and we found out that Princeton doesn't give any merit-based scholarships. He decided not to apply. He did apply to Dartmouth though and was accepted. Over half of what they offered in scholarships was what he brought to the table. A friend told me how well-endowed the Ivies were, too. That was just not our experience.

He was also accepted at Duke. They offered more than Dartmouth, but not enough for us to consider it. My son wants to be a doctor, so we just couldn't justify that kind of expense for his undergrad when we'd have med school to look forward to.

My son is a freshman in the Honors College at Clemson. He got all the in-state scholarships for his good grades plus other scholarships and a Clemson scholarship. We got a refund that basically will pay for his PC. He has been a Clemson fan for as long as we can remember, and I think he is very happy. He'll be even happier when he isn't ten zillion dollars in debt!

My son is smart enough and driven enough to make the most of his education, wherever that may be. I'm just glad he is not that far from home!!! :D

[hmd1014]

This past year the valedictorian and salutitorian did not get into UF however they did get into FSU. The sad thing is that they both had like 4.5's and over 1400 on their SATS as well as tons of volunteering and extracirriculars.

This just blows my mind.

[Sailboat Sis]

One of the girls I went to high school with got a bid at USC, from her first choice & I understand that it's a top house... without a rec. :)

[alum]

The top LACs and national universities don't supply merit-based scholarships because they don't need to attract candidates. They are already getting 10 applications for every spot. Duke is a notable exception with the generous Robertson Scholarship.

What these top schools do however, is to make sure much of the financial aid package for need-based candidates is in the form of a grant. So if a kid has an EFC of $30,000 and he's going to HYP that has a COA of $48K, the majority if not all of his financial aid package will be grant. A school with a smaller endowment may be able only able to provide 5K in grant and give out guaranteed loans and w/s to cover the rest. Some schools don't promise to entirely cover need and there may be a gap between their FA package of grant/GSL/ws and the net amount of COA minus the EFC.

The problem arises when a family's Estimated Family Contribution as calculated by FAFSA and the CSS Profile may be different than what the family thinks it can afford or is willing to pay: especially if there is future education planned immediately after the BS/BA degree.

Every year my friends and I laugh together (and probably cry in secret) about the official EFC number. My friend with 5 kids who is a SAHM and her H works for the gov't has an EFC of $40K. A military officer down the street whose W is a substitute teacher has an EFC of $50K. These are ordinary, middle-class people. We were stunned in disbelief at our FAFSA figure.

If you want merit-aid, you have to look at schools where 1. your class rank, GPA and SAT/ACT scores are MUCH higher than the 75% ranking, 2. they actually have merit-aid listed on their FA or admissions webpage.

And yes, when you have an outside scholarship from a local source, it is subtracted from your FA package. Again, unfair in my eyes, but that's the way it is.

----

Every family has to decide what's important to them. Quite frankly, going to the big flagship school in many states is a better way to have professional connections than going to an Ivy.

[UF56]

This just blows my mind.

Tell me about it...granted if they would have applied for Summer B or Early Admissions and not just the General Fall semester they would have gotten in. They even filled out appeal packages. I am not sure if anything came of it because at graduation they were still waiting to hear if their appeals went through.

[ISUKappa]

Public-College Graduates Accrue Almost as Much Student-Loan Debt as Private-College Peers, Report Says
We were just talking about this at work today. I went to a state school, paid in-state tuition and still racked up $20K in student loans and that was 5 years ago.

The husband went to a small, private engineering school but was able to get grants and scholarships so that he had less than $15K in debt which, at the time 10 years ago, was a little less than tuition for one year. Tuition now is around $30K/year.

[BamaDad DZ]

As I've said before, recommendations for out out of state non-legacies are particularly crucial in a competitive recruiting environment like the SEC schools. That being said.....

I just read the replies to my DZ daughter's thank you notes to all the wonderful alumni from

Alpha Chi Omega

Alpha Delta Pi

Alpha Gamma Delta

Alpha Omicron Pi

Chi Omega

Delta Zeta

Delta Delta Delta

Kappa Alpha Theta

Kappa Kappa Gamma

Kappa Delta

Phi Mu

Pi Beta Phi

Zeta Tau Alpha

First, I wish to thank these wonderful alums myself becausethey helped my little girl join a wonderful DZ organization by their contributions. After Kristen wrote her respective thank you notes, each alum wrote back a personal note of congratulations and best wishes.

You ladies are just too much. I love you all,

BamaDad DZ

[AnchorAlumna]

One of the girls I went to high school with got a bid at USC, from her first choice & I understand that it's a top house... without a rec. :)
OK, did you mean for this to go in a different thread?
On your subject...don't be so sure she didn't have a rec. PNMs really shouldn't have to get their own recs. The sororities contact their alumnae asking for recs on girls going through. The PNMs might not even be aware that alumnae are recommending them (or not).

[Drolefille]

Is that really the same kind of rec though? If it's not written by someone who actually knows (or met) the PNM, I don't consider it the same thing as a rec obtained by the sorority (due to their own requirements.)

[AnchorAlumna]

Is that really the same kind of rec though? If it's not written by someone who actually knows (or met) the PNM, I don't consider it the same thing as a rec obtained by the sorority (due to their own requirements.)
Collegiate chapter contacts hometown alum...alum knows girl...or finds a fellow alum or friend who knows girl...alum writes rec and sends back. Whether requested or volunteered, it's the same thing.

[greekalum]

I think that DG may have a particularly strong network for that- I was surprised to learn when I showed up at recruitment that they had a reference for me at DG- I hadn't asked anyone for one since I didn't know any DGs (so I thought). But they'd found a high school teacher who knew me well- and this was several states away from my hometown.

[kathykd2005]

Some chapters don't require recs from all of the ladies that go through recruitment--I know that my chapter did not get recs from a lot of girls, and we still accepted many of them. I think it depends on the Panhellenic Association and school environment. :)

[FSUZeta]

accepting recommendations has absolutely nothing to do with your panhellenic. it is based on your national policy and that particular chapter.

[Sailboat Sis]

USC = University of South Carolina, so yes, correct thread. Maybe she got an rec from an alum, but said alum would not have met her.

[GeekyPenguin]

The top LACs and national universities don't supply merit-based scholarships because they don't need to attract candidates. They are already getting 10 applications for every spot. Duke is a notable exception with the generous Robertson Scholarship.

What these top schools do however, is to make sure much of the financial aid package for need-based candidates is in the form of a grant. So if a kid has an EFC of $30,000 and he's going to HYP that has a COA of $48K, the majority if not all of his financial aid package will be grant. A school with a smaller endowment may be able only able to provide 5K in grant and give out guaranteed loans and w/s to cover the rest. Some schools don't promise to entirely cover need and there may be a gap between their FA package of grant/GSL/ws and the net amount of COA minus the EFC.

The problem arises when a family's Estimated Family Contribution as calculated by FAFSA and the CSS Profile may be different than what the family thinks it can afford or is willing to pay: especially if there is future education planned immediately after the BS/BA degree.

Every year my friends and I laugh together (and probably cry in secret) about the official EFC number. My friend with 5 kids who is a SAHM and her H works for the gov't has an EFC of $40K. A military officer down the street whose W is a substitute teacher has an EFC of $50K. These are ordinary, middle-class people. We were stunned in disbelief at our FAFSA figure.

If you want merit-aid, you have to look at schools where 1. your class rank, GPA and SAT/ACT scores are MUCH higher than the 75% ranking, 2. they actually have merit-aid listed on their FA or admissions webpage.

And yes, when you have an outside scholarship from a local source, it is subtracted from your FA package. Again, unfair in my eyes, but that's the way it is.

----

Every family has to decide what's important to them. Quite frankly, going to the big flagship school in many states is a better way to have professional connections than going to an Ivy.

My EFC was ridiculous in college - when I went to a state school the first two years, our EFC was more than 10x the tuition and my parents really don't make that much money. Luckily when I transferred to a Jesuit school I got a ton of grant money thrown at me - it only cost $2,000 more to attend that school once I got all my grants and scholarships.

I only like the EFC now that I am in grad school and independent - it went from being over $40,000 to being $63 last year. :D

[Munchkin03]

My EFC was ridiculous in college - when I went to a state school the first two years, our EFC was more than 10x the tuition and my parents really don't make that much money.

Yeah, having to deal with parental income stuff is terrible. Grad school was really nice in that I got a few merit scholarships and assistantships to lessen the blow.

[AOII*Azra-elle]

This is something I may know a little about. My daughter rushed Alabama as an incoming freshman non-legacy from Northern Virginia (even the folks in Richmond think we are a separate entity). Quite a few of our Northern neighbors living in the surrounding Washington, DC area.

We knew nothing about recruitment or recommendations. After much research, we learned about recommendations, but we did not know many local alumnae. So, we went on-line to locate local sorority alumnae associations and national sorority headquarters staff. They were incredible! Alumnae offered to have coffee or lunch with my daughter, then eventually offered her encouragement during recruitment itself. One offered to speak to my wife just to discuss the sadness associated with sending your oldest daughter away to college a zillion miles away. Their recommendation letters were outstanding! If we could not find an alum, another an alum from another different sorority would help us track one down - anything to help Kristen. In one case, a very high up staff member at a sorority national headquarters office offered to write my daughter a rec because she realy was interested in her sorority. Best of all, the tips these alumnae gave were outstanding to the unitiated! Clothes, conversation, manners, protocol, you name it.

Her recruitment at the very competitive University of Alabama (I heard they set an SEC record this year) was an awesome experience and she is now with Delta Zeta, which I understand is a well-respected Bama sorority. If we can help, just let us know.

Fir the third time, at least, I wish to express my admiration and appreciation to all the fantastic alumnae out there in sorority world who made the difference in my daughter's successful recruitment. I am not certain she would have won a bid without the assistance of these total package alumnae. Am I grateful? Yeah!


Your daughter chose well! I know some Delta Zeta's from my previous school. The women were always doing something for the community, or trying to bring the greek system together. They were always up to befriend new people. Wonderful group of women, wonderful organization.

[BamaDad DZ]

Thank you for the compliment to DZ. It is well-deserved.

My daugher called the gracious alum who wrote her DZ recommendation to announce her Delta Zeta bid. And what did the alum do? She kindly sent my daughter a dozen lovely pink roses that made Kristen the envy of the DZ house! For the record, the alum of whom I speak is a regular on GreekChat, so imadeltaz, thank you very much from a proud DZ Dad!

Are the ladies of Delta Zeta as wonderful as you say? You bet...

[Hegemon]

Hehe, I wish my Daddy (yes, no matter how old I get, he will always be my DADDY) was so supportive when I pledged DZ! Both of my parents are the best but didn't understand why I went Greek. I think it was because of atmosphere that surrounded them during their college days, but they assumed only negative things about the Greek system. Eventually, of course, they changed their mind, but I think it's awesome that you're so supportive of your daughter, and my sister :D

[Jill1228]

BamaDadDZ, can you adopt me? :)

In all seriousness, your daughter is one lucky young lady to have a dad like you!

[Munchkin03]

Yes, this is so true. At the high school I taught @ in Miami, probably 90% of the students in the IB program went to UF, rather than going out of state, because of the free tuition from the Bright Futures scholarships, etc...

I was shocked when one of my students turned down Harvard to go to UF for free. Personally, I'd WANT my kid to choose Harvard over UF - and I'm a die-hard Gator - I will gladly take out loans (if I have to) to pay for an Ivy League education.

This is true...when I was writing the UF Recs, all of the young women who would have gone out of state stayed in because of Bright Futures. They were also telling me that about half of the kids from the local HS (an IB school) didn't get in! I'm sure I've said it before, but 8 years ago, UF was my SAFETY, and it was for most of the kids in my IB class. I almost didn't apply because I was 99% sure I wasn't going to go.

My sister, a UF alum, insisted that I NOT go to UF and to go to my much more expensive school! :D I'm glad I listened to her (for once!).

UCF is becoming more popular among kids who don't get into UF.

[alum]

Do the Hope (GA) and Bright Futures (FL) scholarship actually keep bright students in their states after graduation?

[PenguinTrax]

Do the Hope (GA) and Bright Futures (FL) scholarship actually keep bright students in their states after graduation?

They do in FL plus the FL Prepaid College Fund helps, too.

[Elephant Walk]

Northerners don't even dress up for football games...how are we expected to take them when they don't know how to dress appropriately?

[lauralaylin]

It's only appropriate to dress up for football games? I think sitting on a bleacher for 3 hours in a dress and heels sounds uncomfortable.

[PhoenixAzul]

Especially because it is COLD here in the fall. Those fall nights are terribly chilly, even if the day is warm. Heels+dress= hypothermia...or at least crabby and unpleasant.

[UMDG1873]

Well, I am new to this thread...and GC for that matter...but I'd like to put my two cents in. Ole Miss is notorious for overdressing for football games--and that's the way we like it! It's hard for me to think about going to an Ole Miss game without my pearls and a (red, of course) sundress. I personally don't wear stillettos (they sink into the grass), but I know plenty of people who do. A lot of people think Sports Illustrated said it best: "It seems that 97% of the world's really really ridiculously good-looking people go to Ole Miss. We'll check out the campus tailgate party on the Grove, where the gents sport coats and ties, toting their bourbon highballs in one hand and their highly decorative dates in the other. Chandeliers even hang in tents, providing a light in September in Faulkner country."

But anyway! At Ole Miss, Greek life is probably dominated mostly by southern girls simply because most PNM's come from MS, AL, LA, TN, GA, etc, and many of those places have alumnae groups who send lots of girls to Ole Miss. HOWEVER, there are always girls from "random" states that make quite a stir. The keys are the same for everyone, "southern" or not:

1)have a good, personal, glowing rec from an alum in the general area and 2) get to know people whenever possible! I am surprised by girls who don't really go and put themselves out there and meet girls from the chapters--in bars, on campus, in class, etc.
I know our sorority, has lots of southern ladies (we WERE founded here!), but we definitely want a good mix of girls--if she's a great girl and we learn about her through recs or through personal contact, then we want her!
Rush isn't just about your hometown, it's about getting to know people. It's joining into a group, not just wearing some Greek letters. But that's easy for us to say, because Ole Miss Greeks have recruitment midway through the first semester, and we get to meet girls during their first few weeks. I imagine it'd be really different if we had recruitment before school started.

:D

[KillarneyRose]

Northerners don't even dress up for football games...how are we expected to take them when they don't know how to dress appropriately?


LOL! I have to admit that when I attended a Vanderbilt football game a couple of years ago I was taken aback by all the young ladies walking around in Lilys (Lilies? What's the plural for a Lily Pulitzer dress, anyhow?) and strappy sandals. I thought maybe they were planning to attend church afterward!

That look wouldn't have worked at my college where it was cold and rainy on most game days, but I did think they looked really cute.

[33girl]

Northerners don't even dress up for football games...how are we expected to take them when they don't know how to dress appropriately?

Like KR said, we are dressed appropriately FOR WHERE WE ARE.

Believe me, any of the Ole Miss girls in heels and Lilys would be running to the college bookstore for sweatshirts and blankets halfway through the first quarter if they went to a game up here.

We once had a chapter consultant from the Midwest who wrote on her report that our dress was "very casual" - well, when you are on a campus with hills everywhere and where it rains or snows or mists 5 days out of 7, you're not going to be sporting heels and dress pants or a dress to class.

[Hegemon]

At my alma mater (LSU), fraternity pledges were required to dress up for tailgating and the game. I personally thought this was pretty cruel as these boys were often in suits and it was HOT HOT HOT outside. IMO, it borders on hazing! But that's not the point...If a new member of a sorority was going as the date of one of these boys, she was expected to dress up as well.

That was several years ago and now it seems like dressing up for the games has become more common for all students, whether they are Greek or not. However, the majority of the students still seem to prefer their "Game Day Casual" look :D

[ufdale]

Personally I think it's just as comfy to sit at a game in a sundress than in shorts and a tshirt. nice sundresses are made of lighter material, so they're cooler. Lol we're playing Kentucky tomorrow and I just got a memo saying we were expected to wear orange sundresses (b/c Kentucky's colors are blue and white) and look recruitment ready! lol! They don't make too many gator blue and orange dresses, or orange high heels! I love how nice sorority girls look at games though.

[TSteven]

Personally I think it's just as comfy to sit at a game in a sundress than in shorts and a tshirt. nice sundresses are made of lighter material, so they're cooler. Lol we're playing Kentucky tomorrow and I just got a memo saying we were expected to wear orange sundresses (b/c Kentucky's colors are blue and white) and look recruitment ready! lol! They don't make too many gator blue and orange dresses, or orange high heels! I love how nice sorority girls look at games though.

Go Big Blue!

[ufdale]

Can't wait for the game tomorrow! Football season has to be the best time of the year!!!
GO GATORS!!!

[AlphaFrog]

we're playing Kentucky tomorrow and I just got a memo saying we were expected to wear orange sundresses (b/c Kentucky's colors are blue and white) and look recruitment ready!

I think if our Rush Chair sent us a memo telling us to wear a purple or gold sundress (or any sundress for that matter) we would have sent her a memo back that she was f*ing crazy. Anything nicer then letters and jeans would stick out like a sore thumb at WIU.

[Elephant Walk]

Honestly, Arkansas isn't good at dressing up, but at least the top-tier greeks do to a degree

[TSteven]

Can't wait for the game tomorrow! Football season has to be the best time of the year!!!
GO GATORS!!!

If at all possible, could y'all try to keep the score under fifty. But if y'all can't help yourselves, then at least wait until the forth quarter.

Go Cats!

[blackngoldengrl]

If we had enough school spirit at my college, and it were warmer, it would have been fun to dress up once or twice. But everyone seemed to wear a school shirt/sweatshirt at our games. When I went to my boyfriend's games at Pitt, it was the same thing-but more spirit of course!

[ufdale]

lol well at UF not EVERYONE dresses up for football games. I think we dress up more for tailgating (especially if we love the frat!). I would say that a polo shirt is the most casual I've gone though.

[SoCalGirl]

I don't know if I shared this story before...an alumna from Louisiana Tech told it to me. She was a new pledge at the time and it was her first football game with the chapter. They also team up with a fraternity for their dates to the game. Well, girls were all dressed up in their skirts and dresses and were taking care of the finishing touches when her date walked in with a flask in one hand and tape in the other. She asked what it was for and he told her it was for her THIGH. All the girls were strapped!!! :D I about died from laughter.

[tunatartare]

LMAO because my sisters and friends have definitely done that for formals.

[TSteven]

I don't know if I shared this story before...an alumna from Louisiana Tech told it to me. She was a new pledge at the time and it was her first football game with the chapter. They also team up with a fraternity for their dates to the game. Well, girls were all dressed up in their skirts and dresses and were taking care of the finishing touches when her date walked in with a flask in one hand and tape in the other. She asked what it was for and he told her it was for her THIGH. All the girls were strapped!!! :D I about died from laughter.

Must have been fun doing shots!

[BamaDad DZ]

I believe my daughter said something about flasks and uhhhhhh the upper torso area of the sun dress. I didn't even want to think about it....

[Hegemon]

At my first college football game, the pledge brother of my bf at the time put some whiskey in a ziploc bag and "stored" it in his crotch area. I am not quite sure how he kept it in place, but he had it again in the stadium so I know it was safely smuggled in. The students usually got searched (the guys patted down, the girls purses checked), but those with tickets outside of the student section usually do not. At my first game in the non-student section I was surprised to see how many "grown ups" had their own flasks! :D

[alum]

Oh my goodness! This is definitely going on the list of questions for the next lengthy phone call to the college freshman.....

[UCFgirl]

UCF is becoming more popular among kids who don't get into UF.

I take offense to this, as not only did I not apply to UF, I do not, and never want, to go there.

Also, even though I graduated a few years ago, not a single person in my 440 person class attended UF.

UCF is becoming more popular because we are a GREAT school with a lot to offer, not because we couldnt get into UF.

Please do not make assumptions about a school being a safety school when it is not for many of us...

[RedRover]

Out of curiosity, is it difficult for a guy from the North to get a bid from a fraternity at a Southern college or univerisity. Or does it depend on the fraternity (a couple Greek letter organizations for men are known to be "Southern fraternities").

Are family ties and recommendations as important for fraternity men as it seems to be for sorority women?

Just wonderin'

[ΑΓΔSquirrelGirl]

I wouldn't have gone through Recruitment at Alabama (I would NEVER go to Auburn...the horror) because usually to get into the "top" (depending on how you're judging them) sororities on campus you have to have some good connections. I don't have them. My only advantage would be my hometown, because we are supposed to be a bright young bunch of rich, well connected, successful kids (I got two out of three). I have several Kappa Deltas in my family (one Phi Mu, and now an AOPi, but that's recent), but would I have gotten into KD at Alabama? You better believe I wouldn't. The northern girls who get into sororities like that (Tri Delt, KD, Kappa Kappa Gamma, for instance) have connections, I guarantee you.

But if you are looking for just a good fit, there are newer and less picky sororities on campus at SEC schools which are just as good. I'm glad I didn't have to do Recruitment at a big school like that. We have five sororites, with under 50 girls per party at any time during the week. It's a whole different world.

[EGAOPi]

I take offense to this, as not only did I not apply to UF, I do not, and never want, to go there.

Also, even though I graduated a few years ago, not a single person in my 440 person class attended UF.

UCF is becoming more popular because we are a GREAT school with a lot to offer, not because we couldnt get into UF.

Please do not make assumptions about a school being a safety school when it is not for many of us...

Thank you for posting this--I completely agree!
I am a PROUD student at USF...like you, I did not apply to UF (or even consider going there). I have been to UF/Gainesville and didn't get a good vibe. I like FSU but I decided to stick close to home for now since I eventually want to move to NYC.
USF was the only school I applied to because when I came to visit, it immediately felt like home. I love it and couldn't possibly be happier.
I know plenty of people that went to UF and hated it and actually transferred here (to USF) and to UCF.
UF, FSU, USF and UCF (and even some other FL schools) are all good in their own ways and all have something to offer--something DIFFERENT for each individual.
To say that people only go to other FL schools is because they were rejected from UF is SHEER IGNORANCE.

[BamaDad DZ]

I am a USF alum. Go Bulls!!!!!!!!

I loved USF, but my youngest daughter prefers FSU or UF. Oh well. My oldest, of course, goes to the one and only University of Alabama (for those of you who remember me and my posts about Bama recruitment).

I agree there is something to be said for Northerners trying to break into better Southern soroities at SEC-type schools. My daughter is from Northern Virginia, but she got into DZ, which has a very fine reputation at Bama. And all the way through recruitment she always had twice as many invites as she could accept for each particular day. I believe there is a lot of truth to the idea that Notherners may have it tough - in general - getting into a name sorority at an SEC school.

Recruitment at Bama is insane. My daughter's stories were unbelievable. Did you know that 1,024 were offered bids out of almost 1,400 young ladies who initiated the recruitment process at Bama? So many did not get theiir desired houses, but I'll bet most ended up very, very happy with their ultimate sorority home. All sororities are pretty much awesome as I remember.

A very proud DZ Dad.....BamaDad DZ

[Ocalagirl]

I take offense to this, as not only did I not apply to UF, I do not, and never want, to go there.

Also, even though I graduated a few years ago, not a single person in my 440 person class attended UF.

UCF is becoming more popular because we are a GREAT school with a lot to offer, not because we couldnt get into UF.

Please do not make assumptions about a school being a safety school when it is not for many of us...

I very much have to agree with you on this one. Although UCF is not the place for me, it has a lot of wonderful things to offer and everyone that I have met loves it down here and is going to stay. Set aside the still wonderful Greek system, and you have a thriving campus with many activities and clubs to get involved in plus the benefits of living in a pretty big city. For the girls its great cause we have two of the biggest malls in Florida (in my opinion) with everything to offer. My half-sister only applied here and just recently graduated and couldn't believed that I was leaving. She loved it here and couldn't imagine going anywhere else. I also agree with one of the above posts...every university/college in the state of Florida has something to offer to someone. Every school has something special to offer and you just have to find the one that fits you. Actually while I am transferring to UF, I think it is sad that the state is trying to make UF the TOP UNIVERSITY when every one is great. Every university I believe should have the same playing field as the others.
<<Getting off my soap box..lol>>>

[ufdale]

I think it is sad that the state is trying to make UF the TOP UNIVERSITY when every one is great. Every university I believe should have the same playing field as the others.
<<Getting off my soap box..lol>>>
haha maybe the state could send a little money to its univeristies if Florida wants to get better universities. Just a thought. It's no suprise that California has such great universities, they spend so much more on students.

[Ocalagirl]

haha maybe the state could send a little money to its univeristies if Florida wants to get better universities. Just a thought. It's no suprise that California has such great universities, they spend so much more on students.

Amen!!!!!! although Florida public universities do have a low cost for in-state students, though every time I go to pay tuition I feel like I'm being robbed!! lol

[IvySpice]

It's no suprise that California has such great universities, they spend so much more on students.

It must also be said that California does not try to put all its universities on the same playing field. They have an explicit tier system, treating flagship, elite and less selective universities quite differently.

[RU OX Alum]

This is something I may know a little about. My daughter rushed Alabama as an incoming freshman non-legacy from Northern Virginia (even the folks in Richmond think we are a separate entity). Quite a few of our Northern neighbors living in the surrounding Washington, DC area.



That is quite a generalization. About Richmonders, I mean.

[alum]

That is quite a generalization. About Richmonders, I mean.

Not necessarily. I agree with BamaDad. Northern VA is not the South.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/11/15/AR2006111501395_pf.html

[Jill1228]

I SO agree with BamaDad. I grew up in Southern VA but spent quite a bit of my adult life in Northern VA and they are definitely 2 different places.

I gotta admit I really miss Northern VA

[cavaliercutie10]

Interesting...We know lots of Virginians who didn't get into UVa &/or William and Mary...

I can't imagine that Chapel Hill/Berkeley/Ann Arbor being much different than UVa and W&M....These are why these schools are in top rankings of the country. Based on the way my neighbors speak, I think they would gladly downgrade the national ranking of our flagship public schools if it would mean more instate kids would be admitted.

Noooo! I'm an out-of-stater at UVA and I love it more than life itself and if anybody took it away from me I'd cry! :p UVA is a much more respected school than any of my in-state public options, and public or not, it was my top choice university for all of the amazing things it offers its students academically and socially. No fair that only Virginians should get to enjoy the most wonderful university in America! :D

Tons of UVA's students are from NoVa and while UVA itself has a very well developed Southern flavor that I ADORE (grits and biscuits w/ gravy in the dining hall? Sweet tea on tap? Dresses and ties to the football games?), I would have to say that overall it's not as "Southern" a University as it could be thanks to the large of influx of cultured city kids from D.C. suburbs. Nothern VA definitely isn't the South--where I'm from they'd laugh you out of the room if you tried to suggest that it was. Well, no they wouldn't--they're much too polite! ;)

[AggieADPi10]

I really think that being from out of state actually helps girls going through rush. I am from Chicago and when I came to Texas A&M for Fall Recruitment, I still had a thick Chicago accent. Since the majority of other girls going through Rush were from Texas, it made it easier for me to stand out and be remembered; thus, I had a very successfull Recruitment Week.

[kappa_babe]

Rush at an SEC school is very tough we have 8 sororties at my school 2000 girls entered through the recruitment process but only about 580 of us got bids to houses. There were some girls from Chicago and New York but they plegeded KD I think but there moms were from Arkansas and were in sororites so that may gave them an edge during the recruitment process

[33girl]

Rush at an SEC school is very tough we have 8 sororties at my school 2000 girls entered through the recruitment process but only about 580 of us got bids to houses.

I believe what you mean to say is 2000 may have signed up but some were found to be ineligible due to grades or dropped out of their own free will before going the whole way through rush. Any school that only places a fourth of its rushees who COMPLETE rush is in serious violation of Panhellenic policies regarding quota.

I know it sounds more "elite" to say it your way, but it really isn't the whole truth.

[kappa_babe]

Let me clarify my last post
2000 girls entered through the recruitment process they dropped out for various reasons grades, cut by the house they wanted. By the end of the week only 580 of us recieved bids.

[BadCat25]

There is something wrong when so many PNM's do not get bids. This is a classic case where another sorority should be brought in. That this has not been done is the fault of both PanHell and the Greek Life people. I just can't imagine them not doing something about this. This is just wrong.

[MSKKG]

Grades are understandable. However, if the PNMs drop out because they were cut from the GLOs they wanted, that is not the fault of Panhellenic or Greek Life (maybe indirectly if they haven't stressed Greek Life in general). You cannot make someone pledge a GLO just to make your numbers look good.

I wish all PNMs would go through recruitment with an open mind and try to find a reason to like each group instead of focusing on what they don't like about each group. Yes, there are times when certain groups are not a good fit with a PNM and life would be miserable on both fronts if the PNM joined just for the sake of being in a GLO. How many times though have we heard PNMs say they got their 2nd or 3rd choice and can't imagine being in any other GLO?

[BamaBelle1987]

I go to a Southern school (bet you can't guess which one...haha) and I know some girls from out-of-state and out-of-the-South who were extended bids to join sororities. It is not common, though. Most girls who are from outside the South have to have either really outgoing personalities that automatically click with a certain sorority or has to have connections. Unfortunately, southern schools have a pretty difficult rush process and many times they are based on who knows who. The sorority I am in tries to give everyone a fair chance and we have some great girls who didn't have "inside connections" (so to say), but they are not in the majority.

[kappa_babe]

There is something wrong when so many PNM's do not get bids. This is a classic case where another sorority should be brought in. That this has not been done is the fault of both PanHell and the Greek Life people. I just can't imagine them not doing something about this. This is just wrong.

We are actually in the process of recruting new sororties for our campus we got AOII this year and in the process of three years five new sororities are coming on campus but no details of which ones yet

[OTW]

We are actually in the process of recruting new sororties for our campus we got AOII this year and in the process of three years five new sororities are coming on campus but no details of which ones yet

Three years and five new sororities? I'm sorry, but I find that hard to believe.

[carnation]

I'm an Arkansas alum and I find that hard to believe too. I doubt that UA could find 5 new sororities who would come. There are at least 5 nationals that have folded there--good, strong ones--and you can bet if they folded, most of the rest are saying, 'No way." I don't even think those 5 have any desire to come back.

I also doubt that 2000 girls signed up for recruitment.

[irishpipes]

I have the recruitment stats for Arkansas for the past 8 years right in front of me. 2,000 is not even in the right ballpark. The number of women registered varies but every year it hovers around 475-500. It has been steadily increasing, however. The number who withdrew is around 75 each year. The number released is usually around 15-20.

Also, I can tell you that there is no way there are 5 new sororities coming. There has been speculation of one additional sorority, depending on AOII's results.

[Elephant Walk]

I don't know how many that dropped because of grades, but I do know that something like 1,500 went thru.

[DeltaBetaBaby]

No, sweetie, that's how many delusions went through your head.

(Can I add "bless your heart" here? Someone from the South help me out.)

[Elephant Walk]

I wish you wouldn't speak of what you don't know.

[OTW]

I have the recruitment stats for Arkansas for the past 8 years right in front of me. 2,000 is not even in the right ballpark. The number of women registered varies but every year it hovers around 475-500. It has been steadily increasing, however. The number who withdrew is around 75 each year. The number released is usually around 15-20.

Also, I can tell you that there is no way there are 5 new sororities coming. There has been speculation of one additional sorority, depending on AOII's results.

I'd think that irishpipes' info was more credible than the other numbers that were posted in this thread. :)

I don't know how many that dropped because of grades, but I do know that something like 1,500 went thru.

I wish you wouldn't speak of what you don't know.

Funny, one could say the same thing for you. :)

[Elephant Walk]

I have the recruitment stats for Arkansas for the past 8 years right in front of me. 2,000 is not even in the right ballpark. The number of women registered varies but every year it hovers around 475-500. It has been steadily increasing, however. The number who withdrew is around 75 each year. The number released is usually around 15-20.
Are you stupid?

For 7 sororities, quota is 75. That puts it at over 500 because nearly every sorority makes quota. However, this year AOPi did not participate in rush and took around 95. Even further more, usually over a hundred to a hundred and fifty girls. Over half the freshman girls class rushes.

[carnation]

75 x 7=515 plus 95=610. Also, not all 7 groups took quota, so we're talking about maybe 600 girls going Greek. No way do I believe that 2000 rushed. Also, no way do I believe that kappababe is a KKG at Arkansas because of all the groups, the Kappas pride themselves on their scholastics and no KKG there would use such bad grammar and spelling as kappababe.

[carnation]

75 x 7=515 plus 95=610. Also, not all 7 groups took quota, so we're talking about maybe 600 girls going Greek. No way do I believe that 2000 rushed. Also, no way do I believe that kappababe is a KKG at Arkansas because of all the groups, the Kappas pride themselves on their scholastics and no KKG there would use such bad grammar and spelling as kappababe. To quote her:

"Rush at an SEC school is very tough we have 8 sororties at my school 2000 girls entered through the recruitment process but only about 580 of us got bids to houses. There were some girls from Chicago and New York but they plegeded KD I think but there moms were from Arkansas and were in sororites so that may gave them an edge during the recruitment process"

Sororties? Plegeded? There moms? Sororites? That may gave them an edge?:rolleyes:

[carnation]

I think we'll close this for the time being, as we've gotten waaaayy off the point. It will return.