DARK/LIGHT...SKIN COLOR.........Is this still an issue? Let's be honest Sorors & SF'

[deja]

Is this an issue? I was in the mall a few days ago and a nice looking brother in his late 30's maybe early forties approached me. (Very nice looking Sorors) Any whooo, we were in engaged in a little small talk and all of a sudden I lost my hearing,,,,,yes I went absolutely deaf. I just could not hear pass the words that left the lips of this fine, well built 6"5 about 210 "dark-skinned" brothers full lips (beautiful white teeth). The words Sorors & SF's were......."You are so pretty to be sooo dark." I still cannot believe that. Is it written some where that dark-skin sisters are biologically challenged, where beauty is concerned? Is it an unwritten law/belief that beauty is only among the white/prit near white?

Surely this is not still an issue!

Deja

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TO WHOM MUCH IS GIVEN....MUCH IS EXPECTED.

[darling1]

To answer your question deja, yes you are biologically challenged. God forbid you are a reminder of Mother Africa http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gif. Sista I am being sarcastic here but that just shows you that somethings have not changed. I am on the other side of the spectrum and I remember one time at a club with my girlfriend and she said in so many words that if SHE were my complection she would be getting numbers and invites to the dance floor. I was p***ed to say the least. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif It makes me sad to here about stories like yours but it is also true in many cases you the lighter you are the more accepting you are. Just look at BET for example. The VeeJay Rachel is fair skinned very appealing to the eyes because she is light. But the chick couldn't interview to save her life!! Now Big Lez who is a much more down to earth woman and has far better interviewing skills gets put on Rap City which if I remember correctly comes on later in the evening. This situation is sad. I personally don't have an answer to it. This brother definitely has some issues http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif and unfortunately the higher up you go in your career the worse in can get. All you can do is be strong within yourself and pray those who are in that land of confusion. Peace

[Serenity]

Deja,

Been there, girl. It can be truly shocking when this happens. Epecially when the brother is dark-skinned himself. HELLO!

I once had a guy tell me that his mother would have nothing to do with his kids if they were dark-skinned. Sad....really and truly sad. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif I have heard mothers tell their children to come in out of the sun because they don't want them to get too black. God forbid!

I could go on and on. Like they say, as much as things change they still stay the same. Like Darling1 says, we just have to continue to be strong and pray for the "confused" ones. We are all beautiful in God's eyes. Believe that! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/biggrin.gif

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Sincerity, Loyalty, Unity

[daruler]

Unfortunately, this kind of stuff will continue for years and years. If it's not the light/dark thing, it's the good VS. bad hair. I am light skinned with what would be termed "good hair" that is wavy and down the middle of my back. What question do I always get? "What are you." Now I am not mixed with anything, both of my parents are black. But before people find out, they always seem to be intrigued by the fact that maybe i could have a little something running thru my blood other than black. I think it all goes back to how for as long as we've been in this country, we have been made to feel like black was not good enough. So this whole light/dark complex that we have will not go away until somehow we can realize all of the beauty that comes with being black, no matter what shade we are.

[ssh1980]

Deja, you are not alone. I get that all the time. I've actually had a white male teacher tell me that I was a pretty dark-skinned girl. If I'm pretty, what does being dark have to do with it. It's something I've just learned to except, but it has also made me favor pretty dark-skinned ladies...I guess because I feel the need to take up for 'my kind.' The media doesn't help the situation at all. All you see are bright skinned girls with long hair. I even notice dark skinned famous people gradually getting brighter and brighter. I just don't know what the deal is?

[Anydaynow]

I am a dark skinned sister and I am GLAD to see brothas date light skinned women. WHY? because atleast she's black. The problem is getting so bad that my light skinned, long hair 1/2 black 1/2 white friend got pushed on the dance floor because a brotha was trying to get to a white girl who wasn't even cute. The situation is so bad that she is even sick of them dating white women and her mother is white.

I don't have a problem with people dating outside of their race...however it is becoming an epidemic with brothas dating white girls. You see it everywhere.

So when I see a black man (positive) with a black woman (dark or light) I get over joyed and wish them lots of luck.

[Serenity]

Hmmmmmmm.......I never really thought of it that way Anydaynow. Good point. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

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Sincerity, Loyalty, Unity

[Taykimson]

Soror Deja,

Yes this is still an issue...and I have to deal with it right at home. I would classify myself as brown-skinned (between light-skinned and dark-skinned) my husband is dark-skinned. My oldest daughter is my complexion (who is almost 5), my baby girl is my husband's complexion (who is 3). My almost 5 year-old child is corrupted. Because of what she hears on the playground at daycare, she has called her sister black! Well needles to say my reaction was pretty strong. Reflecting back it was probably too strong. With kids they will always continue to do the one thing that gets a strong reaction from their parents.

Anyhow, I'm still struggling on how to deal with the issue...I need help on how to enlighten my oldest daughter, and how to ensure my youngest grows up with confidence and does not feel second best. By the way, both of my daughters are very pretty (and that's not a mother's bias talking! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif )

[CuRiOuSiTy]

Hello Ladies!!!

Taykimson: I am sorry to her that your child's mind has been corrupted at such a young age. It really is sad. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/frown.gif I don't have any children but I would say explain to your child that yes her sister is Black but so is she. They're just different shades of black. Explain to her that black people come in all kinds of different colors and the differences don't make anyone any less/more beautiful, special, etc....

When will we as a race realize that it doesn't matter what complexion you are....you're still black? Nobody (of other races)really looks at you and sees light skin or dark skin they see a black person. We are more color struck than anyone. We are quick to put one another down before anyone else will. That is our main problem as a race. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/confused.gif And as soon as we can free our minds of this type of thinking we will be on our way to a more prosperous future as a people.

http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif On a happier note HAPPY MOTHERS DAY to everyone who is blessed with kids or is blessed with one, two, three, etc...on the way!!!!
sorry for the lenght of my post http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/redface.gif
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"We are each of us angels with one wing, We can only fly embracing each other."

[This message has been edited by CuRiOuSiTy (edited May 14, 2000).]

[tickledpink]

Unfortunately, Deja, this is still an issue. I grew up in the south where racism was something we encountered on a daily basis. When we are so hated by others, I can't understand why we inflict the hatred on our own. What that brother didn't realize is that his comment was right up there with "You speak so well...." and reflects his true inner feelings about himself.

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>>>"Many women do noble things, but you surpass them all."
Charm is deceptive and beauty is fleeting, but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised... Proverbs 31:29-30

[gypsy]

I'm saddened to say that yes this still goes on. I'm brown-skinned, right in the middle. There are times that I wished that I was lighter and there are times that I wished that I was darker because to me I think that they all are beautiful. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif I do this when I see a beautiful light woman or a gorgeous dark woman. They come in all shades. We, as African Americans should br very happy with our whole race because the black race is a beautiful rainbow of brown complexions. We have "yellow sunshine", "red roses", "brown sugar", "sweet chocolates", "licorice black"..even more than that (just can't go into such description). http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/cool.gif Now that ALL sounds good to me. Even though this is NOT the best thing to go back to but....think about the song by WOOTANG. All the delicious flavors of the African American woman. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/wink.gif

Now, on the down side. My boyfriend of 5 years HAPPENS to be light skinned. http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/rolleyes.gif I didn't pick him because of that, I was just blessed with his every being. I think that he's one of the most beautiful men in the world, BUT........he made the comment about a girl.."She's cute for a dark-skinned girl." Girls, I went off the hindges with him." "It pissed me off that he said something so stupid." http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/mad.gif I've been bringing it up to the past three weeks because it pissed me off so much. He constantly says that he didn't mean it like that. I'm going to drill his head until I get tired of doing it. Even though we hear these things just think back to what I said.

Some may say that I may not know how it feels because I'm in the middle. But I will correct you on that.. I do BECAUSE I'm black!!! And being black is the single ingrediant that we need to come together and do what's important. That's all!!

And to the mother with the son issue...just keep teaching him. You will see what his final conclusion will be. And that is .... what his momma taught him! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

[tickledpink]

Well said gypsy.


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>>>"Many women do noble things, but you surpass them all."
Charm is deceptive and beauty is fleeting, but a woman who fears the Lord is to be praised... Proverbs 31:29-30

[Soror Pinkacres]

Ladies I have heard that slanted compliment all my life (adult life) I was a funny looking little girl, thanks to those BIG purple glasses my mommie made me wear!!!! but that is another subject (I am currently in therapy for http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Anyway it is sad that brothers actually think they are paying you a compliment when they say that! I am pretty because of who I am don't qualify my blessing!!! I have a very ignorant cousin who when her baby was born would not hold her beacuse she was of a darker hue. Her first child was of a ligher complextion. She indicated that she was not use to "a dark child". Some stuff I can not even internalize it is too painful to deal with, I just shook my head. Now the baby is 5 years old and her mother is constantly slicking her hair down, dressing her up and trying to do whatever to "make-up" for her darker complextion. I see what she is doing and it is sad. She use to do my hair and would frequently comment "you sure are a pretty Chocalate thang" My reply was always the same, "Liz you are one ignorant thang." Girl just roll with the punches life deals some interesting blows! But, this is an issue which will not go away, God loves me and is very very good to me, what people say about me means nothing!!!

[pink bunny]

I already posted on this subject on the Cita thread, but dang i hate it when Brothers say stupid stuff like that to me. Like i said in my other post, some people are trying to lighten their family tree thinking it will end thier suffering as black people, but it won't. The madness will only stop when the masses put an end to this warped mentality. But i'm beginning to think that some people don't want it to end because it benefits them. We as black women can have three children each completely different in skin color, so it would seem that all of us would want to stop this self hatred because eventually it will affect someone in our family, if not our children, theirs.

[mizzkes]

Hello ladies. This is a topic that gets me riled up every time. I hope that I dont sound too radical. The complexion issue is one of those issues that were put into place hundreds of years ago (by whites slave masters) to keep us divided. Lets not forget that the lighter complected,mixed race slaves were "houseslaves" while the darker complected ones were "field slaves". This was a technique used to keep the race divided so as to avoid revolts. This issue is one of the major self perpetuating complexes that we as black people buy into. It is sad that "we" are so cought up in skin color when there are so many other more important issues for us to deal with as a race. Lets talk about economics, crime, injustice...
I've heard children express the same things as mentioned above. My nieces and nephews came home saying that my mother is choclate and I am vanilla. My nephew told me that he like vanilla girls. Of course I gave him a long lecture on the issue. My mom had an exprience with a brother from her church. He is a dark complected man who is a single father of a really dark complected father. This man is the center of the attention of many of the single sisters in the congregation. Do you know that he had the nerve to say that he wants to marry a light complected woman?!!! My mother said to him "Well if every man felt the way you do, then your daughter will never find a husband. What do you think of that?" He was dumbfounded of course. I just think that it is a deep rooted issue that will be hard to change on the national scale. It is sad.

[daruler]

I just thought of something positive that I would like to share on this issue:
Freshmen year my friends and I were trying to weigh the options on which sorority to join. I hadn't been exposed to Greek life prior to this so I kind of based everything off of what my friends had to say. Two of us were light skinned, the other two dark skinned. Well my friends all seemed to think that we light two should be AKA's and the dark two should be Delta's because that is the way things are. But that spring when their new lines came out, there were more brown/dark skinned AKA's than Delta's and more light skinned Delta's than AKA's. I just remember being very relieved. I guess the point is that, no matter what people may have felt at one time about skin tone, educated people have sense enough to put all of that aside. Now we just have to sit back and wait for everyone else.

[deja]

This has truely been an exciting topic to read. One we are of one but with so many different ideas and beliefs.

No matter our hue, we are all Sorors. Now that is beautiful. Oh, yes, and big hugs to my SF's.

Deja

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TO WHOM MUCH IS GIVEN....MUCH IS EXPECTED.

[Steeltrap]

I decided to kick this one up in view of this news from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution:
Applebee's settles color bias complaint

By TAMMY JOYNER
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/images/0803/burch0808opt.jpg

A former Applebee's employee who said he was harassed by his black supervisor because of his color has received a $40,000 settlement in an agreement reached between the Kansas-based restaurant chain and the federal Equal Employment Opportunity Commission.

The lawsuit, part of a rare but growing trend of intraracial harassment claims, was resolved through a consent decree filed with the U.S. District Court in Atlanta. In addition to paying Dwight Burch, who worked at the Applebee's in Jonesboro, the company must provide anti-discrimination training to its workers.

Burch said he was called derogatory names by the store manager because he is dark-skinned. The manager is light-skinned. Burch said he was fired when he threatened to report the store manager's behavior to Applebee's headquarters in Overland Park, Kan.

Applebee's spokesman Frank Ybarra said in a statement that the company admits no wrongdoing and settled "to clear the way for the sale of our restaurants in Atlanta to one of our franchisees."

Burch joined the suburban Atlanta restaurant in December 2000 and was fired in March 2001.

"I am grateful that the EEOC filed this lawsuit, not just for me but for other workers, too," Burch said in an EEOC statement. "No one should have to put up with mean and humiliating comments about the color of their skin on the job."

Color bias filings have risen from 413 in 1994 to 1,382 in 2002.

"It's an important case," said Robert Royal, EEOC regional attorney in Atlanta. "People don't realize color discrimination is [covered] under Title VII. It affords protection not only to African-Americans but Hispanics ... and everybody of color."

The Associated Press contributed to this article.

[Exquisite5]

I am glad that article was posted because some of us have been lead to believe that color preference was instituted by the slave master during slavery and that white America then left it alone. That simply is not true. Color preferences are used every day in corporate America. It is probably more common that name-profiling.


Just survey the scene you will find far more A.A.'s in high corporate positions of light to brown skin tones.

My mother, who is "light" by almost ALL standards, but was treated differently as a child because she was the darkest girl in her Jennings, LA native family, has openly told me she would not be where she is today (VP of a major bank/investment firm) had she been darker. My mother doesn't even consider herself light, but she is the color of Tracy Ellis Ross. Her sister is about the color of Vanessa Williams and always got the preferential treatment.

When discussing why her boss, a black male, was a Senior VP and she was not (she has an outstanding record...over a million in sales last year) she said it had to do with his sex (banking is a big boys club) and the way he looked. He is VERY fair with the requisite wavy hair. She said while the face of corporate IS changing (SLOWLY) they just still lean towards blacks who look like them.

So while our self-hatred is depressing and infuriating. Please don't be deceived, even in 2003, it is not only self-inflicted.

[iceandivy]

At least I know now that it isn't just me!!!!

I have been told that I am "pretty for a dark skinned girl."
What the heck does THAT mean?!?

My son is fair-skinned, and people assume so much about us. My boyfriend is darker than him, but lighter than me, and if we go out, people automatically ask him questions about my son (how old is he?) and direct comments to him (oh, he is so cute). And I have to push him aside to say, "4.. and thank you!" The same things happen with my lighter skinned friends. They ask or assume that his father is white (ummmmm.... naw.). We as black people should know that we come in all colors and not assume stuff like that.

Once, a white lady came up to me and said, "Oh, your son is such a pretty color." She expected me to say, "thank you." I just looked at her as if to say, "Soooooooooooo..... my color is what?"
It is a trip.

People still do care.

[iceandivy]

As far as BGLO's go, I think most stereotypes only exist in the minds of non-greeks. (AKA's are light skinned, Delta's are dark skinned, Kappa's are light skinned, Alphas are dark skinned, etc.) I can only think of a handful of campuses who still use the paper-bag test. Very few care anymore. Greeks are always in the forefront, aren't they?!? :)

[sphinxpoet]

Funny thing is was I was in the bookstore and I was about to pick up the color complex and I said nah I think maybe we have come a little farther since that was written (Sometimes you give people too many compliments) :rolleyes: Well being dark skinned myself I grew up with a lot of issues about that and I had to get over that! I think our people still take that seriously until we see more darkskinned women on TV and a more broad based spectrum of people of the African descent then the whole complex will never change!

[miss priss]

Originally posted by iceandivy
At least I know now that it isn't just me!!!!

I have been told that I am "pretty for a dark skinned girl."
What the heck does THAT mean?!?



Thank-you so much for saying this...I have experienced this more than a few times:rolleyes: and it pisses me off to no end!

When my daughter was born she was VERY light-skinned, everyone looked at me then looked at her--I sarcastically said her father was white, then they would say "oh that explains it" ;but, I would laugh and say her father was light-skinned. The killer part is they would say oh she is so cute but then turn right around and say she looks just like her daddy---even though I've been told she looks just like me but lighter....:rolleyes:

I just completed a feminist class, and this issue was one I found very hard to explain to my white female counterparts. America is still shielded with the concept of race.
But ya know even today color is still an issue...it's so sad :(

[Steeltrap]

Originally posted by sphinxpoet
Funny thing is was I was in the bookstore and I was about to pick up the color complex and I said nah I think maybe we have come a little farther since that was written (Sometimes you give people too many compliments) :rolleyes: Well being dark skinned myself I grew up with a lot of issues about that and I had to get over that! I think our people still take that seriously until we see more darkskinned women on TV and a more broad based spectrum of people of the African descent then the whole complex will never change!

Thanks for posting this. For years, I thought that the dark/light skinned issue always slammed women in a disproportionate manner, as you alluded to when you mentioned that we need to see more darker-skinned women on TV, etc.

[sphinxpoet]

Originally posted by Steeltrap
Thanks for posting this. For years, I thought that the dark/light skinned issue always slammed women in a disproportionate manner, as you alluded to when you mentioned that we need to see more darker-skinned women on TV, etc.
Soror,
I can honestly say this plays a great part in self esteem. Growing up darkskinned in America can be difficult for both men and women. Rarely do we see positive images of both sides of the fence even today. BET plays into that in their original programming!

[1savvydiva]

@ ST, this was a very interesting article! Do you think it would apply to my situation? Actually, I was very heated when I wrote that HC this morning, I have calmed down considerably. I talked to my Auntie about it and she said that maybe I shouldn't say anything. I have basically chalked it up to ignorance (on her part of course), but I still don't feel comfortable (actually it burns me a bit) that she is so incredibly uncouth. Honestly, now that I am sitting here writing this, there have been occasions where she's made little inuendos about me going to RN school and "being so proper", and that makes me uncomfortable. I guess she may be jealous because I am trying to do something with myself, but I think sometimes she just does stuff for shock value. I really need to think about this before I proceed, but I do want to report it, (at the very least, it is just inappropriate), I am just weighing who I should report it to first. The first person that I actually SHOULD report it to is the ER RN Manager, but like I said, she is their little 'mascot' so I may have to take it elsewhere.

[Steeltrap]

Originally posted by 1savvydiva
@ ST, this was a very interesting article! Do you think it would apply to my situation? Actually, I was very heated when I wrote that HC this morning, I have calmed down considerably. I talked to my Auntie about it and she said that maybe I shouldn't say anything. I have basically chalked it up to ignorance (on her part of course), but I still don't feel comfortable (actually it burns me a bit) that she is so incredibly uncouth. Honestly, now that I am sitting here writing this, there have been occasions where she's made little inuendos about me going to RN school and "being so proper", and that makes me uncomfortable. I guess she may be jealous because I am trying to do something with myself, but I think sometimes she just does stuff for shock value. I really need to think about this before I proceed, but I do want to report it, (at the very least, it is just inappropriate), I am just weighing who I should report it to first. The first person that I actually SHOULD report it to is the ER RN Manager, but like I said, she is their little 'mascot' so I may have to take it elsewhere.

It might apply to your situation. I would check with the HR people at your hospital, too. If it were me, I'd report it. She needs to keep her tacky comments to herself.

As an aside, it seems like your co-worker is putting her lack of self-esteem, etc. on you. Classic crabs-in-the-barrel syndrome. :rolleyes:

[exquizit]

Originally posted by miss priss
Thank-you so much for saying this...I have experienced this more than a few times:rolleyes: and it pisses me off to no end!

When my daughter was born she was VERY light-skinned, everyone looked at me then looked at her--I sarcastically said her father was white, then they would say "oh that explains it" ;but, I would laugh and say her father was light-skinned. The killer part is they would say oh she is so cute but then turn right around and say she looks just like her daddy---even though I've been told she looks just like me but lighter....:rolleyes:

I just completed a feminist class, and this issue was one I found very hard to explain to my white female counterparts. America is still shielded with the concept of race. And within the Afro-American

But ya know even today color is still an issue...it's so sad :(


I had the same problem with the brat when she was born. What kills me is that they act as though they're giving you a compliment by commenting on how pretty their light skin is , or just how much they look like a white baby...WTF?:mad: :mad:

I also feel it's stupid of them to say........"Oh she must have gotten her color from her daddy":rolleyes:

Does it matter? I mean we're beautiful no matter what shade we're in!!!

[1savvydiva]

Originally posted by Steeltrap
It might apply to your situation. I would check with the HR people at your hospital, too. If it were me, I'd report it. She needs to keep her tacky comments to herself.

As an aside, it seems like your co-worker is putting her lack of self-esteem, etc. on you. Classic crabs-in-the-barrel syndrome. :rolleyes:

You know, what's sad is that Pastor spoke briefly about this on Sunday. He was saying that basically: My blessing is not predicated upon your failure. This is not a see-saw world...you don't have to go down before I can rise up. We do this, I don't know why! :rolleyes: Everything that I am blessed with, God will do the same for you! Don't hate on me, just get YOURSELF on point.

ETA: I don't think that her comment this morning was so much directed at me, but it just made me uncomfortable. (I just wanted to clarify for someone who pm'd me last night :rolleyes: )

[FeeFee]

Originally posted by 1savvydiva
You know, what's sad is that Pastor spoke briefly about this on Sunday. He was saying that basically: My blessing is not predicated upon your failure. This is not a see-saw world...you don't have to go down before I can rise up. We do this, I don't know why! :rolleyes: Everything that I am blessed with, God will do the same for you! Don't hate on me, just get YOURSELF on point.

ETA: I don't think that her comment this morning was so much directed at me, but it just made me uncomfortable. (I just wanted to clarify for someone who pm'd me last night :rolleyes: )

Even though her comment wasn't directed at you, your reaction to the comment is what's important. Same thing for sexual harrassment, it's not just what was done or said (directly or indirectly), it's also a person's reaction/comfort level with it.
I must agree, she is facing some serious self-esteem problems here, and she' projecting them on you.

[Kimmie1913]

Originally posted by iceandivy
I can only think of a handful of campuses who still use the paper-bag test. Very few care anymore. Greeks are always in the forefront, aren't they?!? :)

Please, please, please tell me you are kidding about being able to name any school that still uses the paper bag test??? See this is one of those behaviors and obsessions that we as Black people have that I swear is pathological.

I am light, bright and damn near white in complexion. I used to go to bed as a child and pray that i would wake up any color darker than what I am. It took a long time to get over that.

As far as color and BGLO's- you would be amazed how many people who try to guess my affiliation say "you look like an AKA." It is definitely still out there that light skinned, long hair = AKA. I think it is such a disservice to the members of both organizations. It infuriates me.

[Jill1228]

Unfortunately it is still an issue. I even heard my grandmother say "She is real BLACK but she is pretty". WTF is up with that!?
If I had a dollar for every time I was dissed for being dark (I am one of the darker ones in my family), I would retire! :rolleyes:

Come on! Our community has other serious issues to deal with besides this BS!

Originally posted by mizzkes
I've heard children express the same things as mentioned above. My nieces and nephews came home saying that my mother is choclate and I am vanilla. My nephew told me that he like vanilla girls. Of course I gave him a long lecture on the issue. My mom had an exprience with a brother from her church. He is a dark complected man who is a single father of a really dark complected father. This man is the center of the attention of many of the single sisters in the congregation. Do you know that he had the nerve to say that he wants to marry a light complected woman?!!! My mother said to him "Well if every man felt the way you do, then your daughter will never find a husband. What do you think of that?" He was dumbfounded of course. I just think that it is a deep rooted issue that will be hard to change on the national scale. It is sad.

[evaclear04]

You would think that we have after all we have been through we would have gotten over this...
This type of racism happens to me every single day. If I have to hear...." Your so nice to be light skinned" I just might slap someone. I remember the first time someone ever said this to me... I was baffled... what in the hayle does my complexion have to do with my attitude??? Not a Dayum Thang!
As far as greek life goes... this is still prevalent. But not in the quantity that it used to be. My chapter was comprised of nothing but darker skinned ladies...so my LS and I stood out like sore thumbs. But that didn't deter us any... nor did it matter to a Sorors. We are all in it for one common goal. And our complexion can never effect that...

[Afrochic]

Originally posted by evaclear04

This type of racism happens to me every single day. If I have to hear...." Your so nice to be light skinned" I just might slap someone. I remember the first time someone ever said this to me... I was baffled... what in the hayle does my complexion have to do with my attitude??? Not a Dayum Thang!


You know I've had the same thing happen to me over and over. You would be suprised how much I had to fight as a child because of a stupid complexion issue and because I came from a two parent household, sad but true. When I was younger, I met a girl up the street and we hit it off. One day we were in her kitchen eating and she said she never thought we would be friends and I asked her why. She told me "I just didn't think you were that cool." Years later in college I've had people to say Afrochic, you cool peoples because we thought you were one of those "stuck up red girls." I've also gotten the "you look like an AKA" comment more times than I can count.

When I was in college I would style hair in the campus salon. There was an older lady (50ish) who eventually became my regular customer. One day we were chatting about women who have been in the cosmetology industry for years. She knew a lady who had varicose veins from the constant standing for years in a salon. That woman looked at me and said, "I wouldn't want to be as light as you because if you got varicose veins, you can see them, and that would be ugly." WTF?

Another thing I can't stand is job interviews. I have a name that you wouldn't know the race until I step in the door. I don't think white people mean it, but some act as if they have never been around a black person before who can speak English and dress in business attire. Sometimes they act as if I'm the spokesperson for the entire black race. One day I went to an interview and I was at the head of the table while a good seven or eight people in the company interviewd me. One white lady told me she wish she could tan and get my color because she turns red when she tans. She also wanted to know what hair color was in my head because she liked it. And the other lady said my God look at her teeth, they are gorgeous. I felt like sideshow damn bob up in that piece on display. What in the hell did any of that have to do with the job? How long have we been in America? There are a wide array of hues in the black race. Why is this an issue?

I've also gotten the comment, "Are you mixed with something?" And I say yeah, two black parents. Many people do not realize how ignorant their comments can be. But why do I remember the sarcastic and hurtful comments from childhood until now, and I'm 28 years old? Racism outside and inside of our race is alive and well. By the looks of it, it is not going anywhere anytime soon.

[LawyerGal]

That ranks up there with "you are pretty to be big" or "you have good hair"

Huh????!!!! I am visiting family in Jamaica and it is a serious issue here as well the paper had an article about it because all of the Miss Jamaica have been very light to med. complexion and 'coolie' meaning "good hair" or a person who looks mixed. The reporting was commenting on how sad it is that the beautiful sisters who are darker are discouraged from even trying to compete! And this is an entire island of people of color!!???

:confused:

[Kimmie1913]

Originally posted by Afrochic
I've also gotten the comment, "Are you mixed with something?" And I say yeah, two black parents. Many people do not realize how ignorant their comments can be. But why do I remember the sarcastic and hurtful comments from childhood until now, and I'm 28 years old?

When I was an adolecent and going through it on this issue I was really upset over people asking me if I was mixed. My dad, (so cute) trying to make me feel better told me to tell them yes, I am mixed. East and west Baltimore. It still makes me laugh.

I have heard all the ignorant comments from "I thought you would be stuck up", "You think you are cute cause you're light," (Side note- no, i think I am cute cause I'm cute!!) From a white classmate -"I could almost forget you are Black," (DON'T! WTF!! That is supposed to be a compliment?) "if I wanted to date someone that light I would just date a white girl," "he is only dating you cause he really wants to date white girls," etc. Wake up Black people wake up!

[Steeltrap]

A good friend of mine who I worked with back in 10 A C was convinced that I was biracial because I'm fair and have fine hair (that some would consider "good," but I digress. :rolleyes: ). I simply showed pictures of my parents (mom's fair, my late dad was dark).

I understand that intraracial discrimination exists, but I just think it's a waste of energy. Let's worry about improving education and securing economic opportunities.

[sweet26]

I think it is an issue for those that are insecure about themselves. If anyone of you watched the movie "Queen", it is a great example of how this type of insecurity was embedded in most of our ancestors years ago. Queen - (Halle Berry) was allowed to stay in the house, dress nicely ect, while our darker skin generation picked cotton and lived in poor conditions. What I learned from the movie was that, even though Queen may have had an advantage back then in many ways because of her skin color; she still ended up with the same negative effect, when times got bad.

It is unfortunate that some of our ancestors passed this on that it is visibally affecting us in the 21st Century.

[miss priss]

Originally posted by exquizit
I had the same problem with the brat when she was born. What kills me is that they act as though they're giving you a compliment by commenting on how pretty their light skin is , or just how much they look like a white baby...WTF?:mad: :mad:

I also feel it's stupid of them to say........"Oh she must have gotten her color from her daddy":rolleyes:

Does it matter? I mean we're beautiful no matter what shade we're in!!!

No, it shouldn't matter ;but it still happens to me to this day. My daughter is considerably lighter than I.

Now being from the South, I have found that what Northerners (West and East included) describe as light is not the same where I am from. For instance, Jada Pinkett would be considered as brown to some but light where I am from.
Although, most people I knew didn't care what color you were as long as you were pretty. :rolleyes:

When I was younger, a guy I was dating (a jerk) once said in a conversation I overheard that he would marry a light-skinned girl and only f*** dark ones. Well I guess you know I told him where to get off!

But it used to really bother me and I would pray often that my daughter didn't experience those same prejudices.

My husband and I just had a discussion very similar to this (black men marrying white women and the reasons why--another issue another thread)--my argument was and still is that we, as an Afro-American community, have a social responsibility to enlighten, require, and demand that the face of the A-A female community is not just some chick with "slightly" dark skin with very "thin" features or some BBW with a hearty voice selling Pine-Sol. My color, or ANY woman's color should not set the standard for what's beautiful but should expose our blackness as merely existentialism.

[ShiningStar83]

I'm what some would call "light-skinned", but my roomate is dark. People are always telling her that she is cute to be dark skinned, and while she thinks nothing of it, I find it offensive. She is a very pretty girl and her skin color should not defined her beauty.

In another case, a guy I met at the movies told me that he would not have approached me if I were a shade darker. I don't know what kind of line he thought that was, but I politely left him standing there looking like the fool he is.

But on a lighter note, I have a "thing" for dark skinned guys:D

[lovele1978]

>>>I am visiting family in Jamaica and it is a serious issue here as well the paper had an article about it because all of the Miss Jamaica have been very light to med. complexion and 'coolie' meaning "good hair" or a person who looks mixed. <<<

It is so funny that you mentioned this. While I was in Negril two weeks ago they were taking pictures of one of the contestants at the resort that I was staying. I can't remember which Parish she was representing, but she did not look like what one would consider the typical Jamaican woman. If I didn't know she was Jamaican I would think that she was Hispanic. I think that it is good to show diversity and that beauty comes in many forms. But when there is only one type of beauty shown is where we go wrong a further divide ourselves.

[MsFoxyLoxy77]

I have several things to say about this issue:
When Halle Berry (and Denzel for Best Actor:D )won the Academy Awards for Best Actress I was so proud. My friend and I would not change the channel because we were afraid we would miss it (even though, we both new it would be announced at the end of the awards show). Well..the next day my girl and I were eating breakfast at our school caf. The tv in the caf was tuned to a station showing recaps of the Oscars night. Two cafeteria ladies turned as they were showing Halle accepting the award. One said, "Ain't that something a black girl winning that award." The other replied, "She ain't that black though...jus look at her skin...she would not have won if she didn't have that good skin and hair." I lost my appetite. Now we all know Halle is biracial...but her appearance is NOT uncharacteristic of an AA lady who has TWO black parents (period).

My father was what many would call red and my mother is what many would call brown. My two younger sisters have lighter complexions than my brother and I and people made constant comparisons when we were growing up. A pathetic individual who knew my family even suggested that I wasn't my father's daughter because I was the only girl who didn't have lighter skin. When the individual was told that I looked exactly like my younger brother the individual rationalized that it is okay for boys to be darker...but looking at my sisters, I couldn't possibly have the same father. :mad: Hello I was of a slightly lighter complexion than my mom but to someone like that all they see is light or dark... That was a slap in the face, my father an mother were very upright citizens, high school sweetharts, when he passed away it broke her heart....but I've swayed off topic. To say that my mom wanted to hit the individual is an understatement . ;)

[Dionysus]

Originally posted by huggy bear
I only hire light skinned sistas.

For what? :confused:

[2DISCRETE4U]

Originally posted by huggy bear
I only hire light skinned sistas.

The hayle?! Get the heck outta here wit dat... http://www.kurts-smilies.de/bye2.gif

[Jill1228]

What type of isht is that!?
http://pages.prodigy.net/indianahawkeye/signs02/1.gif

[Steeltrap]

All I can say is that Trollquan McTroll is very unfunny.:mad:

[ClassyLady]

Why do I seriously doubt that someone even has a job, let alone one in which that person would be in a management position?

[Rudey]

It's all pink on the inside.

-Rudey
--That's what my neighbor says every time he gets liquored up anyway.

[Sugar_N_Spice]

Originally posted by Afrochic
Another thing I can't stand is job interviews. I have a name that you wouldn't know the race until I step in the door. I don't think white people mean it, but some act as if they have never been around a black person before who can speak English and dress in business attire. Sometimes they act as if I'm the spokesperson for the entire black race. One day I went to an interview and I was at the head of the table while a good seven or eight people in the company interviewd me. One white lady told me she wish she could tan and get my color because she turns red when she tans. She also wanted to know what hair color was in my head because she liked it. And the other lady said my God look at her teeth, they are gorgeous. I felt like sideshow damn bob up in that piece on display. What in the hell did any of that have to do with the job? How long have we been in America? There are a wide array of hues in the black race. Why is this an issue?

I've had the same thing happen at job interviews and in instances where the person knew my name before they actually met me. It's sad and sometimes infuriating b/c they really think of things like this as a compliment :rolleyes:...Just b/c I'm Black does not mean that I can't speak correct English :confused: --I went to High School and College just like you did :mad:

As far as the "light- vs. dark-skinned" issue goes, it is a deep-rooted issue for me b/c where I live there is no such thing as "brown-skinned"--you're either light or dark. I qualify as dark, and therfore am considered second best to many men (particularly Black men in my age group, 22 yrs.), even though I get the "You are SO Beautiful/Gorgeous/You look like a model (I'm 5'10")" comments all the time from people that are either my age but I'm not interested in (friends, family, whatever), or from older people I don't know...I refuse to buy into these stereotypes that light=beautiful, b/c Black people come in all shades of the rainbow, and WE AS A PEOPLE ARE TRULLY BEAUTIFUL b/c there are no other people on this earth like us. Beauty is not one color/shade!!! But it really saddens me that people in this day and age still buy into this mentality, and that our own people are continuously perpetuating it (i.e. music videos on BET that always feature light-skinned women with long hair). People need to get real and remember that there are bigger issues out there that need our attention than this pettiness...

[Dancerella1908]

My sister and I are 4 years apart but we look alot alike. People describe us as oh she's the light one and she's the dark one. How about learn our dayum names!!! If you are able to tell those differences then you can tell us apart. That burns me up.

Alot of guys come up to my sister and say You are sooo pretty to be dark skin. She asks them was that a compliment or an insult! I really don't understand why people do this.

I have been (depending on the person) classified as light skinned or brown skin. On the cheerleading team and in certain dance companies I have performed w/ we were all the same complexion. Now no one can convience me that this was an accident. A choreographer told me he only cast members that were my complexion or lighter. My mouth just dropped open. I said shouldn't it be based on a persons skill. He didn't answer.

As a chorographer myself I have seen and heard alot. I use these experiences as learning tools to apply when I'm teaching. I remember how certain people were treated because of the color of there skin. There is no way I could do that to someone. As a child of God I am to love everyone!!

[Steeltrap]

Really long read. Not surprising, but disturbing.

Can the Shade of Your Skin Determine Career Success?
By Angela D. Johnson

© 2003 DiversityInc.com
September 08, 2003

"They says if you was white, should be all right,
If you was brown, stick around,
But as you's black, m-mm brother, git back, git back, git back"

These lyrics from a blues tune recorded in 1951 by Big Bill Broonzy reflect the impact of colorism -- bias based on the shade of one's skin -- on American society. For African Americans, this intraracial discrimination is rooted in slavery, a period when light-skinned mulatto offspring of slave owners were given the more desirable positions on the plantation.

This biased way of thinking continued after slavery with people with skin "lighter than a paper bag" or pale enough to see the blue, spidery network of veins in their wrists gaining admission to exclusive African-American organizations. Today, the overt judgments based on skin color may be gone, but the bias remains, and it's not exclusive to the African-American community.
Fair-skinned South Asian women are often considered more attractive and more likely to marry that their darker-skinned peers. Filipino women gossip about the ultimate skin tone of a newborn (The lighter, the better). The success of
deep-hued Celia Cruz was an exception in the Latino entertainment arena.

Researchers have found that colorism has an influence on myriad aspects of people's lives, including education and income levels. A study by Cedric Herring, a sociology professor at the University of Illinois Chicago, and Verna Keith, an associate sociology professor at Arizona State University in Tempe Ariz., in the early 1990s revealed that, on average, very light-skinned African
Americans attained an additional two years of education, compared with their very dark-skinned counterparts. Family income of very light-skinned African
Americans was more than 50 percent greater than the income of those with dark skin, while personal income was almost 65 percent higher.

Like racism, colorism has infiltrated the offices of corporate America. Sometimes, it manifests itself in the form for verbal harassment.

Last month, the U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) announced a settlement of a color harassment and retaliation lawsuit against Applebee's Neighborhood Bar and Grill, headquartered in Overland Park, Kan. Dwight Burch, a
dark-skinned African-American server at one of the chain's Atlanta restaurants, alleged that he was called derogatory names, such as "porch monkey," "jig-a-boo" and "blackie," :mad: :eek: by his manager, a light-skinned African American. Burch was fired
less than 90 days after the manager arrived at the restaurant.

Applebee's was found in violation of Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which protects against discrimination based on skin color as well as race, national origin, sex or religion. Burch was awarded $40,000 in the settlement.

Similar cases have been filed by Latinos.

Jennifer Kaplan, public-affairs specialist for the EEOC, said the commission has witnessed an increased interest in what she describes as appearance bias.

"It fascinates people that someone would allege bias based on color when the person accused is of the same race," said Kaplan.

The number of color discrimination cases filed with the EEOC has nearly doubled since 1995. In 2002, there were 1,382 color-bias charges, up from 700 in 1995. Kaplan said the increase is caused in part by the method the agency uses to collect discrimination data. Kaplan said a greater awareness of color discrimination is prompting data collectors to break out colorism claims from racial-discrimination charges.

The majority of filings in 2002 were in the Northeast (44 percent), followed by the West (21 percent), South (15 percent), Midwest (12.5 percent) and Southwest (7.5 percent). The EEOC was unable to provide case-outcome statistics.

Despite the increase in colorism cases, Kaplan said racial discrimination continues to account for the largest amount of the EEOC's workload, 38 percent. While colorism is sometimes included in racism charges, psychologists contend that colorism is not the same as racism.

"I have a hard time applying the label of racism because that includes a power component," said Kendrick Brown, an assistant professor of psychology at Macalester College in St. Paul, Minn. "It's related to racism, but it's not the same thing."

Work-place discrimination is not the only way colorism is playing out in corporate world. Colorism is impacting a variety of business aspects including marketing messages and casting decisions for television shows.

In India, a television commercial for skin-lightening cream was pulled because women's groups claimed the ads equated fairer skin with beauty and success. The racy telenovelas produced in Latin America rarely feature Latinos with darker skin tones.

"Light skin is associated with more power and privilege in most societies," said Midge Wilson, a professor of psychology at Chicago's Depaul University.

Wilson said that in Italy, higher status is given to fairer-skinned Northern Italians. In Western Europe, a variation of colorism exists in the form of the preference of women with blond hair and blue eyes.

"The biggest difference (with whites) is the colorism is not institutionalized," Wilson said. "You wouldn't find that blonds earn higher wages than brunettes."

Psychologists noted that colorism is not exclusive to intraracial relationships. Whites may view lighter-skinned people of other ethnic or racial groups more favorably. "Probably because most whites believe themselves intellectually superior," said Wilson, who is white, "thus, those who best approximate their features are more likely to be invited into the circle of power."

Given the universal impact of colorism, is there a place for colorism in corporate diversity training?

Brown believes there is, but cautioned that it may take "a little bit more education and preparation" than other areas of diversity training.

"When you talk about (racial-sensitivity training), you're talking about two different groups interacting around a particular issue," said Brown. "When you talk about color bias, you're talking about people in the same group. Folks feel as if they are airing dirty laundry."

"I think people become spectators when it comes to skin-tones issues," Brown added. "It becomes 'That's between them' rather than 'It's an issue that involves the whole company.'"

Discussions, such as the ones conducted during diversity training, may have a positive impact on colorism.

"The more we talk about it * we'll be more likely to be able to eliminate a color caste system in the future or, more realistically, minimize it," Wilson said.

[Sahara]

This was a really big problem for me when I was younger. The suburban area I grew up in seemed to just worship light-skinned people. The only way a dark-skinned girl was considered attractive was if she had long hair.

I remember visiting an elderly woman (my grandmother's friend) who let me & my (light-skinned) cousin sew doll clothes at her house. She always would say to my cousin "you're so pretty" or "you have such pretty hair" (long) and wouldn't say anything to me. I would go back to my grandmother's house and cry (in private). I stopped going to visit her without saying why.
I remember showing family picutures to some of my white friends. My dark-skinned and light-skinned cousins were on the same page. People would say "she is so pretty" about the light-skinned one. I would say, with attitude, that they BOTH are pretty and leave it at that.

I haven't experienced prejudice as blatant as this in my older years, but it is definately still a problem.
Recently, I have had problems with people criticizing me when I wear pink. Pink has always been my favorite color, but I didn't wear it when I was younger because I thought dark skinned people couldn't wear light colors (except the occasional white). I made a consious choice to wear lighter colors and I started with pink.
The haters claim that I'm going overboard with my AKA love, but that's crap! I don't wear pink any more than I wear blue or black! I have enough blue to wear everyday, and I never heard a single comment about it. Also, they don't say a thing when I wear green!

[WenD08]

i was watching The 5th Wheel the other night (my boyfriend's choice, not mine. the show is Jerry Springer-bad). on the show, 2 guys were picking amongst 3 girls for a date. so one guy decides he doesn't like any of the women and the other picks one of them. the "chosen" one turns them both down saying that one of them was "too dark":mad::mad::mad:
i wanted to throw my shoe at her head i was so pissed.
as a dark-skinned woman, i am very comfortable within my pretty skin;) so she didn't offend me, per se. her ignorance/superiority complex based on her lighter complexion did.
i try not to let such stupid, sad people get to me but sometimes...:rolleyes:

[Sistermadly]

Originally posted by Sahara
Recently, I have had problems with people criticizing me when I wear pink. Pink has always been my favorite color, but I didn't wear it when I was younger because I thought dark skinned people couldn't wear light colors (except the occasional white).

Am I the only one who thinks that all of us look good in pink, regardless of our skin tone? I wear pink every chance I get because it gives my skin a rosy glow that's so hard to get when you live in a gray climate.

[lovelyivy84]

How odd!

I have always thought that darker tones could be set off beautifully with light colors (white, ice blue, light pink, mint green, etc.).

It all depends on the undertones of your skin- not all dark skinned people are dark the same way. For m white always shows up nicely against my skin, as does light blue and green. Lighter shades of pink vary.

Anyway, this thread just about breaks my heart. I have never been addressed this way by anyone in or out of my family. And the worst thing is that we do it to ourselves. So ignorant.

[abaici]

It's amazing to me how this self-hate perpetuates. I would often have to school my students when they stated, "So and so has good hair" or "That boy is black"

I grew up and live in Cali, and the color thing is HORRIBLE here. I have soooo many stories from my childhood it's crazy. It was never my family, it was always "others"

[iceandivy]

I feel the person who said that some people think that to be pretty and dark, you HAVE to have long hair. I happen to have long hair, and be dark. In college, I was the dark skinned cheerleader with the long hair. I kept it so long that when I danced, it got caught under my arms all the time. I also know that the only reason that some people gave (and give) me the time of day is because of my hair. I think that is one of the reasons I kept it long. Recently, I have cut it shorter and shorter... just to see. It is at my shoulders now. Funny thing is... white guys who have noticed me... nothing changed. Black guys who noticed... dropped a bit. Now when it gets up to my ears, we'll see what happens!

Oh, and my mom always told me that darker women look best in pastels... I agree.

Also, my cousin and I are both chocolate, and we are usually approached by lighter skinned men (some damn near white). Does anyone know why this is? Fellas... talk to me!

Eva
www.movetodcmetro.com

[Jill1228]

I love wearing bright colors and if I had a dollar for everytime someone gave me grief for wearing bright colors (my family), I would retire. And I did NOT have long hair so that was a strike against me! Didn't want to do a weave either. Fellas would trample me to talk to my older sister. :rolleyes:

[markmywords]

Originally posted by ShiningStar83


But on a lighter note, I have a "thing" for dark skinned guys:D

I don't understand this mentality either. This smacks of the same nonsense just in reverse. Just b/c darker skinned people have been marginalized it doesn't make any sense to turn around and marginalize lighter skinned folks. I get in this argument all of the time when people say "oh it's just my preference." What's wrong w/ just plain prefering someone who is Black?

[Honeykiss1974]

Originally posted by markmywords
I don't understand this mentality either. This smacks of the same nonsense just in reverse. Just b/c darker skinned people have been marginalized it doesn't make any sense to turn around and marginalize lighter skinned folks. I get in this argument all of the time when people say "oh it's just my preference." What's wrong w/ just plain prefering someone who is Black?

Seriously, how is this (what ShiningStar said about prefering darker-skinned brothas ) any different from a person that prefers a black women......

with long hair
with short hair
with natural hair
with straightened hair
weigh less than 130 lbs.
weigh more than 130 lbs.
with pretty eyes
with no kids
etc.

Where does a person "cross the line" so to speak from simply having a preference to marginalizing lighter or darker skinned folks? If I prefer to NOT date a brotha that wears locks, am in some way marginalizing that aspect of black culture as well?

[Dionysus]

Originally posted by Honeykiss1974
Seriously, how is this (what ShiningStar said about prefering darker-skinned brothas ) any different from a person that prefers a black women......

with long hair
with short hair
with natural hair
with straightened hair
weigh less than 130 lbs.
weigh more than 130 lbs.
with pretty eyes
with no kids
etc.

Where does a person "cross the line" so to speak from simply having a preference to marginalizing lighter or darker skinned folks? If I prefer to NOT date a brotha that wears locks, am in some way marginalizing that aspect of black culture as well?

I'm not really sure where one crosses the line and see all sides to this, but I think it is unfortunate that we cannot have a preference like everyone else, without being accused of having self-hatred.

[Sistermadly]

For me the difference between expressing a preference and prejudice is this:

If you express a preference for something, you are saying that you would choose someone with that characteristic above all others - but that you would not exclude anyone who didn't fit that criteria.

If you're demonstrating prejudice, you're basically saying that you only want that one thing and nothing else.

[Bamboozled]

Originally posted by markmywords
I don't understand this mentality either. This smacks of the same nonsense just in reverse. Just b/c darker skinned people have been marginalized it doesn't make any sense to turn around and marginalize lighter skinned folks. I get in this argument all of the time when people say "oh it's just my preference." What's wrong w/ just plain prefering someone who is Black?

I totally agree with you on this. I was just having this conversation with one of my girlfriends the other day. She is dark skinned and often talks about ignorant comments that others make or how some men will straight up tell her they would date her if she was lighter. I understand the pain behind that and I think it's awful. However, five minutes later we were talking about a guy I was dating who happens to be light skinned and she commented that she and I have such different tastes because she is NEVER attracted to lighter men. Huh? :confused: How is that any different than what men have said to her? I never understood why it's PC for women to say they only date light/dark skinned men, but when a man admits that he has a preference, whether it be light or dark, he's color struck. Now, I'm not saying that it's right for either to say it. I just don't get the whole color preference thing. Maybe I don't get it because I love brothas whether light or dark, dreaded or bald, tall or taller ;), etc... *sigh* I guess I just love men.

[Conskeeted7]

I've noticed that it usually makes a difference what color you are when you make these kind of comments. For me, a honey colored sista, to say that I don't date dark skin men would be out of line. But if I said that I didn't want to date light skin men, people would not be offended.

I think it's ridiculous that we exclude color as something that we are allowed to have a preference about. We can say loud and clear that we don't date short men, or fat girls, or people with bad skin, or girls who wear weaves, but color we aren't supposed to care about. It's just ridiculous to me.

[sphinxpoet]

Being darkskinned I do not a have a problem with the shade of people. However I do like women with certain traits physically. A preference does not make you ignorant. However if that is the sole basis that you choose as an indvidual then that is stupid beyond belief. To judge one ability to be a compatible partner based on skin tone is ignorant! There are many beautiful sistas and brothers out there regardless of their skin tone.

[markmywords]

My issue is this. What are sometimes seemed as preferences often become prejudices. Why is it that I've heard several little black children say things like "i don't like him he's too black" or "i'll only date light skinned women." That is no longer a preference that is a prejudice often learned in the home. What does that tell the members of the group that aren't so called preferred?

Instead of preferring a skin tone, why not prefer someone who has a relationship with God, who is independent, who knows how to care for a mate, someone who possesses a thirst for knowledge. Why not ask for these things and let God provide a mate suitable for you. If God brings you a mate I'm sure it will be someone you "prefer".

[Conskeeted7]

Originally posted by markmywords
My issue is this. What are sometimes seemed as preferences often become prejudices. Why is it that I've heard several little black children say things like "i don't like him he's too black" or "i'll only date light skinned women." That is no longer a preference that is a prejudice often learned in the home. What does that tell the members of the group that aren't so called preferred?

Instead of preferring a skin tone, why not prefer someone who has a relationship with God, who is independent, who knows how to care for a mate, someone who possesses a thirst for knowledge. Why not ask for these things and let God provide a mate suitable for you. If God brings you a mate I'm sure it will be someone you "prefer".

I agree that there are intellectual qualities and moral convictions that should be considered in choosing a mate. However, it is unrealistic to expect everyone to look solely at those qualities. To sustain a relationship, there has to be attraction on all levels, physical included. So, why is it so wrong to admit that you prefer a certain look? Sure, I wanted someone who could treat me well and loved the Lord more than me. But I also would have had trouble waking up to someone who I found repulsive physically. I'm sorry if that sounds wrong, but I don't think it is. It is my preference for my mate.

Now, if I took that preference and turned it into my hiring practices or the people I choose to live near, it becomes a prejudice, not simply because I chose a mate that I was attracted to.

[mccoyred]

I think the problem stems from people who turn away from/discount/insult someone JUST BECAUSE they don't fit a personal 'preference'.

I am chocolate but all of my serious relationships, even my marriage, have been with light-skinned men. Not necessarily my preference, it just worked out that way. Now I have had relationships with brown- and dark-skinned men but for whatever reason, they did not develop into long-term or serious relationships. Hence the reason why my mother thinks that I prefer light-skinned men; nothing wrong with that, but it is just erroneous.

Originally posted by Conskeeted7
I agree that there are intellectual qualities and moral convictions that should be considered in choosing a mate. However, it is unrealistic to expect everyone to look solely at those qualities. To sustain a relationship, there has to be attraction on all levels, physical included. So, why is it so wrong to admit that you prefer a certain look? Sure, I wanted someone who could treat me well and loved the Lord more than me. But I also would have had trouble waking up to someone who I found repulsive physically. I'm sorry if that sounds wrong, but I don't think it is. It is my preference for my mate.

Now, if I took that preference and turned it into my hiring practices or the people I choose to live near, it becomes a prejudice, not simply because I chose a mate that I was attracted to.

[Eclipse]

If someone had asked me my preference before I got married I would have said darker skinned men. Most, if not all, of the men I dated were medium brown and darker, save my 8th grade crush that I went to the Fair with and when we went on the Tilt a whirl...wait, I'm digressing! ;)

Anyway...I met my now husband in college and fell in love with his mind. I freaked out one day when I compared his leg to mine and realized how light he was. I was like "but I don't date light skinned men!" :eek: :eek: Stupid, I know.....

I know of situations where people fell in love with folks they did not initally think were attractive (not just because of skin color). You will be suprised what you find endearing after you fall in love....

[Choo-ChooAKA]

I always dated men over 6'2". I actually sought them out (color was never a factor as long as they were Af Am). About 6 mos after I met my husband I realized that he is only a couple of inches taller than I (I'm 5'6") and that he's actually quite handsome. :D

It's funny how when I fell, I fell hard. His looks were just sooo far from my heart that they didn't even register for the longest time. And before that, looks were so very important! Go figure. :rolleyes:

[sphinxpoet]

As we grow our choices in mates change. What our prefernce is now may change over time. There is nothing wrong with having physical standards. Some women like men who work out and vice a versa. Does that mean they hate people who do not work out? No it just is what they like. I like all shades of sisters but because I do not date white women does that make me a racist?

[Conskeeted7]

Originally posted by sphinxpoet
As we grow our choices in mates change. What our prefernce is now may change over time. There is nothing wrong with having physical standards. Some women like men who work out and vice a versa. Does that mean they hate people who do not work out? No it just is what they like. I like all shades of sisters but because I do not date white women does that make me a racist?

Perfectly stated...

[MsFoxyLoxy77]

No Surprise - Skin Tone Study Reveals Preference for Light-Skinned Employees
Date: Sunday, September 24, 2006
By: Michael H. Cottman

A controversial study on skin tone has revealed what many black folks have been whispering about for years: Light-skinned blacks are often more likely to be considered for jobs over dark-skinned blacks.

The University of Georgia’s unprecedented study indicates that dark-skinned blacks face a distinct disadvantage when applying for jobs, even if they have resumes superior to lighter-skinned black applicants.

Matthew Harrison, a doctoral student at the University of Georgia, recently presented his research at the 66th annual meeting of the Academy of Management in Atlanta.

"Our results indicate that there appears to be a skin tone preference in regards to job selection," Harrison said in a statement. "This finding is possibly due to the common belief that fair-skinned blacks probably have more similarities with whites than do dark-skinned blacks, which in turn makes whites feel more comfortable around them."

"I think what was most shocking to me was to find that dark-skinned black males with greater credentials were still recommended less -- or seen as less of a candidate -- than light-skinned blacks with worse credentials," Harrison told BlackAmericaWeb.com in an interview last week.

"I think it has a lot to do with the general comfort level that people have with dark-skinned blacks and light-skinned blacks," Harrison said. "The media depicts dark-skinned black men as violent and threatening."

Harrison said he was reminded of the controversial Time magazine cover that featured O.J. Simpson during his murder trial when the magazine darkened Simpson’s image to make him appear more menacing.

"The findings in this study are, tragically, not too surprising," Harrison said.

"We found that a light-skinned black male can have only a bachelor’s degree and typical work experience and still be preferred over a dark-skinned black male with an MBA and past managerial positions, simply because expectations of the light-skinned black male are much higher, and he doesn’t appear as ‘menacing’ as the darker-skinned male applicant," he said.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Choo-ChooAKA]

And the preference is more pronounced as job candidates' melanin and hair curliness decreases: Hispanic over Black (light or dark), Asian over Hispanic (light or dark), White over Asian, etc. Once you get to white vs. white, then higher credentials and work experience actually begin to count. Light/dark, black candidates are still at the bottom of the hiring pool--this is the issue that should be addressed. Creating division simply serves to undermine the progress that solidarity will (hopefully) bring.

[pretty edAKAted]

My niece is 5 and has very fair skin. when she was around 3 picked her up from school she loves to tell me what happened and i listen and conversate with her about everything that went on that day. well this day, she pointed out that she is "YELLA" and her baby doll is now "BLACK" and she may want a "YELLA" doll like herself ! :eek:

I asked her who told her that she was yella and she says that her teacher told her that. (Surpised as heck!) So i told my sister and she and her husband had to talk to her.

[pinkies up]

My students don't know what color I am. They always ask me if I'm black or white and I ask them if they would behave differently if I told them. To this day, none of them really know and I started thinking if they treated white teachers with more respect (without having to be threatened) than they do black teachers.

[BellaSF]

Hello,
I'm new to GC and i felt compelled to reply to your thread. I am brown-skinned and my older sister is dark-skinned. She experienced the same thing on more than one occassion. :( People today still allow the color of skin to influence them. :mad: I've had friends that hate themselves because they were dark, friends that believed they were better because they were light and other ridiculous mumbo jumbo. :confused: Fortunately, I have always been around all types of people of different shades so I'm accepting. Even I as a brown-skinned woman have been put down. Yes, discrimination,ignorance, racism,etc. still exists.

[KAY10]

You ladies should read this book called "Color Complex". It's really interesting. It talks about fraternities and sororities too. I guess back in the day XYZ frat and XYZ sorority would only pick lighter toned men and women. Check the book out if you've never heard of it. It's really deep. I think it's unfortunate that these kinds of things still go on. I don't think it's really that bad with black men, but with the women it's really bad.

A lot of people think I'm half black half white. I've had people think I'm Indian too. My parents are black.

I usually see women more attracted to darker men, but I usually see men more attracted to lighter women. Me? I like em' all. :p

[cjoanell]

Is this an issue? I was in the mall a few days ago and a nice looking brother in his late 30's maybe early forties approached me. (Very nice looking Sorors) Any whooo, we were in engaged in a little small talk and all of a sudden I lost my hearing,,,,,yes I went absolutely deaf. I just could not hear pass the words that left the lips of this fine, well built 6"5 about 210 "dark-skinned" brothers full lips (beautiful white teeth). The words Sorors & SF's were......."You are so pretty to be sooo dark." I still cannot believe that. Is it written some where that dark-skin sisters are biologically challenged, where beauty is concerned? Is it an unwritten law/belief that beauty is only among the white/prit near white?

Surely this is not still an issue!

Deja

------------------
TO WHOM MUCH IS GIVEN....MUCH IS EXPECTED.

I've heard all my life and still do. My father was dark skin and I took his side although my mother is closer to light skin. Being that both of my parents are from the south, I have gotten used to it. It's sad that I have learned to get use to it. I think that society has beaten this into our heads along with the average size of a woman is a 4, when in reality now it is a 10, along with straight hair v. natural hair. Then they wonder why our children are so confused and vain.

[cjoanell]

You ladies should read this book called "Color Complex". It's really interesting. It talks about fraternities and sororities too. I guess back in the day XYZ frat and XYZ sorority would only pick lighter toned men and women. Check the book out if you've never heard of it. It's really deep. I think it's unfortunate that these kinds of things still go on. I don't think it's really that bad with black men, but with the women it's really bad.

A lot of people think I'm half black half white. I've had people think I'm Indian too. My parents are black.

I usually see women more attracted to darker men, but I usually see men more attracted to lighter women. Me? I like em' all. :p
The sad part is when outside people look at you, they still fall into those stereotypes..... oh you're light, I take it you're a member of XYZ or you're a member of XYZ, you were the darkest on your line huh? CRAZY....

[KAY10]

The sad part is when outside people look at you, they still fall into those stereotypes..... oh you're light, I take it you're a member of XYZ or you're a member of XYZ, you were the darkest on your line huh? CRAZY....

I feel ya. It is sad. Both my parents are from the south too. My father is dark and my mom is light.
Have you ever heard of the Willie Lynch theory? Before the Civil War Willie Lynch wrote a letter and it was basically a letter to keep blacks separate. That part of the whole light/dark thing. It's in that book I was talking about.

[Munchkin03]

I asked her who told her that she was yella and she says that her teacher told her that. (Surpised as heck!) So i told my sister and she and her husband had to talk to her.

This just makes me :mad: ...

I can't say that I've been negatively or positively affected by my skin tone. I'm pretty fair, and I get a lot of compliments on my eyes. A few people ask me what I am or where my parents are from; when I studied abroad in Italy, some of the Africans thought I was from Morocco or Egypt.

I don't think having a "preference" in skin tone is wrong as far as dating goes. I wouldn't date a morbidly obese man, so why should I hate on someone for not wanting to date a light-skinned woman?

[cjoanell]

I feel ya. It is sad. Both my parents are from the south too. My father is dark and my mom is light.
Have you ever heard of the Willie Lynch theory? Before the Civil War Willie Lynch wrote a letter and it was basically a letter to keep blacks separate. That part of the whole light/dark thing. It's in that book I was talking about.

Mom B'ham and Dad Orangeburg, S.C..... I know all about it.:mad:

[PrettyBoy]

I don't really think African American fraternities and sororities are still like this, but I know years ago XYZ sorority had a test called the brown paper bag test. If an interest was darker than the brown paper bag she would not have a chance of getting selected. That made me wonder if greek organizations made this problem worse. I don't think it's like that now, at least I would hope not.

[nonchalant]

I believe this is still an issue. Most of this stems from peoples upbringing as well as their surroundings. As stated in a previous thread, I was raised to think light is right. There isn't a need to put a paper bag next to me, for my mother didn't allow us to play in the daylight. Once you grow and become educated and open-minded, you realize those things were petty. I still love my light skinned pretty boys over the chocolate men. Now that's just a personal preference.

[southernelle25]

My students don't know what color I am. They always ask me if I'm black or white and I ask them if they would behave differently if I told them. To this day, none of them really know and I started thinking if they treated white teachers with more respect (without having to be threatened) than they do black teachers.

Ha, ok Professor Grayson! :p Your story reminds me of an episode of The Cosby Show when, during a discussion of the diverse ethnic backgrounds of the Egyptians, Theo's teacher encourages the students to guess her own heritage.

[cjoanell]

I believe this is still an issue. Most of this stems from peoples upbringing as well as their surroundings. As stated in a previous thread, I was raised to think light is right. There isn't a need to put a paper bag next to me, for my mother didn't allow us to play in the daylight. Once you grow and become educated and open-minded, you realize those things were petty. I still love my light skinned pretty boys over the chocolate men. Now that's just a personal preference.:eek:

[pinkies up]

Ha, ok Professor Grayson! :p Your story reminds me of an episode of The Cosby Show when, during a discussion of the diverse ethnic backgrounds of the Egyptians, Theo's teacher encourages the students to guess her own heritage.

It's a trip because I finally told them my background (mom is white, dad is black) and they were like *blank stare* Then they asked me what I consider myself to be. I told them that I am black. I grew up with the black culture and understandings and this is who I am.

[DSTCHAOS]

What is interesting about this topic is that it is still a "big deal" to many people, which is why it is still a topic to be discussed. However, discussing it keeps the topic a "big deal" to many people as opposed to the assumption that discussing something combats ignorance and changes people's thoughts and actions.

I have found that instead of thinking and talking about this "color complex" I just make it a point to correct (usually, black) people when I see or hear them displaying colorisms or hair texturisms. For instance, if I hear some ignorant soul say "good hair" or say "I need to stay out of the sun because I'm black enough as is," I go on (what my friend calls) my Angela Davis speech. I say "no such thing as 'good hair' unless you're talking about healthy hair" and "no such thing as being 'black enough' but you need to stay out of the sun to protect yourself from UV rays and skin cancer, not getting darker. Interestingly enough, your beautiful dark skin protects you from the sun's rays and skin cancer more than lighter or white skin does." I remember when a classmate told me when I was little that I needed to stay out of the sun to make sure that I stayed pretty and lightskinned--my family doesn't talk crazy like that so I was really shocked when I was told that by an outsider. No, I don't need to stay out of the sun to avoid getting shades darker but I do need to stay out of the sun because I have less melanin to protect my skin.

Either case, people have generally learned not to make certain comments around me. I could be changing the world if I force everyone to interact with me on a daily basis. Then I'll be their #1 source of socialization. :D

[pinkies up]

Actually I stay out of the sun because it's too dayum hot in Mississippi to be hangin' outside

[cjoanell]

Actually I stay out of the sun because it's too dayum hot in Mississippi to be hangin' outside

LMAO, you know all you need to do is go up the block where it's raining.


MY s/o was like black people don't tan on purpose... I'm like you're crazy, that's my whole purpose of going to Miami every year. He just looks at me :rolleyes: :confused: because I'm darkskin. I've learn to embrace my complexion. I'm the same complexion as my daddy, God rest his soul... and I am a ok with it. But if I hear, "pretty black baby one more time".. ya'll gonna see me on the news. Just remember I was a good person ok.

[thesweetestone]

Actually I stay out of the sun because it's too dayum hot in Mississippi to be hangin' outside


I know that's true. It's October, why is it still hot as hell?:(

[pinkies up]

^^^LOL!! I almost passed out today. It was that muggy hot. The kind that makes you want to take about 5 showers!!!

[PositivelyAKA]

I have found that instead of thinking and talking about this "color complex" I just make it a point to correct (usually, black) people when I see or hear them displaying colorisms or hair texturisms. For instance, if I hear some ignorant soul say "good hair" or say "I need to stay out of the sun because I'm black enough as is," I go on (what my friend calls) my Angela Davis speech. I say "no such thing as 'good hair' unless you're talking about healthy hair" and "no such thing as being 'black enough' but you need to stay out of the sun to protect yourself from UV rays and skin cancer, not getting darker. Either case, people have generally learned not to make certain comments around me. I could be changing the world if I force everyone to interact with me on a daily basis. Then I'll be their #1 source of socialization. :D

You make a great point, really it is a deep seated problem in our community and we have to combat the issue in our own immediate circles in order to make a difference. And realize that some people will always remain ignorant.

[PrettyBoy]

I believe this is still an issue. Most of this stems from peoples upbringing as well as their surroundings. As stated in a previous thread, I was raised to think light is right. There isn't a need to put a paper bag next to me, for my mother didn't allow us to play in the daylight. Once you grow and become educated and open-minded, you realize those things were petty. I still love my light skinned pretty boys over the chocolate men. Now that's just a personal preference.

Was your mom from the South? It seems like that's where a lot of this stuff is still happening.

[PrettyBoy]

:eek:
LOL

[PrettyBoy]

Actually I stay out of the sun because it's too dayum hot in Mississippi to be hangin' outside
I love the sun. It feels good.:p

[DSTCHAOS]

Was your mom from the South? It seems like that's where a lot of this stuff is still happening.

Looks are very deceiving.

[aopirose]

Just remember I was a good person ok.

This just cracked me up.

[cjoanell]

This just cracked me up.


LOL, I'm going to need people to testify on my behalf.

[white rapper]

I only date skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs .

[MsFoxyLoxy77]

I only date skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs .

:confused: and your point is?

[lovelyivy84]

Don't Feed the Troll.http://z.about.com/d/collectdolls/1/0/l/G/troll.jpg

[PrettyBoy]

Looks are very deceiving.

So, so true.

[PrettyBoy]

I only date skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs .
LMAO:p

[PrettyBoy]

:confused: and your point is?
LOL

[cjoanell]

Don't Feed the Troll.http://z.about.com/d/collectdolls/1/0/l/G/troll.jpg
Corner ----->

[white rapper]

:confused: and your point is?

My point is that I like skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs. Have you ever had a skinny light skinned sistas or asian chicks with big booobs? If you did you would know what I was talking bout. Its better than Disneyland. Just strap yurself in and hold on tight.

[pinkies up]

My point is that I like skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs. Have you ever had a skinny light skinned sistas or asian chicks with big booobs? If you did you would know what I was talking bout. Its better than Disneyland. Just strap yurself in and hold on tight.

Please step away from the crack pipe.:cool:

[Jill1228]

Thank you! You are da bomb girl!

I was one who was relentlessly teased because of my darker skin tone. Summer is my favorite season and living near the ocean most of my young life, I spent mucho time out in the sun...and I got darker...and I did not give a rip! :D

It kills me to hear the "she is really black, but she is pretty". yes I heard this from my 88 year old grandmother. It works my nerve to hear folx say stuff like that. I love you Nana, but dang...


But i echo someone who said to read the book "The Color Complex" Wonderful read


I have found that instead of thinking and talking about this "color complex" I just make it a point to correct (usually, black) people when I see or hear them displaying colorisms or hair texturisms. For instance, if I hear some ignorant soul say "good hair" or say "I need to stay out of the sun because I'm black enough as is," I go on (what my friend calls) my Angela Davis speech. I say "no such thing as 'good hair' unless you're talking about healthy hair" and "no such thing as being 'black enough' but you need to stay out of the sun to protect yourself from UV rays and skin cancer, not getting darker.
Either case, people have generally learned not to make certain comments around me. I could be changing the world if I force everyone to interact with me on a daily basis. Then I'll be their #1 source of socialization. :D

[PrettyBoy]

My point is that I like skinny light skinned sistas and asian chicks with big booobs. Have you ever had a skinny light skinned sistas or asian chicks with big booobs? If you did you would know what I was talking bout. Its better than Disneyland. Just strap yurself in and hold on tight.
LOL

[PrettyBoy]

Please step away from the crack pipe.:cool:
LMAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAO

[Lady of Pearl]

Unfortunately some people are still colorstruck. Beauty lies in the eye of the beholder. Alas, some still ascribe to the eurocentric concept of beauty-light skin, thin, with long hair. It is up to the individual to be secure in themselves and not use the typical standard of beauty to measure themselves up against.
It is only when an individual accepts and love themselves for who they are contrary to what society dictates will they be secure in themselves.

[nonchalant]

Was your mom from the South? It seems like that's where a lot of this stuff is still happening.

Yes. She was born and raised in Alabama.

[black_princess]

Just to weigh in. . .I have a friend who is my age (22) and from the Northeast. She says that her mother told her from a young age that she should not bring home any dark-skined men, especially if they are (in her words) "blue -black" . She told my friend that she won't be able to see her kids if she does. Mind you, my friend, her mother and my friends father are not fair skinned. So I just find the whole situation funny and sad at the same time.

Today, my friend says that she just seems to be drawn to lighter side, but in her mind doesn't have a preference. She just happens not to meet any darker men. Also, whenerver she is describing a handsome man you can definately hear the passion in her voice when its a light skinned man as compared to a darker man. I'm not saying that anything's wrong if she has this preference, I just wonder how different would her choices be if mom hadn't planted those early seeds.

[PrettyBoy]

Just to weigh in. . .I have a friend who is my age (22) and from the Northeast. She says that her mother told her from a young age that she should not bring home any dark-skined men, especially if they are (in her words) "blue -black" . She told my friend that she won't be able to see her kids if she does. Mind you, my friend, her mother and my friends father are not fair skinned. So I just find the whole situation funny and sad at the same time.

Today, my friend says that she just seems to be drawn to lighter side, but in her mind doesn't have a preference. She just happens not to meet any darker men. Also, whenerver she is describing a handsome man you can definately hear the passion in her voice when its a light skinned man as compared to a darker man. I'm not saying that anything's wrong if she has this preference, I just wonder how different would her choices be if mom hadn't planted those early seeds.
That's krazy. I've always heard that most women, black or white are more attracted to men with a darker complexion than men with a lighter complexion. Correction. I see it more often. I see a lot of men with a lighter complexion with darker women, and vise versa.

[hellocutie]

I see a lot of men with a lighter complexion with darker women, and vise versa.

I see that a lot too. My boyfriend is has a lighter complexion and I have a darker complexion, and it's funny because he told me that he has always been attracted to browner women. His father, who is as fair as they come, also has a darker skinned wife. He may have gotten his preference from his father in an indirect way.

[pinkies up]

That's funny. My brother and I both have light complexions and we are both attracted to people with darker skin tones. I've dated guys with light skin, but for some reason I was always afraid if we had kids they'd be see thru. (just kidding) I was always attracted to guys darker than me.

[GIJANE]

I am glad to see this topic addressed in this forum. As a brown complexioned woman, neither light nor dark, I feel sort of out of place sometimes in dark or light discussions.
I go to a bar in Columbus, OH frequented by whites and I am typically the only black person there. I used to get stared at, but now they see me as a regular. I haven't heard many conversations centered around the tone of my skin. They typically comment on my attractiveness in general, but never on the fact that I am black.
I used to also believe that AKAs were light and Delta's were darker skinned, until I did my research and saw pictures of each set of founders and saw the truth. I believe that the paper bag tests and so forth were ridiculous due to the fact that both sororities had founders of different complexions.
I wish the world would realize that your skin tone does not determine your intelligence or level of beauty.
In regard to color preference in dating, I was always equal opportunity and dated who approached me. I am not sure if I care about how light the man is or not, as long as he treats me right.
BTW, I have dated white men too.

[PrettyBoy]

That's funny. My brother and I both have light complexions and we are both attracted to people with darker skin tones. I've dated guys with light skin, but for some reason I was always afraid if we had kids they'd be see thru. (just kidding) I was always attracted to guys darker than me.
My mom said she chose my dad who's darker so her kids wouldn't be bleached out. There are 3 of us and we are 3 different shades. LOL. I guess she chose the right guy. For me, it doesn't matter what color. Light or dark, as long as I'm attracted to her inside and out.

[southernelle25]

My mom said she chose my dad who's darker so her kids wouldn't be bleached out. There are 3 of us and we are 3 different shades. LOL. I guess she chose the right guy. For me, it doesn't matter what color. Light or dark, as long as I'm attracted to her inside and out.

I wonder how common this is, that people on both ends of the spectrum purposefully gravitate toward the opposite end so as to produce children in the middle. :confused:

[jubilance1922]

I wonder how common this is, that people on both ends of the spectrum purposefully gravitate toward the opposite end so as to produce children in the middle. :confused:

I know my parents did...my mom is very light and my father is very dark...All of us kids get darker as you go from oldest to youngest.

My father grew up during the Civil Rights era and "Black is beautiful" so I don't feel that I have a color complex. I love my brown-skinned self, and I love all the shades that we come in. I don't gravitate towards strictly light-skinned or dark-skinned men.

[DSTCHAOS]

I wonder how common this is, that people on both ends of the spectrum purposefully gravitate toward the opposite end so as to produce children in the middle. :confused:

If people choose their mates based on that logic then they are idiots.

I remember this brown skin dude I knew who had finely textured hair and light eyes. Someone walked up to him, rubbed his hair and said "you're good for breeding." :rolleyes:

[black_princess]

If people choose their mates based on that logic then they are idiots.

I remember this brown skin dude I knew who had finely textured hair and light eyes. Someone walked up to him, rubbed his hair and said "you're good for breeding." :rolleyes:

:eek: what did he say . .. was he totally offended or did he think that was a complement?

[DSTCHAOS]

:eek: what did he say . .. was he totally offended or did he think that was a complement?


He thought it was a compliment, which is what a lot of unfortunate black people think. :rolleyes:

[black_princess]

He thought it was a compliment, which is what a lot of unfortunate black people think. :rolleyes:

Wow . . that's why I asked . . I could see how some people might take that as a compliment and get their heads all gassed up . .that's sad. Breeding of all things . . . like he was some type of animal or something :(

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D

[mccoyred]

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D

I recently read that book myself. The ending was....interesting!

However, if I had to choose, I would be DARKER than my already chocolate self. I think blue black folks have beautiful skin color, especially when they have an even tone. Unfortunately, sometimes you get bright pink gums, very pink outer lips and rheumy yellow eyes on some very dark folks that make them look strange. However, I have seen many very pretty (by skin tone) black folks, my cousin being one.

[Kimmie1913]

Wow . . that's why I asked . . I could see how some people might take that as a compliment and get their heads all gassed up . .that's sad. Breeding of all things . . . like he was some type of animal or something :(

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D

Being extremely fair, I always wanted to be darker as a child. In fact, the darker, the better. Now I have matured enough to accept me for me and am comfortable in this beautiful pale skin of mine. Yeah, it still pisses me off when people think I am white, or Latina or mixed or whatever, but as long as it is healthy, clear, even and smooth I can't complain.

[southernelle25]

Wow . . that's why I asked . . I could see how some people might take that as a compliment and get their heads all gassed up . .that's sad. Breeding of all things . . . like he was some type of animal or something :(

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D

Sounds interesting. I always felt blessed to be medium toned. "I am the bag", I say. lol I would not want to be much lighter or much darker, so to answer your question: no. However, I would not mind being a brighter tan color or a darker bronze... basically, a slight variation of my own skin tone in either direction.

[pinkies up]

I posted somewhere (I can't find it) about how I used to want to be darker because I always thought that darker girls were prettier. I also wanted a jehri curl too. The bottom line was that I wanted to fit in somewhere. My mom is white and my dad is black and I was just somewhere in the middle. Now that I'm older, I am happy with who I am. I love my color, (except when MAC has those fierce darker skinned models who can wear the hayle out of the make-up I can only dream about) and I wouldn't change it.

[southernelle25]

Anyone who does not believe black is beautiful should consider a trip to Africa (or the nearest African community ;) ).

[_Opi_]

Anyone who does not believe black is beautiful should consider a trip to Africa (or the nearest African community ;) ).

Africans have as much colour variations as African Americans. How would a trip to Africa be any different than, say..a trip to a populous African-American community?

[southernelle25]

Africans have as much colour variations as African Americans. How would a trip to Africa be any different than, say..a trip to a populous African-American community?

Africans have much greater diversity and far more darker skinned varieties of people.

[DSTCHAOS]

Wow . . that's why I asked . . I could see how some people might take that as a compliment and get their heads all gassed up . .that's sad. Breeding of all things . . . like he was some type of animal or something :(

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D


No, although I do enjoy my summer tans that make me a light golden, which matches my hair color and my eyes. :)

When I was young, I sometimes wanted to be a little darker. While a lot of people hold lighter skin on a pedastol, and that's annoying to me, the reverse is also true sometimes. A lot of people would make assumptions of me, such as I was a light skinned stuck up beyotch with long hair (that's more true now than it was when I was a child :p ), that I wasn't black enough, and I even had someone tell me God didn't keep me in the oven long enough. It would sometimes hurt my feelings but I tried to remember that this "reverse" is far less common than what black people with darker complexions and more dominant features have been going through for years. I also had to remind black folk who prejudged me that lighter skin may make many white folks more comfortable but it didn't keep some blacks from getting hosed down or attacked by dogs during the Civil Rights Movement--not to mention how Huey P. Newton was one of the "blackest" yellow bruthas I've ever known. :p

[DSTCHAOS]

Africans have as much colour variations as African Americans. How would a trip to Africa be any different than, say..a trip to a populous African-American community?

That's true and that depends on what part of Africa people visit.

Africans, outside of Northern Africa and some other parts where the people are of lighter shades, are assumed to be a less mixed group of people than are African Americans.

[DSTCHAOS]

Africans have much greater diversity and far more darker skinned varieties of people.

Since when? You've never seen beautifully blue-black black folks walking around? I have and not all of them are from overseas.

Are you talking about a larger concentration of extremely darkskinned people in one African nation or culture?

[southernelle25]

Since when? You've never seen beautifully blue-black black folks walking around? I have and not all of them are from overseas.

Are you talking about a larger concentration of extremely darkskinned people in one African nation or culture?

Of course I have, but those who believe they have not seen a beautiful black person where they are should broaden their horizon. What better place to consider than Africa? It is well documented that African populations are the most diverse in the world, and African Americans are but a tiny percentage of their diaspora. There are countless opportunities to find black beauty there, if one can not seem to find it at home.

[DSTCHAOS]

Of course I have, but those who believe they have not seen a beautiful black person where they are should broaden their horizon. What better place to consider than Africa? It is well documented that African populations are the most diverse in the world, and African Americans are but a tiny percentage of their diaspora. There are countless opportunities to find black beauty there, if one can not seem to find it at home.

:confused:

There's nothing saying these people have to think black people of any color or characteristic are beautiful. It's not a requirement, just like thinking Halle Berry is beautiful isn't a requirement. Going to Africa could make these people look around and say "oh great!! A continent full of ugly people!!" That's their perogative.

[southernelle25]

Lol, good point.

[_Opi_]

That's true and that depends on what part of Africa people visit.

Africans, outside of Northern Africa and some other parts where the people are of lighter shades, are assumed to be a less mixed group of people than are African Americans.

They may be presumed to be mixed, but they may necessarily be not. I am not exactly talking about being light-skinned, but more of a different shades of brown among Africans all over the continent. The image that pops up in someone's head about people of a certain region is a misconception for the most part. I know in Somalia/Ethiopia/Sudan/Eritrea, there was no mixing. They've been this way for generations. And People for the western countries are thought to be "extremely black skinned" but I will guarantee you they have many shades of brown there as well. I've met light, non-mixed West Africans, and dark-skinned North Africans.

Also, you'd be surprised how colour is still an issue even in many parts of Africa.

[DSTCHAOS]

They may be presumed to be mixed, but they may necessarily be not. I am not exactly talking about being light-skinned, but more of a different shades of brown among Africans all over the continent. The image that pops up in someone's head about people of a certain region is a misconception for the most part. I know in Somalia/Ethiopia/Sudan/Eritrea, there was no mixing. They've been this way for generations. And People for the western countries are thought to be "extremely black skinned" but I will guarantee you they have many shades of brown there as well. I've met light, non-mixed West Africans, and dark-skinned North Africans.

We've already acknowledged that Africa is a diverse continent in terms of physical appearance with or without "mixing." It isn't safe to assume that there was no mixing in Somalia/Ethiopia/Sudan/Eritrea. Being a certain way for generations doesn't preclude mixing (but it also doesn't assume mixing). Afterall, many African American families' appearances can be traced back to an era when white men forced themselves on black slaves or when blacks intermingled with Native American cultures.

The fact of the matter is that many people assume that being "straight from Africa" implies that you are less mixed with voluntary or involuntary "white blood" and that your physical appearance is stereotypically "pure African." I've been hearing that eversince elementary school when darkskinned children with defining features were called "African booty scratchers," especially after Shaka Zulu aired.

Also, you'd be surprised how colour is still an issue even in many parts of Africa.

I'm not surprised at all. "Color" is an issue in almost every society.

[_Opi_]

We've already acknowledged that Africa is a diverse continent in terms of physical appearance with or without "mixing." It isn't safe to assume that there was no mixing in Somalia/Ethiopia/Sudan/Eritrea. Being a certain way for generations doesn't preclude mixing (but it also doesn't assume mixing). Afterall, many African American families' appearances can be traced back to an era when white men forced themselves on black slaves or when blacks intermingled with Native American cultures.

The fact of the matter is that many people assume that being "straight from Africa" implies that you are less mixed with voluntary or involuntary "white blood" and that your physical appearance is stereotypically "pure African." I've been hearing that eversince elementary school when darkskinned children with defining features were called "African booty scratchers," especially after Shaka Zulu aired.



I'm not surprised at all. "Color" is an issue in almost every society.


There is no such thing as a pure race. Eventually, we are all mixed. However, I guess what I'm saying is how immediate this mixture is. From Colonial days? 500 years ago? Different regions have different experiences. When someone says mixed, I'm thinking like going back maybe 100 years, from a traceable perspective.

lol@color/colour <---canadian spelling

[DSTCHAOS]

There is no such thing as a pure race. Eventually, we are all mixed. However, I guess what I'm saying is how immediate this mixture is. From Colonial days? 500 years ago? Different regions have different experiences. When someone says mixed, I'm thinking like going back maybe 100 years, from a traceable perspective.

lol@color/colour <---canadian spelling

Exactly. ;)

How immediate it is doesn't really matter. And traceable shouldn't be the guideline because that would negate a majority of people in the African diaspora in most continents including many parts of Africa. Sometimes that's only the difference between consensual mixing and nonconsensual mixing because you have to consider the impacts of slavery and colonialism. Unless the African society wasn't that interrupted and existed in a bubble, and of course some African societies can claim to be more pure than others, I wouldn't be surprised the dynamics going on there.

As an aside:
The average African American family are of diverse shades, hair textures, and facial features. Sometimes these traits aren't apparent based on the lineage that the family knows about and sometimes it comes from way back. Kids used to get teased for taking on the fairer traits of grandmothers or great grandmothers. They were told they're the milk man's baby until their mother said "you look just like my great-great grandmother's side of the family." Many families can't trace their lineage much further back than that.

[pinkies up]

^^^TRUE. I my cousin and her husband (both dark skinned) have 2 babies who are light skinned and one has green eyes. Yeah...my cousin was trying hard to get a DNA test on both of them. Both of them are 99.98% his. My grandmother used to say that the "baby reached waaaay back" to get those features. Whatever color, WE are beautiful people.

[hellocutie]

^^^ I know someone with in that very same situation. Both parents are dark brown and their daughter is "high yella". It's funny, but my Bio Prof told me it takes more than about 15 different genes to determine a person skin tone will be.

[AKA_Monet]

Time to step in...

The older the human population is on the planet, the more diverse their genetic code based on population genetics.

Right now, it various "groups" in sub-Saharan Africa in specific locations, such as Mali, Twe, !Kung and one other group, I forget.

And if anyone wants to explain to me the genetic mutations and SNPs in tyrosinase gene family, I would really like to know. It is still a mutation process that actively occurs in some parts of The Congo and elsewhere.

[_Opi_]

When I was young, I sometimes wanted to be a little darker. While a lot of people hold lighter skin on a pedastol, and that's annoying to me, the reverse is also true sometimes. A lot of people would make assumptions of me, such as I was a light skinned stuck up beyotch with long hair (that's more true now than it was when I was a child :p ), that I wasn't black enough, and I even had someone tell me God didn't keep me in the oven long enough.

I've had similar experience. I'm quite content with how I am, don't get me wrong. I just find that it's frustrating that people cannot identify what part of the world I'm from or make comments that I find quite unnecessary. I'm always having to find that I have to explain to people here that A) I'm African B) No, I'm not mixed C) No, I'm not Indian, Hispanic, Arab, etc. D) Defend that I am, in fact, black. My sister is a few shades darker than me, and she used to get negative comments from her own people when she was a kid. It was hard for her because her sisters were lighter than her.

[southernelle25]

Time to step in...

The older the human population is on the planet, the more diverse their genetic code based on population genetics.

Right now, it various "groups" in sub-Saharan Africa in specific locations, such as Mali, Twe, !Kung and one other group, I forget.

Ethiopia? According to this article, "no region in the world has a larger genetic diversity than East Africa and Ethiopia." http://www.afrol.com/articles/15984

[burgertown]

I read a couple of pages of this and forgive me in advance if I should not be posting here, but I believe that it is just a matter of preference for a majority of people. I have a friend who only dates light skinned women. He just isnt attracted to dark skinned ones and is dark skinned himself. Another friend only dates dark skinned women because he does not like the way that light skinned women look. I personally prefer brown skinned women, but I have dated those darker and lighter.

I think another thing aside from just color are the features of the people involved. Afrocentricity and all. We do tend to focus heavily on European looks.

Just my two cents. . .

[southernelle25]

I agree. Whether someone has something such as "good" hair is often a bigger issue, at least that has been my experience.

[Honeykiss1974]

I agree. Whether someone has something such as "good" hair is often a bigger issue, at least that has been my experience.

Good point. I know some people that see having "good hair" as a "plus" if you are dark-skinned. As if it made up not being lighter. :(

[southernelle25]

Yes, and then there are those who feel bad for lightskinned people who do not having the "matching" hair.

[Choo-ChooAKA]

I agree with Southernelle. I've never thought too much about skin color (there was no dark/light preference in my family), but HAIR is an issue.

[PrettyBoy]

If people choose their mates based on that logic then they are idiots.

I remember this brown skin dude I knew who had finely textured hair and light eyes. Someone walked up to him, rubbed his hair and said "you're good for breeding." :rolleyes:
When I was in highschool some lady did that to me. She said "Nice head of hair" feeling it at the same time.

[PrettyBoy]

Wow . . that's why I asked . . I could see how some people might take that as a compliment and get their heads all gassed up . .that's sad. Breeding of all things . . . like he was some type of animal or something :(

This question is for everyone, if you could alter you complexion (lighter if you are a dark-skinned or vice versa) would you? I just finished a book called "The Diary of an Ugly Duckling" and in it a young woman who was tired of being, in her words, "fat,black,& ugly" enters a reality makeover show where they offer to lighten her skin (among other things) so she can resemble her other lighter family members. I just womder how many of you would be willing? When I was younger I might have answered yes to this, (elementary school was rough) but now I really like my almond chocolate and so do the men folk :D
I'm happy with my complexion. I wouldn't change the way I look. The only thing I don't like is that people think I'm everything except black. Both my parents are black.

[DSTCHAOS]

When I was in highschool some lady did that to me. She said "Nice head of hair" feeling it at the same time.

Maybe she was humored by your Jackson 5 'fro.

[PrettyBoy]

Maybe she was humored by your Jackson 5 'fro.
LOL. Would you stop it!:p

[SummerChild]

Hear hear!

SC
What is interesting about this topic is that it is still a "big deal" to many people, which is why it is still a topic to be discussed. However, discussing it keeps the topic a "big deal" to many people as opposed to the assumption that discussing something combats ignorance and changes people's thoughts and actions.

I have found that instead of thinking and talking about this "color complex" I just make it a point to correct (usually, black) people when I see or hear them displaying colorisms or hair texturisms. For instance, if I hear some ignorant soul say "good hair" or say "I need to stay out of the sun because I'm black enough as is," I go on (what my friend calls) my Angela Davis speech. I say "no such thing as 'good hair' unless you're talking about healthy hair" and "no such thing as being 'black enough' but you need to stay out of the sun to protect yourself from UV rays and skin cancer, not getting darker. Interestingly enough, your beautiful dark skin protects you from the sun's rays and skin cancer more than lighter or white skin does." I remember when a classmate told me when I was little that I needed to stay out of the sun to make sure that I stayed pretty and lightskinned--my family doesn't talk crazy like that so I was really shocked when I was told that by an outsider. No, I don't need to stay out of the sun to avoid getting shades darker but I do need to stay out of the sun because I have less melanin to protect my skin.

Either case, people have generally learned not to make certain comments around me. I could be changing the world if I force everyone to interact with me on a daily basis. Then I'll be their #1 source of socialization. :D

[Krisco]

Its always going to be an issue, its all about responding to it.

I just say things like "You still saying THAAAT?????" strongly attempting to make that person feel just as ignorant as they sound.


Thing is some of 'us' so-called educated folk are too blame for this still being an issue!

Look at a music video from the early 90's, the main girl usually was biracial with long curly hair, who SAID that was a TYPICAL Black girl?!?!?

[Still BLUTANG]

Saw this as i was browsing the web, interesting.

http://www.afro.com/bnw/bwmain.html

[mccoyred]

Saw this as i was browsing the web, interesting.

http://www.afro.com/bnw/bwmain.html

Interesting indeed. Messages were much more blatant back then than any one could get away with today.

[black_princess]

I found this online and was not sure if the issue was addressed but I found this small piece about Kanye West and his crazy mouth . . . this can't possibly be helping things as far as the self esteem of young girls and the warped mentality of our young men

http://72.14.209.104/search?hl=en&q=cache:ThdLIo0nzvsJ:http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/92845/kanye_wests_big_mouth_gets_him_in_trouble.html+%22 kanye+west%22+%22mutts%22+%22video+girls%22

[pinkies up]

Kanye needs his jaw wired shut...again

[aopirose]

Kanye needs his jaw wired shut...again

I thought the same thing.

[Sahara]

Its always going to be an issue, its all about responding to it.

I just say things like "You still saying THAAAT?????" strongly attempting to make that person feel just as ignorant as they sound.


Thing is some of 'us' so-called educated folk are too blame for this still being an issue!

Look at a music video from the early 90's, the main girl usually was biracial with long curly hair, who SAID that was a TYPICAL Black girl?!?!?

I agree that it will always be an issue. I briefly looked at that website and they talked about black women with straight hair and how that obsession originated.

I don't agree with the idea that educated folk are a source of blame. I think we are all in it equally. For example, I can say that there are some things that have been ingrained in me during my childhood and throughout my life that I still struggle with (e.g., hair texture, acceptable weight, and the spectrum of black social statuses). I think that it would be naive of anyone to say that it is something that people should just 'get over'. As long as prejudice (internal and external) exists, it will always be an issue.

Although it is not just about skin color, it is about how we, as blacks in general, struggle to fit into white society (people who historically do not care about nor accept us into their worlds).

[christiangirl]

Quick disclaimer: I know this thread went out a month ago, but I needed to rant and FINALLY had the sense to do a search before I started a new topic:).

I have a non-traditional problem with my skin color and I've been having it(literally) since the day I was born. My parents and sister are significantly darker than I am, so no one ever believes I'm really a part of my family. The day I was born, my mother's white coworker came to the hospital and the staff assumed she was my grandmother as a way of explaining my color despite my parents'. I've heard everything from "Your momma must've been creepin'" to "I didn't know you were adopted!" But's that's just scratching the surface. My real problem is that I have been complimented for being soooo pretty and soooo smart for as long as I can remember--because I'm light. That may not seem like a problem, but it's the start of one. This makes, NOT WHITE PEOPLE OR EVEN BROTHERS hate on me, but my beautifully dark-skinned counterparts.

Darker skinned women often celebrate themselves in a rebuttal to the madness, and rightfully so! This world is full of "Black is beautiful" type slogans. However, when I jump on the bandwagon and agree with such statements, nearly every darker woman has verbally slapped me in the face. I've been told numerous times that I already get praise for being light because looking closer to white is what's celebrated and I should be satisfied with that. Now, I'm trying to steal the thunder away from the REAL nubian queens and I'm just being "greedy" and an "attention hog." So what am I supposed to do?? Many of my darker skinned sisters accuse me of trying to "pass" because of the way that I speak and dress and that I need to "act more black." :mad: But that many more tell me I'm not one of them and "need to go back to the rest of the white people."

[mccoyred]

Quick disclaimer: I know this thread went out a month ago, but I needed to rant and FINALLY had the sense to do a search before I started a new topic:).

I have a non-traditional problem with my skin color and I've been having it(literally) since the day I was born. My parents and sister are significantly darker than I am, so no one ever believes I'm really a part of my family. The day I was born, my mother's white coworker came to the hospital and the staff assumed she was my grandmother as a way of explaining my color despite my parents'. I've heard everything from "Your momma must've been creepin'" to "I didn't know you were adopted!" But's that's just scratching the surface. My real problem is that I have been complimented for being soooo pretty and soooo smart for as long as I can remember--because I'm light. That may not seem like a problem, but it's the start of one. This makes, NOT WHITE PEOPLE OR EVEN BROTHERS hate on me, but my beautifully dark-skinned counterparts.

Darker skinned women often celebrate themselves in a rebuttal to the madness, and rightfully so! This world is full of "Black is beautiful" type slogans. However, when I jump on the bandwagon and agree with such statements, nearly every darker woman has verbally slapped me in the face. I've been told numerous times that I already get praise for being light because looking closer to white is what's celebrated and I should be satisfied with that. Now, I'm trying to steal the thunder away from the REAL nubian queens and I'm just being "greedy" and an "attention hog." So what am I supposed to do?? Many of my darker skinned sisters accuse me of trying to "pass" because of the way that I speak and dress and that I need to "act more black." :mad: But that many more tell me I'm not one of them and "need to go back to the rest of the white people."

I don't think this is a non-traditional skin color issue. Given that Black folks, particularly here in America, possess the broadest range of skin tones, those on either end of the spectrum have their issues to deal with.

I am dark brown and my cousin with whom I grew up with and is like a sister to me is very light (mixed race), therefore between us, we experienced the whole gamut of color issues. Mine were not worse than hers and hers were not more horrible than mine; we just had to deal.

[Dionysus]

I have never a victim of the skin color issue, and I hope it never happens. I do know of those who have though, but not many. Growing up, I got isht from blacks because of other things. Could this be a geographical thing? Or, a generational thing? I see dark and light skinned people my age getting along with each other pretty well. But I know many people in my grandparents generation that quite colorstruck, even blatantly at times.

[prettybreak1908]

Yes, the Color Complex is still a issue in the Black community although it is often ignored. I was a victim of the complex and I think that it has made me into the person I am now.

I am doing summer research about the Color Complex and college student's perceptions of it. I am doing it from both a historical and sociological view. I am examining how slavery had a lot to do with the discrimination within the Black community. I am excited about doing the research.

[mccoyred]

Yes, the Color Complex is still a issue in the Black community although it is often ignored. I was a victim of the complex and I think that it has made me into the person I am now.

I am doing summer research about the Color Complex and college student's perceptions of it. I am doing it from both a historical and sociological view. I am examining how slavery had a lot to do with the discrimination within the Black community. I am excited about doing the research.


Please share your results. I know many of us would be interested in your conclusions.

[lovelyivy84]

I guess the only way to respond is...well I dunno, I'd say take it as it's meant. On the one hand, you clearly have a lot of compassion for women who have been discriminated against because of their dark skin, and that's commendable.

How are you expressing this to them would be my main question. A lot of times expressions of sympathy can come across as condescending (ever had a white person tell you that they're really "down"- you know what I mean). It could be that is how it comes across sometimes, but you seem pretty clear in your meaning so I wonder.

Regardless of how you express yourself, it is NEVER ok for someone to disrespect you. If they get too high and mighty then tell them to back off. Being sympathetic is one thing- being a doormat is another.

Quick disclaimer: I know this thread went out a month ago, but I needed to rant and FINALLY had the sense to do a search before I started a new topic:).

I have a non-traditional problem with my skin color and I've been having it(literally) since the day I was born. My parents and sister are significantly darker than I am, so no one ever believes I'm really a part of my family. The day I was born, my mother's white coworker came to the hospital and the staff assumed she was my grandmother as a way of explaining my color despite my parents'. I've heard everything from "Your momma must've been creepin'" to "I didn't know you were adopted!" But's that's just scratching the surface. My real problem is that I have been complimented for being soooo pretty and soooo smart for as long as I can remember--because I'm light. That may not seem like a problem, but it's the start of one. This makes, NOT WHITE PEOPLE OR EVEN BROTHERS hate on me, but my beautifully dark-skinned counterparts.

Darker skinned women often celebrate themselves in a rebuttal to the madness, and rightfully so! This world is full of "Black is beautiful" type slogans. However, when I jump on the bandwagon and agree with such statements, nearly every darker woman has verbally slapped me in the face. I've been told numerous times that I already get praise for being light because looking closer to white is what's celebrated and I should be satisfied with that. Now, I'm trying to steal the thunder away from the REAL nubian queens and I'm just being "greedy" and an "attention hog." So what am I supposed to do?? Many of my darker skinned sisters accuse me of trying to "pass" because of the way that I speak and dress and that I need to "act more black." :mad: But that many more tell me I'm not one of them and "need to go back to the rest of the white people."

[christiangirl]

How are you expressing this to them would be my main question. A lot of times expressions of sympathy can come across as condescending (ever had a white person tell you that they're really "down"- you know what I mean). It could be that is how it comes across sometimes, but you seem pretty clear in your meaning so I wonder.

I get what you mean. I don't know; what I say is often taken a different way than I meant it (more sarcastically or meanly--I'm just one of those people :rolleyes:). But when someone says, "Nubian queens are beautiful" and I say "Yes, we are!" women just stare at me like a white girl said it! They say I'm trying to get praise for looking white AND being black, which couldn't be further from the truth. I don't look white IMO and I'm not mixed, just very light. I don't know why and I can't control it. So why tell me I'm stuck up and think I'm better than everyone else? Since when do you know what I think about myself over a physical trait that I can't control? And why expect me to be flattered over compliments which are really just the opposite? You know, I worked my butt off, going to school full-time, working full-time, and STILL got straight As. So when someone tells me I "look intelligent" because I "look white" and ignores everything else I just did....:mad: I spent an entire childhood never getting to interact with people of my own color except for my family or church members. So when I came to a black college, I was excited to learn my history, to be with my own people. Then I got here and, for 4 years, have dealt with being told I don't belong. It's not everyone, but it's enough.

As far as the other thing about the skin color of sorority members...I'll say this. I'm one of the lightest girls in my class. I was asked whether I'm an AKA probably once a week after I got to college and, once people started to know me, maybe once every couple months. Several times, people have admitted that my skin was the only clue they had to go on and still made the assumption. I can't express HOW FREQUENT AND IN HOW MANY WAYS THIS ASSUMPTION IS MADE ABOUT ME. I mean, COME ON, a freshman walked up to me on campus last year and expressed interest to me!!! :eek: I have mad respect for the org, but why does A have to equal B? Can I just be me? Is that okay with everybody? :D

The puzzling part is, it's not just the way I look--several GCers have PMed me asking if I'm an AKA (always either members of other orgs or a nonmember). So if it's possible that women who look white "talk white"...since people have made it up in their minds that there's a way to "look like an AKA" is there a way to "talk/type" like one? Because this stereotype is ridiculous...if I were darker, I bet I wouldn't be getting corned by freshmen. :rolleyes:

[RedefinedDiva]

I mean, COME ON, a freshman walked up to me on campus last year and expressed interest to me!!! :eek:
:rolleyes:

The puzzling part is, it's not just the way I look--several GCers have PMed me asking if I'm an AKA (always either members of other orgs or a nonmember). So if it's possible that women who look white "talk white"...since people have made it up in their minds that there's a way to "look like an AKA" is there a way to "talk/type" like one?

Don't get it twisted. No one is PMing you to inquire about your membership in my Sorority because of your grammer usage. They are probably PMing you because you often swerve out of your lane and speak on matters that you probably shouldn't comment on, hence "the way to 'talk/type like one." You do the math.

[unspokenone25]

^^
Word.

[lovelyivy84]

:rolleyes:



Don't get it twisted. No one is PMing you to inquire about your membership in my Sorority because of your grammer usage. They are probably PMing you because you often swerve out of your lane and speak on matters that you probably shouldn't comment on, hence "the way to 'talk/type like one." You do the math.

Well that answers my questions on how the poster might be coming across right there. Oh dear.

[pinkies up]

[/QUOTE]...if I were darker, I bet I wouldn't be getting corned by freshmen. :rolleyes:[/QUOTE]

:eek: :confused: You do know AKA's come in all colors.:cool:

[SummerChild]

Ha! Soror RD holding it down as usual.
I'm out. LOL.
SC
:rolleyes:



Don't get it twisted. No one is PMing you to inquire about your membership in my Sorority because of your grammer usage. They are probably PMing you because you often swerve out of your lane and speak on matters that you probably shouldn't comment on, hence "the way to 'talk/type like one." You do the math.

[christiangirl]

They are probably PMing you because you often swerve out of your lane and speak on matters that you probably shouldn't comment on, hence "the way to 'talk/type like one." You do the math.

If you'd like to PM me with examples of commenting on things that I shouldn't, I'd like to see them, b/c I don't think I've done that intentionally or even unintentionally often enough to merit people asking. I never meant to disrespect anyone. I was highlighting how dumb inferences like that are. Like I said, I have mad respect for the org, but I'm not a part of it and don't see why anyone would think I am, including the implication that I would be mistaken for an AKA because I comment on things that I shouldn't. I'm not being glib, I'm totally for real on this--I'm not saying what you said is not true, I'm saying I don't see it and if you or anyone else thinks I've overstepped, please let me know in what way. I never meant to offend anyone, AKA or otherwise.

:eek: :confused: You do know AKA's come in all colors.:cool:

Yes, I know that. That was sarcasm, making light of how stupid and untrue these stereotypes are. I thought the :rolleyes: would make it plain that I wasn't being serious.

[christiangirl]

prettybreak1908--one of my classmates did a study on Black college students and how they feel about skin color. The majority of men were more likely to date a light sister than a darker one and the majority of women didn't have a preference. There were other factors measured; I can tell you more about it if you're interested.

[Jill1228]

Yes, the Color Complex is still a issue in the Black community although it is often ignored. I was a victim of the complex and I think that it has made me into the person I am now.

Ditto! it is still an issue in my extended family--especially among the older folks

I would love to see your research too

[Honeykiss1974]

prettybreak1908--one of my classmates did a study on Black college students and how they feel about skin color. The majority of men were more likely to date a light sister than a darker one and the majority of women didn't have a preference. There were other factors measured; I can tell you more about it if you're interested.

I've seen studies like this before (I'll have to google some sources).

As painful as it is to admit, these stereotypes are still with us today.

[RedefinedDiva]

If you'd like to PM me with examples of commenting on things that I shouldn't, I'd like to see them, b/c I don't think I've done that intentionally or even unintentionally often enough to merit people asking. I never meant to disrespect anyone. I was highlighting how dumb inferences like that are. Like I said, I have mad respect for the org, but I'm not a part of it and don't see why anyone would think I am, including the implication that I would be mistaken for an AKA because I comment on things that I shouldn't. I'm not being glib, I'm totally for real on this--I'm not saying what you said is not true, I'm saying I don't see it and if you or anyone else thinks I've overstepped, please let me know in what way. I never meant to offend anyone, AKA or otherwise.

You must have me mistaken with someone else to assume that I have time to go through your old posts and send you examples of what you say on GC. Last time I checked, YOU posted that people PM YOU asking about your membership in my Sorority. Thus, then, and therefore, OBVIOUSLY you must be saying things that give people that impression, correct?

As I said before, you do the math.

[christiangirl]

You must have me mistaken with someone else to assume that I have time to go through your old posts and send you examples of what you say on GC. Last time I checked, YOU posted that people PM YOU asking about your membership in my Sorority. Thus, then, and therefore, OBVIOUSLY you must be saying things that give people that impression, correct?

As I said before, you do the math.

I didn't ask for an in-depth research of everything I've ever said...is that seriously how you took it? :confused: I sincerely asked you to let me know what you see that I might be doing to offend you or anyone else so that I can change it and stop giving off the wrong impression unintentionally. If you can't/won't do that, then what was the point of putting me on front street about it? Just to take a stab at me with no constructive intent? :confused: I've never known you to do that, but hey, first time for everything. Doesn't change my respect for you, so oh well.

Wheverever you were going with that, I obviously missed the bus, so I say back to our regularly scheduled thread we go...

[RedefinedDiva]

OK, maybe you are not reading my posts well, so I'll break it down.

1. You know that I am an AKA, right? How? Because a) it's has been in my signature or b) because you have read posts with me referencing such.

2. If I didn't have a signature stating my affiliation, then you would have what to go off of? MY WORDS.

3. Hence, people get impressions from what they read when there is no additional supporting evidence. Just like you may have never taken notice of AKA being in my signature, you seem to be pretty aware of my posts to have noticed at one point or another that I stated being a member of AKA or may have spoken in a matter-of-fact fashion about AKA or greek life in general.

4. Therefore, those persons that contacted you about being a member of my Sorority must have gotten the impression from the way you speak, be it about an affiliation or in a matter-of-fact tone.

You are trying to make this situation about me and you, but it's not. I don't have to try to put you on blast. You brought it up. Did you really expect me (or any of my other Sorors, for that matter) to not say something about it? I am stating to you why some PEOPLE would assume that you are a member of my Sorority. I don't have to document nor fish through all 976 of your posts to pinpoint specific instances. How about you contact those persons who PMed you and ask THEM WHAT gave THEM the impression that you were an AKA and let me know.

[christiangirl]

RD:

LOL, to be quite honest with you (and you can cyber-slap me for this, I won't fight you) I never noticed you were an AKA until your first comment in my direction in this thread. I thought you were in another sorority b/c I misread your screename. If it was in your sig, I truly never noticed. ":rolleyes:" on me.

Did I expect you to say something? Yes, which is why I ended the message with a question to prompt further discussion. If you felt it was a stupid question, then okay, ":rolleyes:" on me again. But I never wanted you to go through however many posts I have to pinpoint things. That's really misconstruing things and blowing it out of proportion. All I meant was if you stated I was "swerving out of my lane," then there must be something I said that you were thinking of when you brought that up, so let me know what it was so I can make sure not to do that again. But thanks for the convo, I appreciate the last post, it was very clear and gave me some things to think about.

Back to the thread. :)

[Wonderful1908]

RD:

LOL, to be quite honest with you (and you can cyber-slap me for this, I won't fight you) I never noticed you were an AKA until your first comment in my direction in this thread. I thought you were in another sorority b/c I misread your screename. If it was in your sig, I truly never noticed. ":rolleyes:" on me.

Did I expect you to say something? Yes, which is why I ended the message with a question to prompt further discussion. If you felt it was a stupid question, then okay, ":rolleyes:" on me again. But I never wanted you to go through however many posts I have to pinpoint things. That's really misconstruing things and blowing it out of proportion. All I meant was if you stated I was "swerving out of my lane," then there must be something I said that you were thinking of when you brought that up, so let me know what it was so I can make sure not to do that again. But thanks for the convo, I appreciate the last post, it was very clear and gave me some things to think about.

Back to the thread. :)

You know what I actually like how you replied to this whole matter. I really think you tried to be humble and sometimes don't realize how things can be percieved. Just take note on what you say, people should not have to point it out to you.

I agree back to the thread!

[RedefinedDiva]

Did I expect you to say something? Yes, which is why I ended the message with a question to prompt further discussion. If you felt it was a stupid question, then okay, ":rolleyes:" on me again. But I never wanted you to go through however many posts I have to pinpoint things. That's really misconstruing things and blowing it out of proportion. All I meant was if you stated I was "swerving out of my lane," then there must be something I said that you were thinking of when you brought that up, so let me know what it was so I can make sure not to do that again. But thanks for the convo, I appreciate the last post, it was very clear and gave me some things to think about.
CG:

As I previously stated, you CONTINUE to make this discussion about ME and you. I don't know how else to simplify it for you. One LAST time, if OTHERS (NOT RD) are construing that you are a member of the Sorority, it must be based on something you said. Since a person cannot see you through a messageboard and make assumptions about your affiliation based on appearance (as is the purpose of the thread), one (NOT RD) can only make assumptions based on what you say on this messageboard. Since RD is NOT one the persons that has made the assumption about you, RD is NOT the one to pinpoint what you have said. As previously stated, you need to address with THE PERSONS WHO HAVE PMed YOU as to why they made the assumption you were a member of my Sorority. RD can draw her own conclusions and RD will address them when they need to be addressed.

I hope that you get what I am saying now. If not, *shrug* I can't break it down any further. Take it for what it's worth. I agree with everything Soror Wonderful has stated. Remain humble and be mindful.

Proceed with the previously scheduled discussion.

[christiangirl]

Proceed with the previously scheduled discussion.

This, we can agree on. And Wonderful: thanks. ;)

[susan314]

Forgive me for the thread crash, but just wanted to mention something that I have always found to be bizarre...

As you ladies have documented so thoroughly in this thread, there are people (black and white) who have a preference for lighter skinned black people, for whatever reason. (I think its craziness myself, but anyhow...)

And yet, white people subject themselves to dangerous levels of sun exposure to try to tan and make themselves darker. For those people who have wised up to the health risks of excessive sun exposure, there are a variety of self-tanners to fake the appearance of darker skin. We're expected to avoid being pale at all costs.

I'm pale - about as pale as a person can get (comes from being a redhead). I can't even begin to count the number of times some "well-meaning" individual has told me to get a tan, or to try one of those new self-tanning products on the market, etc. I've had guys (thinking that they are giving me a "compliment") tell me that I'm attractive for someone "so pale" or that I "could be attractive if I got a tan." No thanks. I'm content with myself the way that I am, and that's good enough for me.

I've just always found it to be strange and confusing why so many members of the white race make every effort to be darker, and yet discriminate so unfairly against people who naturally have darker skin. Its a crazy world we live in.

(Personally, I think that we should appreciate the beauty in all of us...and not just physical beauty, but beauty in character also. Too much emphasis these days is put on external appearance. :( )

[1908Revelations]

Forgive me for the thread crash, but just wanted to mention something that I have always found to be bizarre...

(Personally, I think that we should appreciate the beauty in all of us...and not just physical beauty, but beauty in character also. Too much emphasis these days is put on external appearance. :( )
You are not crashing, we welcome everyone whith respectful comments:)

True!

[RedefinedDiva]

Hi Susan. You aren't crashing.

I think that the White people are able to discriminate against persons with naturally darker skin because despite tanning and all of their efforts to appear darker (temporarily), THEY ARE STILL WHITE at the end of the day. Even with a slightly sunkissed tone, they still do not lose the privileges that are afforded to them because of their race. They still have to option to NOT tan and remain just as pale as they want to be. While persons of darker skin tones never have that option.

Not sure if you get what I'm saying, but it's all a matter that goes to the discussion of White privilege. I'm sure we've discussed that a time or two here on GC.

[susan314]

Hi Susan. You aren't crashing.

I think that the White people are able to discriminate against persons with naturally darker skin because despite tanning and all of their efforts to appear darker (temporarily), THEY ARE STILL WHITE at the end of the day. Even with a slightly sunkissed tone, they still do not lose the privileges that are afforded to them because of their race. They still have to option to NOT tan and remain just as pale as they want to be. While persons of darker skin tones never have that option.

Not sure if you get what I'm saying, but it's all a matter that goes to the discussion of White privilege. I'm sure we've discussed that a time or two here on GC.

I do understand what you're saying, as far as even the deepest tanned white person still being white at the end of the day goes.

I still think its hypocritical to hear someone who puts a lot of effort into making him/herself darker make ignorant comments about people who naturally have darker skin. (Its offensive no matter what the shade of the person who said it - there's just an added layer of irony that goes with it when that person is obsessed with trying to be darker themself.) Perhaps the reasons you cited above are why they don't see the irony/hypocrisy of their own actions?

Hmmn, now that I think about it, this whole conversation makes me think of a story that was relayed to me recently. My grandmother passed away on Easter, and at her funeral last week people were sharing lots of stories. One of her sisters mentioned that they tried as hard as possible to cover themselves and avoid getting tan while working the fields. (My grandmother was raised on a farm and worked the fields, tended the animals, etc.) Apparently back then, being tan was a dead giveaway that you came from a poorer family. I wonder when the perception changed that being tan was a "bad" thing to being a highly desired thing?

(Sorry, I know that last paragraph is straying a little from the topic at hand - all the talk about tanning reminded me of that story, and of course my grandmother has been on my mind lately with her recent passing.)

[Drolefille]

Hmmn, now that I think about it, this whole conversation makes me think of a story that was relayed to me recently. My grandmother passed away on Easter, and at her funeral last week people were sharing lots of stories. One of her sisters mentioned that they tried as hard as possible to cover themselves and avoid getting tan while working the fields. (My grandmother was raised on a farm and worked the fields, tended the animals, etc.) Apparently back then, being tan was a dead giveaway that you came from a poorer family. I wonder when the perception changed that being tan was a "bad" thing to being a highly desired thing?

(Sorry, I know that last paragraph is straying a little from the topic at hand - all the talk about tanning reminded me of that story, and of course my grandmother has been on my mind lately with her recent passing.)
When most people no longer had to work in the fields, rich or poor. Then tanness became a sign of being healthy and physically fit.

In the early 20th century being tan started to mean that you were more well off (at least in Europe) and no one would confuse your golden tan from the French Riviera as a farmer's tan. By the '60s tan was in and pale was out.

See: Wiki on Sun tanning (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_tanning#Cultural_history) :D

[mccoyred]

When most people no longer had to work in the fields, rich or poor. Then tanness became a sign of being healthy and physically fit.

In the early 20th century being tan started to mean that you were more well off (at least in Europe) and no one would confuse your golden tan from the French Riviera as a farmer's tan. By the '60s tan was in and pale was out.

See: Wiki on Sun tanning (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun_tanning#Cultural_history) :D

Funny this topic came up. I was having a discussion about this very phenomenon with a white co-worker the other day. The more things change, the more they remain the same. :cool:

[AKA_Monet]

So, how come there are several cultures worldwide that avoid having exceptionally darkened skin? Of course most of sub-Saharan African cultures are quite dark and could never absolutely lighten their complexion--except in one instance that still occurs. Albinism at the Tyrosine locus.

[christiangirl]

The more things change, the more they remain the same. :cool:

Ooooh, that was deep! *snaps*

This is reminding me of the latest episode of ER with the teen white girls who tanned themselves into raisins. They looked like Beyonce did in Dreamgirls while Jamie was singing and she did that photoshoot as a darker, African-esque woman...intriguing on her, not so much for 2 teenagers in the emergency room! :eek: Is that what made you think of this, Susan? I notice that when notable things happen on TV, I end up seeing related posts soon after.:cool:

[SummerChild]

Exactly Soror! I keep posting in these threads that this phenomena, which is a fascination with more European features, is not limited to AA cultures. For example, there was a front page LA Times article this past summer/fall about the fact that Asian women are now one of the greatest consumers of fade cream and a substantial number of them apparently carry parasols when walking in the sun to avoid tanning b/c paler is better. I had a friend a few years ago that explained to me that the more European features were also deemed as better in the Latin cultures. Thus, she explained to me, when Latina newscasters were first on the news on their stations, they were women with the paler skin and the blond hair - not the darker skin with dark hair. I don't think it's really limited to AAs.

And incidentally, I don't recall who posted that men tend to prefer lighter women. I think that it all depends on the, strangely enough, the complexion of the man. I am a dark skinned woman and typically attract light skinned men. Many of these men, when I see pics or know of their old girlfriends, they are dark skinned women like me. Therefore, many men that are dark, I see with a light woman and many men that are light, I see with a dark woman. I think people just like to try something a little different from themselves to spice it up a little. LOL.

It's all good. LOL.

SC

So, how come there are several cultures worldwide that avoid having exceptionally darkened skin? Of course most of sub-Saharan African cultures are quite dark and could never absolutely lighten their complexion--except in one instance that still occurs. Albinism at the Tyrosine locus.

[christiangirl]

And incidentally, I don't recall who posted that men tend to prefer lighter women.

That was me :cool:

prettybreak1908--one of my classmates did a study on Black college students and how they feel about skin color. The majority of men were more likely to date a light sister than a darker one and the majority of women didn't have a preference.

[GatorDimeBreed]

Hey guys after reading this thread i felt compelled to make my first post:)

I just want say that I am a light (bright) skinned female with green eyes and what has bothered me the most throught the years is not white people who dont like me b/c im black but other darker skinned females (not all of course but im referring to the rude ones i have come across) Have you ever had a situation where you walk into a group full of white people and you can see them give you this look..like they dont want you there. That has happened to me plenty of times with darker females. It hurts because i feel like we are SUPPOSED to be on the same team..yet you are dividing us. In school i even had this one girl say ''well if your light skinned that means your not black youre white' WTF! So i said then that means Malcolm X was some random white guy helping our cause b/c following that logic he is not black either. What doesnt help light skinned sistas are the few who ARE stuck-up, think they are better than everyone, so they perpetuate the stereotype and make it harder for people like myself.(dont get me wrong i used to be stuck up when i was a young child b/c of my eyes but my mom who is mixed but considers herself full black..put an end to that quickly...and for that i am grateful:p ). I still kind of have issues w/ feeling completly comfortable with my skin tone ....I feel like the oddball when i am with my friends (most if not all are darker skinned) but i am starting to get over that.
On another note while i do have a preference for darker men, if i see a cute light skinned brotha i like im not going to hesitate just because he's light (i might if he's white b/c like some one posted a while ago i dont want my kids to be see through) so I think there is a diff. between having a preference and purposely not dating a particular color

Thats just my 2cents

[mccoyred]

Exactly Soror! I keep posting in these threads that this phenomena, which is a fascination with more European features, is not limited to AA cultures. For example, there was a front page LA Times article this past summer/fall about the fact that Asian women are now one of the greatest consumers of fade cream and a substantial number of them apparently carry parasols when walking in the sun to avoid tanning b/c paler is better. I had a friend a few years ago that explained to me that the more European features were also deemed as better in the Latin cultures. Thus, she explained to me, when Latina newscasters were first on the news on their stations, they were women with the paler skin and the blond hair - not the darker skin with dark hair. I don't think it's really limited to AAs.

And incidentally, I don't recall who posted that men tend to prefer lighter women. I think that it all depends on the, strangely enough, the complexion of the man. I am a dark skinned woman and typically attract light skinned men. Many of these men, when I see pics or know of their old girlfriends, they are dark skinned women like me. Therefore, many men that are dark, I see with a light woman and many men that are light, I see with a dark woman. I think people just like to try something a little different from themselves to spice it up a little. LOL.

It's all good. LOL.

SC

This worldwide phenomenon results from the economic domination leading to cultural domination of the European in the last several centuries. This behavior is more pronounced in formerly colonized areas (India, US, South Africa for example).

What everyone needs to keep in mind is that the European was not always culturally or economically dominant.

[PrettyBoy]

This worldwide phenomenon results from the economic domination leading to cultural domination of the European in the last several centuries. This behavior is more pronounced in formerly colonized areas (India, US, South Africa for example).

What everyone needs to keep in mind is that the European was not always culturally or economically dominant.
So far, this is the best statement I heard on this thread.

[OneTimeSBX]

the next time a dark-skinned person says you are pretty/cute/nice looking to be so dark...

..say "so are you!"

i hate nothing more than to be reminded that i am dark. yes, i look in the mirror every single day so i dont need to be told that. yes, i am a good looking woman. those two things should never be in the same sentence/statement. one has nothing to do with the other.

[Still BLUTANG]

i find this puzzling.

i don't like the comment "you're pretty to be so dark" but at the same time i don't mind "being reminded" that i am dark-skinned.

i don't have a problem acknowledging within myself that i am dark-skinned. that's what your post sounded like and if i am way off base I apologize. :confused:

[1908Revelations]

i don't like the comment "you're pretty to be so dark" but at the same time i don't mind "being reminded" that i am dark-skinned.
I am not dark skinned, but when I hear someone make a comment like that I get pissed!! Someone said that about my grandmother (they were looking at a picture of her from back in the day) and I wanted to deck them.

[mccoyred]

the next time a dark-skinned person says you are pretty/cute/nice looking to be so dark...

..say "so are you!"

i hate nothing more than to be reminded that i am dark. yes, i look in the mirror every single day so i dont need to be told that. yes, i am a good looking woman. those two things should never be in the same sentence/statement. one has nothing to do with the other.

What is the problem with being dark-skinned :confused: ?

[mccoyred]

i find this puzzling.

i don't like the comment "you're pretty to be so dark" but at the same time i don't mind "being reminded" that i am dark-skinned.

i don't have a problem acknowledging within myself that i am dark-skinned. that's what your post sounded like and if i am way off base I apologize. :confused:



Dark AND Lovely :D

[AKA_Monet]

I don't like it either when folks belittle darker complexion folks. It cuts my heart terribly so...

[JWithers]

Well, I am about as pasty-white as you can get (sorry to crash, but the title was eye-catching).

But, my dad lived in the Carribean (D.R.) for 17 years so I spent alot of time there, and they are very hung up on light vs. dark down there. To some extent, most everyone is a person of color, but the combinations are really extensive. Light eyes with dark skin but euro features, bright skin with dark eyes and more African features, probably more 'differences' than in the States.

But I always thought it was strange they way the people would say how 'bonita' a girl was just becasue she was light, even if she wasn't all that pretty. But a woman with very dark skin didn't get as much attention, even if she was gorgeous!

Anyway, I am white(did I mention pasty?:) ), and probably shouldn't have chimed in, but I was kind of surprised that that kind of thing is an issue here, too.

Thanks for letting a newbie post.

[AKA_Monet]

Well, I am about as pasty-white as you can get (sorry to crash, but the title was eye-catching).

But, my dad lived in the Carribean (D.R.) for 17 years so I spent alot of time there, and they are very hung up on light vs. dark down there. To some extent, most everyone is a person of color, but the combinations are really extensive. Light eyes with dark skin but euro features, bright skin with dark eyes and more African features, probably more 'differences' than in the States.

But I always thought it was strange they way the people would say how 'bonita' a girl was just becasue she was light, even if she wasn't all that pretty. But a woman with very dark skin didn't get as much attention, even if she was gorgeous!

Anyway, I am white(did I mention pasty?:) ), and probably shouldn't have chimed in, but I was kind of surprised that that kind of thing is an issue here, too.

Thanks for letting a newbie post.

Yes, sweetheart, it has been going on for a long time.

[JWithers]

Yes, sweetheart, it has been going on for a long time.


Thanks for your kind reply. I saw some posts where new people get kind of reamed. I guess no matter who you are , people feel like they have to divide into groups, and then groups within groups. It seems wrong, but I guess , like you said, it's been going on a long time. :(

[AKA_Monet]

Thanks for your kind reply. I saw some posts where new people get kind of reamed. I guess no matter who you are , people feel like they have to divide into groups, and then groups within groups. It seems wrong, but I guess , like you said, it's been going on a long time. :(

I don't know why anyone would "ream" you for stating the obvious. Most of us know this happens, it has been happening for a long time and yes, it is wrong.

I don't like it when folks on GC compare complexions...

[JWithers]

I don't know why anyone would "ream" you for stating the obvious. Most of us know this happens, it has been happening for a long time and yes, it is wrong.

I don't like it when folks on GC compare complexions...


Oh, goodness, not about just that, but about any kind of post. I have enjoyed reading all of the posts and finally wanted to join in. But was a little afraid. That was silly, because you are very kind!

Also, I am sorry that people do that...I have NO idea about it and don't pretend to . But I do know it happens in other places, too.

Have a good night. :)

[TotallyWicked]

did everyone hear about the set of parties cancelled in Detroit. The first party was going to give free admission to light skinned Black women and Libras.

They were going to have "Sexy Chocolate" and "Sexy caramel" parties later on, but cancelled due to the controversy, dude says he didn't expect this kinda of feedback :rolleyes:

I read on another message board that they were planning on doing a "Good Hair Party" :eek::eek::eek: but dunno how valid that is.

[AKA_Monet]

did everyone hear about the set of parties cancelled in Detroit. The first party was going to give free admission to light skinned Black women and Libras.

They were going to have "Sexy Chocolate" and "Sexy caramel" parties later on, but cancelled due to the controversy, dude says he didn't expect this kinda of feedback :rolleyes:

I read on another message board that they were planning on doing a "Good Hair Party" :eek::eek::eek: but dunno how valid that is.

Can you give us some links? I think he was trying to show some social discrepancies and discriminations and make money off of it, but it somehow backfired.

I think these things are foul.

[1908Revelations]

Please give us some links.

ETA:
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20071012/METRO/710120405
http://www.cnn.com/2007/LIVING/wayoflife/10/18/skintone.club.ap/index.html
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21367799/

There are some others this is the link to the AOL search I did:
http://aolsearch.aol.com/aol/search?query=detroit%20light%20skinned%20Black%20w omen%20and%20Libras%20party (http://aolsearch.aol.com/aol/search?query=detroit%20light%20skinned%20Black%20w omen%20and%20Libras%20party)

[Wonderful1908]

Interesting to be honest it was stupid, but I wonder if this would have been the opposite say if all "Sexy Chocalate Sistas" in free first would it be as controversial.:confused:

[Still BLUTANG]

if it was "sexy chocolate" night then i think EVERY shade of cocoa would have found a way to get in free. People claiming "white chocolate" or "milk chocolate" or "dark chocolate"....ya know?

the whole light/dark thing gives me headaches sometimes. SOMETIMES its like the dark sisters are complaining from a sense of inferiority that no one has placed upon them but themselves - i am dark so i guess i'm allowed to say that. i dont know any light sistas who think they're better than ___, but i know plenty of dark sistas who THINK that light sistas think they are. :confused:

[AKA_Monet]

if it was "sexy chocolate" night then i think EVERY shade of cocoa would have found a way to get in free. People claiming "white chocolate" or "milk chocolate" or "dark chocolate"....ya know?

the whole light/dark thing gives me headaches sometimes. SOMETIMES its like the dark sisters are complaining from a sense of inferiority that no one has placed upon them but themselves - i am dark so i guess i'm allowed to say that. i dont know any light sistas who think they're better than ___, but i know plenty of dark sistas who THINK that light sistas think they are. :confused:

I know a few light skinned sistahs who have said that about me and I have a medium brown complexion.

I actually prefer having a darker complexion because I think I look healthier.

What is funny, when I was in Hawaii 2 weeks ago, some kids were playing in the ocean lagoon and I walked by to see a beached sea turtle. One of the kids were may have been Hawaiian exclaimed, "look at how BLACK she is"... There was no reason to be angry, because I dunno if they knew what they were saying, but I found it rather silly and ironic.

[Munchkin03]

I'm always amazed, even now, at how much stock some of us still put in skin tones.

Over the summer, I was at a family wedding when a cousin I hadn't seen in about 15 years was discussing various family members--and their skin tones! Maybe I'm naive, but I had never thought about my uncles and aunts in terms of who was the darkest and lightest. But, apparently she had! She also told me and my sister how "lucky" we were to have been born with green and hazel eyes. :eek:

[PrettyInPink777]

This is stirring up family memories. :rolleyes:

I have always heard about girls with 'pretty hair'. Apparently, my elders were evolved enough not to say "good hair", but the plain truth is 'pretty' was the subsitute for 'good'. The subtle (or not-so-subtle!) implication was that the compliment was intended only for those with LONG, straight hair. One's hair couldn't be pretty and short / nappy -- those identifiers were mutually-exclusive.

Another interesting identifier was the concept of the "cute black girl'.... kind of like the skewed concepts of the 'woman doctor', 'male hos', and 'white trash'.

Finally -- As a young girl, I used to hear this in Mississippi if a woman was unattractive but fair-complected..... "That's just some yellow throwed away!" Has anyone else ever heard that?

[Jill1228]

I heard this from my grandmother (who is color struck as all get out)--she was talking about my cousin's new wife.
"She is ugly because she is too black." WTF? I have also heard her say about someone: "She is so black but she is pretty."


That is like hearing someone say: "she has a pretty face but she is so fat"

I came this close to calling my grandmother out and telling her that she should be ashamed of herself

[Wonderful1908]

I heard this from my grandmother (who is color struck as all get out)--she was talking about my cousin's new wife.
"She is ugly because she is too black." WTF? I have also heard her say about someone: "She is so black but she is pretty."


That is like hearing someone say: "she has a pretty face but she is so fat"

I came this close to calling my grandmother out and telling her that she should be ashamed of herself

Do we have the same grandmother?

She would only let me play in the shade as a child so I would stay light...

I think she really likes my daughter so much becuase she is light with "good" hair :rolleyes:

[Jill1228]

Wonderful, I think we have the same grandmother, sisterfriend! If not, they gotta be related (my grandma is 1 of 12 kids). :)

I am rather dark and I kept hearing the stay out of the sun. I love the sun and the ocean...not gonna happen

WTH is "good hair"?. If it is on your head and you like it, it is GOOD HAIR

[Blacksocialite]

did everyone hear about the set of parties cancelled in Detroit. The first party was going to give free admission to light skinned Black women and Libras.

They were going to have "Sexy Chocolate" and "Sexy caramel" parties later on, but cancelled due to the controversy, dude says he didn't expect this kinda of feedback :rolleyes:

I read on another message board that they were planning on doing a "Good Hair Party" :eek::eek::eek: but dunno how valid that is.


I swear...we can be our own worst enemy at times.

I'm curious about something however - do you think issues of class and color seem to 'rise' to the surface of our consciousness more in tough economic times?

It's almost as if we're all "doing OK" economically, we're not really focused on class and color as much.

But, when dollars get tight, if appears as if we revert back to the 'ole ye' time and start finding ways to self segregate.

[Conskeeted7]

I just had a funny experience today. An older white lady was in Sephora with her (assuming) grandkids who were black. The kids were playing in the makeup while grandmother was at the counter. They put foundation on that was about 4 shades lighter than their skin. When grandmother turned around and saw them, she said 'you 2 getting ready for Halloween?' The older girl (about 6 yrs. old) said 'we're pretty little white girls now.' The grandmother just took them and left. The sad thing is that I'm sure they've heard that from the adults they're around and they'll grow up feeling inferior because of it.

[AKA_Monet]

I just had a funny experience today. An older white lady was in Sephora with her (assuming) grandkids who were black. The kids were playing in the makeup while grandmother was at the counter. They put foundation on that was about 4 shades lighter than their skin. When grandmother turned around and saw them, she said 'you 2 getting ready for Halloween?' The older girl (about 6 yrs. old) said 'we're pretty little white girls now.' The grandmother just took them and left. The sad thing is that I'm sure they've heard that from the adults they're around and they'll grow up feeling inferior because of it.


This little guy, is my nephew... His mother is caucasian and his father is Black and has a medium dark brown complexion like me. We all truly love this young man, but his mother refuses to accept his diverse heritage in both her interactions and friendships with various children. But, that is how his father, my brother, wanted it. My nephew actually has features reminscent to a combination of both my mother and father's and his mother families' genetics. The prominent features are his forehead and nose and some facial shaping that are distinctly AKA_Monet's family...

http://images.kodakgallery.com/photos4361/5/57/51/88/14/9/914885157505_0_ALB.jpg

[Wonderful1908]

This little guy, is my nephew... His mother is caucasian and his father is Black and has a medium dark brown complexion like me. We all truly love this young man, but his mother refuses to accept his diverse heritage in both her interactions and friendships with various children. But, that is how his father, my brother, wanted it. My nephew actually has features reminscent to a combination of both my mother and father's and his mother families' genetics. The prominent features are his forehead and nose and some facial shaping that are distinctly AKA_Monet's family...

http://images.kodakgallery.com/photos4361/5/57/51/88/14/9/914885157505_0_ALB.jpg



Can't see the pic..:(

[pretty edAKAted]

The first couple of days of school I was in the financial aid office and there was a young white girl with a mixed looking baby with her calling her mommy. the majority of the black guys that were in there started talking saying


" see that is why i want me a white girl so i can have some pretty children"

all of the other guys in the room followed saying

"yeah, man i know what you are talking about, that is a beutiful lil' girl"

Why do people think they have to get pregnant or have a baby by a white person in order to be considered beautiful. Why are they so afraid their children will be dark skinned? I think this is just ignorance and someone needs to raise thier children correctly without superficial thoughts like that. :mad:

[Jill1228]

OMG, Thank you!
It kinda peeves me when people know you are in an interracial relationship/marriage and trying to conceive/ are pregnant they say, "you are going to have beautiful children". WTF? :mad:

Makes me wanna holler

[Animate]

The first couple of days of school I was in the financial aid office and there was a young white girl with a mixed looking baby with her calling her mommy. the majority of the black guys that were in there started talking saying


" see that is why i want me a white girl so i can have some pretty children"

all of the other guys in the room followed saying

"yeah, man i know what you are talking about, that is a beutiful lil' girl"

Why do people think they have to get pregnant or have a baby by a white person in order to be considered beautiful. Why are they so afraid their children will be dark skinned? I think this is just ignorance and someone needs to raise thier children correctly without superficial thoughts like that. :mad:
WoW!!! Those guys sound like they will be future daddies to multiple mothers.
I'll have beautiful kids cause I have the beautiful gene.

[Jill1228]

WoW!!! Those guys sound like they will be future daddies to multiple mothers.
I'll have beautiful kids cause I have the beautiful gene.

Yup, we will see them on future episodes of Maury :D

[DSTCHAOS]

OMG, Thank you!
It kinda peeves me when people know you are in an interracial relationship/marriage and trying to conceive/ are pregnant they say, "you are going to have beautiful children". WTF? :mad:

Makes me wanna holler


That annoys me too because ugly children can happen to anyone.

[Jill1228]

Sistahfriend, ain't that the truth?
last year after my miscarriage, someone did express their sympathies (which is all good) but then they added "that's too bad, it would have been a pretty child"

WTF? You should have quit while you were ahead! I was just too stunned

[Munchkin03]

OMG, Thank you!
It kinda peeves me when people know you are in an interracial relationship/marriage and trying to conceive/ are pregnant they say, "you are going to have beautiful children". WTF? :mad:


Oh man, about two weeks ago, the boy and I were at an event...one of the waiters, who's from the same area of the world as the boy, tried to convince him to have a kid with me! :eek: He was all, "my girlfriend is Dominican, and our kids are gorgeous." The girlfriend was a waitress at the club too, and he brought her over to show us! She also tried to convince us how beautiful our kids would be.

I thought it was hilarious until I remembered that some people have to go through this nonsense every day.

[PerfectMistake]

Good Evening all,

This post is right on time for me... I'm a beautiful dark-skinned Black woman who feels that we're all beautiful in our own way... I was raised to think that being dark skinned was wrong and I've been asked if I was adopted since I could remember (my mom is caramel, my older and younger sisters are light/medium brown, my dad is really dark, but he wasn't around)... It took a while for me to embrace this God-given beauty, but it happened... As a people (all people, all races) we still have a problem with skin color... it's sad, but true... The only solution to this problem (it's ideal, but not so real) is to just love people for who they are... It may not be that easy for everyone, but if you wanna get over it, then you'll do it...

I've received compliments for having long, permed, good hair and I've been called "pretty for a black girl"... I recently cut my long, permed hair and I'm natural (which is a whole 'nother ball game entirely)... In the end, I'm just me... Question: Why is it that I'm more accepted as a dark skinned woman with shoulder length permed hair, but overlooked or shunned for having natural hair?


While I was an undergrad (Sociology major) at a predominantly white institution, I took a class called Racism in American Society... The professor was AWESOME... On the first day of class, she put everyone in order from lightest to darkest... As a Black woman, I was proud to stand at the darkest end of the spectrum (If I'd been light skinned I'd be proud there, too!)... Funny thing is, there were people who were clearly darker than me who didn't want to be the darkest person in the class... They looked ashamed and moved closer to the middle of the spectrum... The professor gave money to the 6 darkest students in the class... It was an experiment to show whites/lighter skinned people how it felt to be rewarded solely on the basis of skin color....

I STILL HAVE MY DOLLAR 3 YEARS LATER....

This experiment touched me and made me look @ PEOPLE differently....

It's just my thoughts :)

[Conskeeted7]

WoW!!! Those guys sound like they will be future daddies to multiple mothers.
I'll have beautiful kids cause I have the beautiful gene.

Exactly. My kids will be gorgeous for the same reason.

[Little32]

The guy who could be my babies' daddy (not that I would do that at this point) is fair skinned, and we would have beautiful children--but that's because we are both pretty good looking.

[pinkies up]

Ugly is a genetic trait. Flav and some random white girl will not equal pretty babies; just light skinned crickets.

[NinjaPoodle]

...While I was an undergrad (Sociology major) at a predominantly white institution, I took a class called Racism in American Society... The professor was AWESOME... On the first day of class, she put everyone in order from lightest to darkest... As a Black woman, I was proud to stand at the darkest end of the spectrum (If I'd been light skinned I'd be proud there, too!)... Funny thing is, there were people who were clearly darker than me who didn't want to be the darkest person in the class... They looked ashamed and moved closer to the middle of the spectrum... The professor gave money to the 6 darkest students in the class... It was an experiment to show whites/lighter skinned people how it felt to be rewarded solely on the basis of skin color....

I STILL HAVE MY DOLLAR 3 YEARS LATER....

This experiment touched me and made me look @ PEOPLE differently....

It's just my thoughts :)

Your teacher is the best. (ps im glad you know your true self worth:) )

[NinjaPoodle]

Ugly is a genetic trait. Flav and some random white girl will not equal pretty babies; just light skinned crickets.

http://www.siyclone.com/forum//style_emoticons/default/dead3.gif

You know you are so wrong for that (but it was funny)

[Still BLUTANG]

Oh man, about two weeks ago, the boy and I were at an event...one of the waiters, who's from the same area of the world as the boy, tried to convince him to have a kid with me! :eek: He was all, "my girlfriend is Dominican, and our kids are gorgeous." The girlfriend was a waitress at the club too, and he brought her over to show us! She also tried to convince us how beautiful our kids would be.

I thought it was hilarious until I remembered that some people have to go through this nonsense every day.

i get that when i go out with by bestguyfriend. he's Filipino and dates black women exclusively (another story there). When we go out his friends who haven't met me, they assume we're on a date and feel the need to tell us how cute our kids will be. :confused:

[Still BLUTANG]

Good Evening all,

This post is right on time for me... I'm a beautiful dark-skinned Black woman who feels that we're all beautiful in our own way... I was raised to think that being dark skinned was wrong and I've been asked if I was adopted since I could remember (my mom is caramel, my older and younger sisters are light/medium brown, my dad is really dark, but he wasn't around)... It took a while for me to embrace this God-given beauty, but it happened... As a people (all people, all races) we still have a problem with skin color... it's sad, but true... The only solution to this problem (it's ideal, but not so real) is to just love people for who they are... It may not be that easy for everyone, but if you wanna get over it, then you'll do it...

I've received compliments for having long, permed, good hair and I've been called "pretty for a black girl"... I recently cut my long, permed hair and I'm natural (which is a whole 'nother ball game entirely)... In the end, I'm just me... Question: Why is it that I'm more accepted as a dark skinned woman with shoulder length permed hair, but overlooked or shunned for having natural hair?


While I was an undergrad (Sociology major) at a predominantly white institution, I took a class called Racism in American Society... The professor was AWESOME... On the first day of class, she put everyone in order from lightest to darkest... As a Black woman, I was proud to stand at the darkest end of the spectrum (If I'd been light skinned I'd be proud there, too!)... Funny thing is, there were people who were clearly darker than me who didn't want to be the darkest person in the class... They looked ashamed and moved closer to the middle of the spectrum... The professor gave money to the 6 darkest students in the class... It was an experiment to show whites/lighter skinned people how it felt to be rewarded solely on the basis of skin color....

I STILL HAVE MY DOLLAR 3 YEARS LATER....

This experiment touched me and made me look @ PEOPLE differently....

It's just my thoughts :)


girl, you are touching on so many things right there. :)
<--- dark sista who has been natural as well as permed and has recieved TOTALLY distinct treatment depending on hairstyle. LOL.

[skywalker20_99]

Wonderful, I think we have the same grandmother, sisterfriend! If not, they gotta be related (my grandma is 1 of 12 kids). :)

I am rather dark and I kept hearing the stay out of the sun. I love the sun and the ocean...not gonna happen

WTH is "good hair"?. If it is on your head and you like it, it is GOOD HAIR


AMEN! This is the EXACT response that I use when people talk about "good hair". I even had to clown some family members recently for saying that my son has good hair. I told them that ALL of our hair is good because we have the fortune of HAVING it. When people make such foolish comments, I think about a friends of mine who doesn't have hair because alopecia - she would be happy with ANY type of hair.

[skywalker20_99]

Ugly is a genetic trait. Flav and some random white girl will not equal pretty babies; just light skinned crickets.


Oh my goodness. I just choked on my gum!

[southernelle25]

The first couple of days of school I was in the financial aid office and there was a young white girl with a mixed looking baby with her calling her mommy. the majority of the black guys that were in there started talking saying


" see that is why i want me a white girl so i can have some pretty children"

all of the other guys in the room followed saying

"yeah, man i know what you are talking about, that is a beutiful lil' girl"

Why do people think they have to get pregnant or have a baby by a white person in order to be considered beautiful. Why are they so afraid their children will be dark skinned? I think this is just ignorance and someone needs to raise thier children correctly without superficial thoughts like that. :mad:


Sure, they say that, but then they become upset when the children are born pure white in appearance or simply non-black, which is certainly possible given the already mixed heritage of most African Americans. I have read too many stories about black men abusing, emotionally and sometimes physically, their children (born of white women) for being "too light". I have seen posts online from men complaining because they thought their children would be born "with some color", i.e. "kinda light" with "good hair". These men don't consider that their children may not look anything like what they expect racially, that they may find it difficult to relate to sons who more closely resemble Wentworth Miller or "the man" than themselves. Though I feel for the children, I can't help but laugh at those who roll the dice and lose.

[Munchkin03]

These men don't consider that their children may not look anything like what they expect racially, that they may find it difficult to relate to sons who more closely resemble Wentworth Miller or "the man" than themselves.

Totally off-topic, but I feel that this is a good time as any to remind our readers at home how fine Wentworth Miller is. :)

[darling1]

That is a fine man..lol. I went to school with him and he was adorable then and very sweet.:)

[lovehaiku84]

These men don't consider that their children may not look anything like what they expect racially, that they may find it difficult to relate to sons who more closely resemble Wentworth Miller or "the man" than themselves. Though I feel for the children, I can't help but laugh at those who roll the dice and lose.

Exactly. And on the other hand a lot of mixed kids come out looking full black with nappy hair. Bet they don't count on THAT happening. At any rate though, since black people are so mixed up in the first place it really is just a toss up when it comes to how your kids will look.

[Little32]

That is a fine man..lol. I went to school with him and he was adorable then and very sweet.:)

I would just like to co-sign on Wentworth Miller's fineness.

[aopirose]

I would just like to co-sign on Wentworth Miller's fineness.

Yes indeed. :D