Greek acceptance in the church!

[pinkice9]

Too many individuals in the church believe that sororities and fraternities are not needed and would do away with them if they could.

Our founders saw a better principle for our organizations and all greeks should respond as such.

pinkice9

[mgdzkm433]

I think a lot of churches take advantage of the greek letter organizations on their nearby campuses. From what I've witnessed, a lot of churches love to have greeks involved because they can be active role models for the young children and youth. They can show leadership skills and also help plan and run church activities. They can also help with fundraisers and get people on campus involved in church activities, just by wearing letters or wearing a church t-shirt. Lots of greek letter organizations have people with different religious backgrounds, so it's not the actual whole sorority or fraternity that gets involved, but even one or two members can make all the difference.

[pinkice9]

Originally posted by mgdzkm433:
I think a lot of churches take advantage of the greek letter organizations on their nearby campuses. From what I've witnessed, a lot of churches love to have greeks involved because they can be active role models for the young children and youth. They can show leadership skills and also help plan and run church activities. They can also help with fundraisers and get people on campus involved in church activities, just by wearing letters or wearing a church t-shirt. Lots of greek letter organizations have people with different religious backgrounds, so it's not the actual whole sorority or fraternity that gets involved, but even one or two members can make all the difference.

I totally agree with you, I just wish everyone felt the same way. Not all Greeks are Christian and not all Christians understand the importance or initial importance of a greek lettered organization.

pinkice9

[12dn94dst]

that's very true. I've met a few "Christians" who have told me in no uncertain terms that I am going to hell because I'm in a Sorority. I've also heard of Sorors who have denounced us for that very reason. This puzzles me because we were founded on Christian principles and there's a definite spiritual presence in our ceremonies.

------------------
Kelli
12-DN-94
SSU c/o 1997

[pinkice9]

Originally posted by 12dn94dst:
that's very true. I've met a few "Christians" who have told me in no uncertain terms that I am going to hell because I'm in a Sorority. I've also heard of Sorors who have denounced us for that very reason. This puzzles me because we were founded on Christian principles and there's a definite spiritual presence in our ceremonies.


I agree soror and if those sorors that denounced knew their history they would know that God is present in all things including AKA. God uses us in various organizations. I think the reason why the church tells us that we will go to hell is because of the mistreatings that occur during the "process" some people wonder what religion has to do with pledging. Christ would not perform the acts of hitting His children with wood so why should we? To be a Christian is to be like Christ and if you can not accomplish that task than you will be going to hell.


Just a little gospel note

Pinkice9

[matthewg]

Hi pinkice9!

"To be a Christian is to be like Christ and if you can not accomplish that task than you will be going to hell."

You are not serious on this, are you? Otherwise, I am really wondering what kind of a picture you have of Jesus. I mean, we are humans and that's why we have to fail in trying to be like Jesus - What is asked of us as Christians is to try to be as "Jesus-like " as possible, but failing doesn't mean necessarily that we drive right into hell....
Not even the Pope in Rome would write something like that.

Best greetings, matthewg

member of a catholic German fraternity www.kdstv-bodensee.de (http://www.kdstv-bodensee.de)

[pinkice9]

Originally posted by matthewg:
Hi pinkice9!

"To be a Christian is to be like Christ and if you can not accomplish that task than you will be going to hell."

You are not serious on this, are you? Otherwise, I am really wondering what kind of a picture you have of Jesus. I mean, we are humans and that's why we have to fail in trying to be like Jesus - What is asked of us as Christians is to try to be as "Jesus-like " as possible, but failing doesn't mean necessarily that we drive right into hell....
Not even the Pope in Rome would write something like that.

Best greetings, matthewg
This was a quote I was using to synically giving a picture of the mind frames of Christians in the church. This is the belief of a lot of people that if you cannot complete the task of becoming as Christlike as possible, you will not be accepted into the gates of heaven. This is one truism my friend in the majority of churches. Now it is up to us to decide whether our teachings of Christ comes totally from the church or partically from the church and fully from GOD. He speak louder than any preacher and can deliever like no other.

Amen

Pinkice9
member of a catholic German fraternity www.kdstv-bodensee.de (http://www.kdstv-bodensee.de)

[matthewg]

Hi Pinkice9,

I am glad to hear that you meant everything cynically.
However, I think we have to keep the different churches in Christanity somewhat seperated even though they all refer to the Bible and the New Testament. Unfortunately there seems to be a tendency towards the development of new radical movements within certain churches and these are really scary. Fortunately, this development seems to be concentrated to North America but all those who take christan beliefs seriously should watch out that these charismatic and creationist movements don't take overhand.
Christianity, to my mind, is a religion that leaves a lot of space for interpretation - as opposed to sectist movements who have very strict frameworks. This open space leaves much space for the different directions that we currently find among the churches. It should first and foremost teach us tolerance towards other opinions. Afterall, we are all humans and thus might not be right with our believes..... who knows?

Best,
matthewg

[UNFSigmaChi]

Well i think the main problem of church memebers accepting you are greek is lack of knowledge of the greek world. When i went off to the University of North Florida 3 years ago, i pledged The Sigma Chi Fraternity. When i came home over Christmas break a lot of people were like woah frat boy!! But after talking to them about all the philanthropy Sigma Chi does for the Childrens Miricale Network, 6 of our 7 founders were ordained ministers, our symbol is the White Cross, our public motto is In Hoc Signo Vinces...in this sign you will conques, and that our history has an amazingly large christian history they seemed to understand that Greek life isn't about who can sleep with the most women, drink the other under the table and all the other animal house antics. That and the fact that when everyone saw my minister is a sigma chi from the Univ of Illinois everyone was cool with it. Educating people in the church and elsewhere about what true greek life is about and that you don't buy your friends....it is true brotherhood is the only way people will understand and respect you are greek.
Kinny P.
Sigma Chi Fraternity
Kappa Beta Chapter

------------------
In Hoc Signo Vinces

[pinkice9]

I agree with what both of you are saying and I am aware of the Christian and or religious background routed in the BGLO's and I can not speak for everyone but being greek has brought me closer to God.

I have had several testimonies since becoming greek and with out my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ I would not have had a positive outlook about certain situations.

Pinkice9

[PandaBear]

We have a ceremony that we do to initiate our mothers (after they meet certain criteria like community support, etc.), but my mom won't do it because she says that her church is against secret societies. It doesn't bother her that I'm in one, but she says her church wouldn't approve. She says the church (the whole denomination - not just her church) does this to prevent people from joining org's like the KKK. But the Shriners are a secret society (I think) and they do all kinds of good things for humanity. It confuses me. Has anyone else heard or read about secret societies in church or the Bible? Thanks!

[pinkice9]

I have not heard of secret societies but I do know that greeks are seen as bad in the church when we were founded on Christian principals.

Greeks have made a bad name for us everywhere because of this hazing thing. My grandfather is a shriner and he is in his church choir. I don't know if it is your mother's religion or what but this is not uncommon.

Pinkice9

[LXAAlum]

Rather hypocritical don't you think? Historically, during some of the Roman Empire's greatest points of persecution against Christians, they became secret societies, in effect, to protect themselves - even so far as to use the fish as a symbol rather than the cross, met in private, secret locations, etc.... ?

I've never had a problem with my GLO membership and my church affiliation. In fact, we recently used the church building to hold our initiation ritual. I've explained to my pastor that our Ritual is based primarily on Christian teachings, and that my intitiation started me on the path to Christianity. I even serve my church as a deacon.

The hardest thing to overcome with GLO membership and church are the stereotypes we are all too familiar with. We can point fingers, blame the media, etc. The best way to overcome these stereotypes, if you attend church, is to have people get to know YOU - if they know YOU, they will know what the majority of your chapter's membership is like.

I'm not saying going to church is a requirement of GLO membership - please don't get me wrong. But, if you do go, you'll be able to show the positives that many people often don't see about us.

[virtuosity]

I think this is a great topic to discuss. The college students involved in these organizations need to realize what they are really in. Knealing down before people, dressed in all black with candles lighting the room is kind of freaky- would you think so?
----------------
If we read the Bible, we can see that the very first commandment says "Do not worship any god before me." The 10 Commandments also contain the statement that we should not make an idol for ourselves to worship. Therefore, any type of organization which involves idols (such as Minerva or Demeter), is evil. Greek organizations that have a goddess or god as their patron, are bad because this type of thing promote the worshipping of FALSE GODS.

A true Christian would not continue to participate in a club or organization that has a false god as its symbol/patron/mentor.


If these organizations' rituals were brought out into the open, observed and researched, then it would help us put an end to their evilness.


You know that ancient temple... the one where the Eleusinian Mysteries (Demeter's Cult) were held (at Eleusis)? It was destroyed by the Christians. Any true Christian would know, deep inside their heart that an organization that involves strange rituals and false gods is evil.

God is a loving god and if we turn away from these evil organizations and denounce them, he will help free us from their binds.

God is a Judge, and he judges these organizations, and those who are involved with them. Isaiah 33:22

As Christians, we need to team up together and fight against wrong doings- I believe that many of these GLOs are founded on evil principles.

I hope that Chi Omega is the only Greek organization that does this kind of thing. Am I wrong?

[L3647]

Wow- this is an interesting topic. Are any of these organizations actually anywhere near Christian?

[ahhkbah]

I was recently told I am going to hell several times over. First I am going to hell because I am greek, second I am going to hell because I've got a brand and several tattoos. I refuse to believe that my God will condemn me because of the way I've marked my body. The God I pray to told me to come as I am, flaws and all for he will accept me...AS I AM.

[tcsparky]

My mom would't let me join a sorority because "those social clubs" and "secret societies" weren't Christian. I wish she had known more about them. By the time my sister, who is 9 years younger, was in school, I had educated my mom, and my sister pledged. Sometimes all it takes is letting the person know what is really going on.

[Q-T Pie]

ahhkbah
We are saved..I've found the infamous quote.

virtuosity
Isaiah 33:22 actually says:

"Indeed the Lord will be there with us, majestic;

yes, the Lord our judge, the Lord our lawgiver,

the Lord our king, he is who will SAVE us."

This means that he will judge EVERYONE, even you, & that he is here to SAVE, even you, not send to us all hell!

[dc1]

[A true Christian would not continue to participate in a club or organization that has a false god as its symbol/patron/mentor.

If these organizations' rituals were brought out into the open, observed and researched, then it would help us put an end to their evilness.]

Virtuosity (Fred Hatchett),
Take care when "preaching" to those that do not follow your personal version of the scripture (or religion in my case).. I take offense at having Bible verses thrown in my face, especially when they are random pickings intended only to prove a point.

I could continue on a biblical debate with you, but 1) don't feel that this is the correct forum and 2) don't feel like wasting my time with you on this subject.

A quick note on false prophets (i.e. those that twist the "word" for their own good)

Jeremiah 14:14-15
Then the LORD said unto me, The prophets prophesy lies in my name: I sent them not, neither have I commanded them, neither spake unto them: they prophesy unto you a false vision and divination, and a thing of nought, and the deceit of their heart.
Therefore thus saith the LORD concerning the prophets that prophesy in my name, and I sent them not, yet they say, Sword and famine shall not be in this land; By sword and famine shall those prophets be consumed.

*Note: I apologize for putting this on this board, however "virtuosity" has regretibly neglected to put his email address on his profile.

**Further Note: I mean no offense to those that may be offended. I am merely trying to make a point that anyone can pick and choose random "phrases" from the bible to prove their point.

------------------
Faced with the Divine, I was asked; "What one gift do you seek?"
I answered ever so meekly; "I seek Honor, Truth, Integrity, and Wisdom, yet those are four. How am I to choose?"
The answer came as a pounding whisper; "The four you seek are but one. I grant thee Compassion; for without it the four make none."
Author - me

[mgdzkm433]

Just another note about worshiping other gods. The verse says "Do not worship any god before me." It doesn't say that there are no other gods, it just says don't put them before GOD. So, with that said, it's almost as if the Bible is admiting there are other gods. hmmmmm. And it doesn't say you can't worship them, if just says don't put them first. hmmmmm. So wouldn't that mean that any other god wouldn't be false? And, if we use a god/goddess as our 'patron' in our greek organizations, we are just using that patron for one thing, yet we still attend church and proclaim Jesus as our saviour, we are putting him first. So our using the patron isn't coming first, our church is, God is because we proclaim him our saviour. Just something to think about.

Oh, and one more point. Christians recognize the stories of greek gods/goddesses as myths, as never actually being real. So that's not worshiping. We only worship what we believe. If we don't believe that these gods/goddesses are real, then we never worship them. Christians worship God because they actually BELIEVE in him/her. So really, the whole thing is a pointless topic.

[This message has been edited by mgdzkm433 (edited October 10, 2000).]

[pinkice9]

I can't speak for all greeks but, AKA was founded on Christian principals and we do not worship any gods. We are considered greek because of our letters of our organizations. The thought that greeks worship any greek gods is false. Again I can only speak for AKA and for this much I can say is true. If we are greek it does not mean that we don't chose Jesus as our Lord and Savior. I know I do.

Pinkice 9
Originally posted by virtuosity:
I think this is a great topic to discuss. The college students involved in these organizations need to realize what they are really in. Knealing down before people, dressed in all black with candles lighting the room is kind of freaky- would you think so?
----------------
If we read the Bible, we can see that the very first commandment says "Do not worship any god before me." The 10 Commandments also contain the statement that we should not make an idol for ourselves to worship. Therefore, any type of organization which involves idols (such as Minerva or Demeter), is evil. Greek organizations that have a goddess or god as their patron, are bad because this type of thing promote the worshipping of FALSE GODS.

A true Christian would not continue to participate in a club or organization that has a false god as its symbol/patron/mentor.


If these organizations' rituals were brought out into the open, observed and researched, then it would help us put an end to their evilness.


You know that ancient temple... the one where the Eleusinian Mysteries (Demeter's Cult) were held (at Eleusis)? It was destroyed by the Christians. Any true Christian would know, deep inside their heart that an organization that involves strange rituals and false gods is evil.

God is a loving god and if we turn away from these evil organizations and denounce them, he will help free us from their binds.

God is a Judge, and he judges these organizations, and those who are involved with them. Isaiah 33:22

As Christians, we need to team up together and fight against wrong doings- I believe that many of these GLOs are founded on evil principles.

I hope that Chi Omega is the only Greek organization that does this kind of thing. Am I wrong?

[Q-T Pie]

I am sorry if my posting a biblical quote offended anyone. I truly did not mean it to. I think the fact that going to a school, for half of my life, where everyone has the same beliefs, often aids me in forgetting that I'm not there anymore. I simply wanted to post the REAL quote & show how it did not mean what it was said to have meant. Again..hope no one was offended.

Allison

[mgdzkm433]

It's amazing how the definition varies as to what a 'true christian' is between people. Ya know folks, go with what YOU think is right, and to heck with everyone else. Follow what YOU believe. People have done it for years (hense various denominations/religions). People use their definition of a 'TRUE christian' as a defense, AND an attack. Don't let people scare you or intimidate you with THEIR definition. You all have enough sense to decifer what you believe on your own. Who is anyone to tell you what is right or wrong? The Bible says "Judge not, lest ye be judged". If people are trying to tell you that you aren't a Christian, then they are just condemning themselves according to the Bible. It says that those that judge others will suffer a worse fate than those they judged. Maybe a TRUE christian doesn't concern themselves with what others do?

[Texas Alum]

Dear virtuosity:
Did you see my earlier post in this board? It applies here too. Do you think that no-one notices that you are going through the archives and digging up OLD DEAD threads just so you can apply your own personal propaganda?

Please do not insult our intelligence. I am not passing judgment on you or your situation or the allegations of the incident, but I DO resent being patronized, which is what you are currently doing to all the members of this board. If you have a philosophy to share, then come right out and be open and honest -- don't be sneaky and sideways and manipulative.

[Q-T Pie]

Texas Alum
I think you are exactly right. Correct me if I'm wrong, but most of the members on this board are pretty honest when they post their opinions. True we don't always agree, but we rarely ever (IF ever) have turned the board into a battlefield since I've been here. I feel like that's what we have been doing the past few days is fighting some kind of war. If everyone was just honest & accepted that people may see things differently (yes, including myself), we would once again be a peaceful group of people.

Hopefully, it won't be much longer.

Love to ALL!

Allison


------------------
A mistake at least proves that somebody stopped talking long enough to do something.
~ Anonymous

[ZetaAce]

Originally posted by Q-T Pie:
Texas Alum
True we don't always agree, but we rarely ever (IF ever) have turned the board into a battlefield since I've been here.

Q-T Pie, You obviously haven't been here very long!! LOL! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

There are two interchangeable wars on this board, Race and Religion!! But don't take my word for it, go back to some of the old threads and look!

ZetaAce

[carol c]

I just want to say that to be able to talk to you people on an kind of level that gets responses that aren't vile, you can't say HEY I"M THE GIRL THEY HAD RAPED AND DROPPED IN A COFFIN---LIKE OVER HERE- ABUSE ME SOME MORE FOR TELLING THE TRUTH AND MAKING ALL GREEK LETTERED ORGANIZATIONS LOOK BAD, EVEN THOUGH CHI OMEGA IS THE ONE I'M TALKING ABOUT! Sneeky? Why don't you ask the ones who are members of the defunct chapter and under criminal investigation to identify themselves, before they post? Fair is fair, isn't it? Or does it only work one way. There are people at the highest levels of government and school administration that very much want to converse with her, but you don't want her "sneaking up on you" and entertaining an intelligent conversation.

[Q-T Pie]

LOL ZetaAce
Thanks for correcting me because You ARE right. How could I forget? I usually try not to get involved in the race discussions, but everyone knows I'm there to talk about religion. Guess I forgot about the Fred thing! I can't even remember how many times I posted to him.

Geez...Thanks for making me laugh at myself for forgetting!! http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Allison

[kmullini]

I couldnt agree with you more. Thats why I dont go to church.

Originally posted by mgdzkm433:
It's amazing how the definition varies as to what a 'true christian' is between people. Ya know folks, go with what YOU think is right, and to heck with everyone else. Follow what YOU believe. People have done it for years (hense various denominations/religions). People use their definition of a 'TRUE christian' as a defense, AND an attack. Don't let people scare you or intimidate you with THEIR definition. You all have enough sense to decifer what you believe on your own. Who is anyone to tell you what is right or wrong? The Bible says "Judge not, lest ye be judged". If people are trying to tell you that you aren't a Christian, then they are just condemning themselves according to the Bible. It says that those that judge others will suffer a worse fate than those they judged. Maybe a TRUE christian doesn't concern themselves with what others do?

[carol c]

I'll be glad to post that way, but I will not disclose to you and of the details of this investigation to you, because I have been asked not to do it, by the D.A.'s office and our personal attorney. So, that's the only thing you won't get out of me and any personal information that puts me or my family at any further risk. I do want to tell you that Sigma Theta's and their boy friends, three car loads of them (recognized, thank you) vandalized our home on Saturday night, and any further indentification of us on this board will be taken as an attempt to cause an even more dangerous situation. If what you want to know from me is of importance to improving the situation, we will post, otherwise--no. Those are my perameters for continuing anything on a separate post.

[ahhkbah]

Q-T Pie, I didn't mean someone on this board said I was going to Hell. I apologize if that is what my comment implied. I was told that by a very religious relative of mine.

[Q-T Pie]

Ahhkbah
OOps...Sorry about that. I misunderstood you. Thanks for the correction http://www.greekchat.com/forums/ubb/smile.gif

Allison

[LB1914]

It's interesting that people are still trying to debate whether one can be a Greek and a Christian. In the African-American community, a good number of pastors are members of NPHC fraternities and sororities.

[LexiKD]

I agree with you, LB1914.

I feel this is an odd subject, why would anyone think being Greek would be a one way ticket to hell? P.S. Who gives any one person the authority on who is and isn't a Christian and/or where we are all going eventually?

Maybe I missed something, but who knows, some peolpe have to make bad experiences into tall tales and lable every group that ever was.

[Rosealum]

Except for today's posts, the last ones were a year ago. Some things change; some things don't.

[Christi130]

This whole christianity/Greek discussion is very interesting to me. My father's a pastor and when I pledged he was so against it. He still doesn't like the fact that I'm in the sorority because of the reputation that Greeks have, especially on my campus. I don't think it should even be argued whether or not you can be Greek and still be a Christian. Of course you can. I am in a sorority and am also a born-again Christian. I wore letters to church this morning and I know people think it's weird that I'm in a sorority and also go to church every week. Everyone seems to think it's weird. I'm known as the "Preacher's Daughter" by all the frats in my town :) You can't judge someone by what they wear or by what organizations they are in. Romans 14:1-4 says " Accept him whose faith is wak; without passing judgement on disputable matters. One man's faith allows him to eat everything, but another man, whose faith is weak, eats only vegetables. The man who eats everything must not look down on him who does not, and the man who does not eat everything must not condemn the man who does, for God has accepted him. Who are you to judge someone else's servant? To his own master he stands of falls. And he will stand, for the Lord is able to make him stand." Sorry I just wrote a book.... I just read that and thought it applied to what everyone's talking about.

[BrownEyedGirl]

Maybe it has something to do with the Southern Greek system, but a lot of adults I know in my church are not only very accepting of collegiate Greeks, they are Greek alumni themselves! In fact, two of my pastor's daughters are ADPi's, and a TON of people in my college Sunday School class (at home, this is) are in my sorority! In my church here at school, the congregation is very accepting of any student who comes, whether they are Greek or not. They want to encourage EVERYONE to strengthen their faith.

[moe.ron]

Originally posted by ahhkbah
I was recently told I am going to hell several times over. First I am going to hell because I am greek, second I am going to hell because I've got a brand and several tattoos. I refuse to believe that my God will condemn me because of the way I've marked my body. The God I pray to told me to come as I am, flaws and all for he will accept me...AS I AM.

Do what my friend did, there was this dude who came up to him and told him he was going to go to hell because he was in a fraternity and something about the bible. Then the dude gave him a bible. Seeing that my friend was a Darwinist, he smilled at the dude and said, I remmember the exact word, "Thank you, I do enjoy work of fiction when I get bored."

[archangel689]

What, lol?

The Bishop of Pittsburgh is a Phi Kap... Pope John Paul II, our current Pope, he is a Phi Kap.

We've been joking that God himself is a Phi Kap!!

Whats that about the Church & greeks again?

[AggieDZ]

OH, I'd really like to know your story on the Pope being a Phi Kapp. In an old Irish family full of priests and nuns, strangely, I've never heard this one.....

[archangel689]

It's in our pledge manual.
It's also on our national website: www.phikaps.org

[mmcat]

in checking the web, one can also find a number of christian sororities and fraternities.
mmcat
:p

[lifesaver]

IMHO, the only reason some religions/denominations would have a problem with GLO's is because they (religions) like to be first in the mind control line and cant stand the THOUGHT of someone else helping to shape a persons life. But religion has always been about freedom of choice - whatever. :rolleyes:

[Tom Earp]

Ah LIFE, once again you stroll into a thread and lay down a carpet of infinite jewels and cut to the crux of the situation!:D
All i know is my Priest was a SN and said no drinking or the wedding is off!:eek:

little did I know that in his heart, he was telling me to not get married as I am Anglican and she was Roman:)

Did anyway but have happily divorced for awhile!:D :D :D

[BrownEyedGirl]

ROTFLMBO! Tom, you've got a GREAT sense of humor! ;)

[Optimist Prime]

Sorry, but i can't read all these posts at once. I didn't see UNFSigmaChi's name on this thread. Get him to tell you his expericce. I am not Christian, but that is still a good story.

[Tom Earp]

Hell, where is it? I heard that heaven is up and hell is down. Well, heaven is up all around us so I have been told that hell is on earth!:o It seems the way things are going in our world that may be even more true!:(

I wonder, how the pope can be in a Fraternity if he is Polish from Poland:confused: I did not know he went to school in the USA!

[paws]

I think it is important to remember YOUR faith before criticizing others. Being in my NPC sorority has in fact STRENGTHENED my relationship with God. I am a stronger person, and I believe in myself and the ideals set forth by my founders. I would never be a part of something in which I was made to compromise my faith, or to worship false gods. For those of you who are so concerned with Greeks going to hell and the judgement of God is going to come down upon us, take a look inside yourself. What is it that you are trying to prove to all of us? If I did pay for my sisters, then I haven't paid nearly enough.

[Optimist Prime]

Originally posted by paws
I think it is important to remember YOUR faith before criticizing others. Being in my NPC sorority has in fact STRENGTHENED my relationship with God. I am a stronger person, and I believe in myself and the ideals set forth by my founders. I would never be a part of something in which I was made to compromise my faith, or to worship false gods. For those of you who are so concerned with Greeks going to hell and the judgement of God is going to come down upon us, take a look inside yourself. What is it that you are trying to prove to all of us? If I did pay for my sisters, then I haven't paid nearly enough.

Well said, Paws. But I have a question. You said you shouldn't critize other faiths, but then you called other gods (i.e. not your own) false. That is a bit confusing.

[matthewg]

I don't know where you got that from, but here a few comments to that. The actual pope isn't in a fraternity to all of my knowledge, but I think Pius the 6th was.

He and a lot of past and current priests, bishops and even cardinals of the roman catholic church are members of my catholic German fraternity. We are non-secretive, at least not to the extent of most American GLO's.

And one other thing. You don't have to live in North America to become involved in a fraternity. Fraternities have a long standing tradition in Europe with roots in the 13th century. There are non-GLO fraternities in the following countries that I know of: Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Germany, The Netherlands, Belgium, Austria, Switzerland, The Chzec and the Slovak Republics, the German speaking part of Italy and some student societies in the UK. In addition, my fraternity has a chapter in Tokyo, Japan, and another German fraternity has multiple chapters in Chile (but that is sort of imported and not exactly an indigenous product even if some are over 100 years old:)).

[archangel689]

>I wonder, how the pope can be in a Fraternity if he is Polish >from Poland:confused: I did not know he went to school in the >USA!

PKT is an international fraternity.

>I don't know where you got that from, but here a few comments >to that. The actual pope isn't in a fraternity to all of my >knowledge, but I think Pius the 6th was.
Yes, the current pope is a member of a fraternity.
-Tony

[matthewg]

Originally posted by archangel689
[B
PKT is an international fraternity.

>I don't know where you got that from, but here a few comments >to that. The actual pope isn't in a fraternity to all of my >knowledge, but I think Pius the 6th was.
Yes, the current pope is a member of a fraternity.
-Tony [/B]

May I ask how he became a member?? Is he an honorary member?
Matt

[archangel689]

May I ask how he became a member??
If you really want to know I can ask, the director of expansion is on campus.

Is he an honorary member?
Yes.
-Tony

[matthewg]

Yes, I would love to know,
I have to correct myself about the pope in my fraternity - it was Pius the VII (7th) and he was also an honorary member - and John the XXIII (23rd) was member of a different German fraternity.

[tkeos443]

My fraternity was founded at a Weslyan school and by the religion of my founders we have grown with god's grace to become one of the largest fraternities in the world and just because Candles are used doesnt mean anything when you lite a candle in your house are you doing something wrong sometimes dont you think that stuff could mean something and no one is more important then god. If you take it toi far then there's a problem but it is just a ceremony

[D-Train]

Pink Ice, I know i'm about to step on toes but, that same crew would abolish greek organizations, would probablby do the same for Masonic orders or any other group that they could not obtain information about without joining. Like it was memtioned earlier in a post, if a lot of our pastors and civic leaders{who are in most cases, ministers} are part of a GLO, then why should someone be so quick to judge the unknown.

[Salience]

Coming from a sizeable Masonic family, I have heard horrible tales about ministers refusing to let Masons and Stars hold programs in their churches. I may have mentioned this on another thread, but when my uncle died, the minister refused to allow the Masons to perform their ceremony in the church, which is just ludicrous to me.

People on the outside can always reach snap decisions about things they know next-to-nothing about, and those "documentaries" on Discovery or History or MTV channels only fuel the flames of ire.

[Kevin]

There was actually a big movement back in the early 1800's where fraternities and secret societies were harshly criticized for being evil and such. There were a few major "open" fraternal organizations founded around that time such as Delta Upsilon in 1834. For the most part though, these organizations were very short-lived.

Many GLO's are founded on Christian principles in fact. Sigma Nu's founders for example took an oath the night they began our predecessor organization "The Legion of Honor" on a BIBLE. The Bible is still prominently used in our fraternity to this day.

Many GLO's stress an importance in spiritual growth. I would say that it is not idols that we prop up, it is IDEALS.

It is natural to fear what you do not understand. It is understood that someone might.

There was a post earlier in the thread by Virtuosity. I would challenge her/him to please NAME the organization that worships a god or goddess instead of saying "Greek organizations that have a goddess or god as their patron, are bad because this type of thing promote the worshipping of FALSE GODS".

Baseless allegations are not becoming and not honorable in the least. It may work when you're talking to the general unenlightened public, but not here.


LHT,
Kevin

[Optimist Prime]

I know lots of Christians that use Jesus or Mary as a patron. And I know they use the patron saints as such. As long as you are a good person, it should matter what you believe. Do I use patrons? My fraternity doesn't, but for myself, yes. I have lots of them. Gods/Goddesses, King Arthur, Charelemange, That druid guy whose name I can't think of. Basically, anyone from mythology or folklore or religion that is an examplar of the ideals i strive for (and the ideals my fraternity strives for) as patrons. My fraternity doesn't use them because that is like pushing beliefs on a member, and we are open to all faiths, creeds, etc.

[Tom Earp]

Billy, you are not into trees or things like that are you?

I never frown on anothers relegion unless they try to foist it onto me when I have one! When I was youger, I went to many Churches and Synagogs to learn. It may benefit others to do the same. Learning is still the Key Of Life!

If you do not learn something new everyday then you are lost!

The Majority of the Greek Fraternal Organizations are founded on Christian Principles along with I know are the Mason's and Moose! That these are the only ones that I can personally speak of, the only one I keep up with to this day is LXA!

:)

[Optimist Prime]

trees? Yeah. I guess so. I need them to breathe. I don't worship them though.

edited because I just figured out what Tom was getting at.

Yes, Tom. I believe that the "power of nature" and the "power of god" are inhereintly the same thing. I also think that anyway you can commune or feel at one with that power then its religion. The stories, parables, psalms, myths, etc. are the outer trapings. The essential of faith is whats beneath that.

[Tom Earp]

Whew, thnk you Billy for clearing that up for me!;)

Man trees can give splinters!

I know some people who are Druids and they are Great People, well Brandon is a little strange, but that is Brandon!:D

I saw Stonehenge when I was In England and is much smaller than pictures. Near By was also another stone grouping but Stoney got the recognition so is on TV!

Ever wonder why there are Pryamids in so many places? The Sphinx did not come fro the same time period, Easter Island and other places had Huge Stone Heads!

Did Jesus Rise as was stated in teh Bible, which by the way was written many years after the fact?

I was in a religious compound in Tenn. and had a mock up of the tomb, hell had square door cover! Dont do much rolling with that!

There is to much that we do not know and maybe never will, but folk lore is passed down and much of it is true!

Well that got entirely off of the subject post!:rolleyes:

[Kapsig1]

Originally posted by Tom Earp

Did Jesus Rise as was stated in teh Bible, which by the way was written many years after the fact?
[/B]

Not NEARLY as many years after most ancient history that you and I accept as FACT! Besides, people were specifically trained and conditioned to retain history back then. The evidence is overwhelming that these "historians" we amazingly accurate.

Just a thought,
Brad

[adduncan]

Hi folks,
I know I'm a Jane-come-lately on this thread, just ran across it.

One of my personal activities is teaching Sunday School at my parish. (I'm Catholic and I teach the 8th grade, which is church history year.)

FYI, part of the reason some churches were against "secret societies" (not necessarily GLOs in particular tho) is that it was thought that the society would (a) distract the person(s) from their involvement with the church and/or (b) would promote and teach ideals that were directly in conflict w/ their faith, thus forcing the person to make a choice. The ones I'm particularly aware of that came up in this discussion were the KKK (obviously), the Know-Nothings, the FreeMasons, and the Odd Fellows.

The Catholic church in the USA came up with their own solution to this issue and some related ones: create a secret/private society of their own, the Knights of Columbus, which is basically a Catholic fraternity. My husband is both a 4th Degree KoC and a KA Order brother. According to him, there is no conflict between the vows he took in either one.

Just a little info. Hope it helps.
Adrienne :)

[Kevin]

As I recall, the Catholic Church has reversed its opinion on secret societies like the freemasons.

It used to mean excommunication.

[adduncan]

ktsnake--

I just looked it up in a number of resources (ie, NewAdvent.com and the Catholic Encyclopedia.)

According to those sources, the ban against Freemasonry membership for Catholics is still enforced and was clarified in 1983.

(Just as a clarification--I'm only posting information on the subject, and there is no intent to preach, evangelize, etc.)

Adrienne
:)

[poodleNtraining]

Well, my grandparents were greek, and they wee very Christian. Most orgs that I've been exposed to have been very God-centered. NOt to say that they all have to be, but for those who are Christian, being in a GLO does not mean that you're going to hell. It depends on your personal reasons for joining, what your org does and how you personally participate. I think that also, just the fact that the orgs use Greek letters makes people automatically think "pagan" because Greeks used to be pagans. But if you think about it, some of the first Christians were who, GREEKS. So the greek letters are not just "pagan" in nature.

The only thing really negative with reference to an org and Christianity has been with Freemasonry. I know that they aren't a GLO, but they're considered to be in the same category. I found this article about it, I'll post it for discussion sake. I'm not saying that this is my view or anything, but this is what I found.


Freemasonry
Freemasonry is one of the cultic groups that in these end times have been springing up. It spouts scriptures and sometimes has a veneer of truth, however it can be spotted. They have a defective view of Christ, His deity and His work. They specialize in extra Biblical revelations and have trans-local totalitarian leaders in authority. Commonly they rule the group by "revelations" and "prophecies." Usually there is some form of a pyramiding control of the followers. Freemasons have 33 degrees among their ranks.

Most develop semi-secret sessions for teaching the initiated followers. Exclusivism is taught and there is much violation of the rules of sound Bible interpretation by use of vague passages and semantic juggling to "prove" what the cult teaches.

Fear is the power which holds the group together. Insecurity and maneuvering for power, position and advantage is constant. The misery of being swallowed into such a group is incredible.

Cultic leaders range from openly operating con men to sincere zealots driven by demonic power to achieve their ends. Moral decay and laxness always sets in sooner or later, usually at the top echelons of leadership. Many times the followers are lashed into an ascetic and self sacrificing life style, while leaders secretly indulge their own whims and desires.

The disillusionment and disenchantment which eventually comes destroys many. People who have honestly given their all to a cause, only to discover they have been sold out, have great difficulty readjusting and being able to believe in anybody or anything.

Pagan societies sponsored public worship directed toward idols, while the priests, rulers and philosophers always maintained a different, secret worship centered around a sun god. This latter was designated as the "Mysteries." These "Mysteries" were revived by the "Masonic fathers" at the beginning of the eighteenth century.

In other words what formerly constituted the mysteries of Osiris, Baal, Bacchus or Dionysius is today the mysteries of Freemasonry. Dr. Mackey, Masonic authority, states they are the "same in substance, being derived from one source and celebrated in honor of the same deities."

A converted witch relates that the initiation into Masonry (with two minor changes at the end) is identical to that of witchcraft! By embracing such rituals and vows, rooted in ancient witchcraft and demonic worship, men and women are placing themselves under occult power. The secret signs, passwords, hand grips, etc. which are so highly prized, in reality brings lives under secret bonds and churches are paralyzed where these secret loyalties exist and the Holy Spirit cannot flow freely. Jesus said He had done all things openly and had done nothing in secret, a startling contrast to secret orders which enforce secrecy on their members. We are commanded to renounce the hidden things of darkness Roman 13:12.

Baal was the same as Phoenician Moloch, the Greek Tyrian Hercules (Freemasonry call him Tyrian Architect). He was worshipped on the high places and this is the reason for the "upper chamber" lodge meetings to "worship celestial bodies." According to accredited Masonic historians, the lodge claims to be a revival of the ancient philosophy of Egypt, Phonecia and other Pagan nations. These all practiced a secret worship in honor of a sun god (Lucifer).

Freemasonry is a wicked system of sworn deception, fraud and cunning craftiness from beginning to end. Promoters are always careful, at first, to keep the real meaning of the pretended mysteries in the background, at least until the initiate has taken the Master Masons obligation. By that time he should be so bound that he will not revolt against the bondage he has unsuspectingly moved into.

The Lodge teaches that its three support pillars are Wisdom, Strength and Beauty, and these are borrowed directly from Hindu Mysteries in the initiation of Brahma. The Worshipful Master represents rising sun (east); Senior Warden, setting sun, (west); Junior Warden, the sun at Meredian (south). In every symbol, ceremony and emblem of Freemasonry we are confronted with nothing but the sun god (Lucifer), that ancient Baal worship in every religion from the Druids to Hinduism.

Masons changed names in the Egyptian mysteries from Osiris to Hiram Abiff but retained a similar legend for the initiations. They burned their manuscripts in 1720, interspersed the names of Hiram and Solomon to secure acceptance by Jew and gentile and appropriated the Bible and Apostle John to give it a "Christian" veneer. "Freemasonry both in whole and in part, is literally and truly the secret worship of Baal, or the sun god."

In Deuteronomy 4: 19 God clearly states: When you look up to the sky and see the sun, the moon and the stars - all the heavenly array - do not be enticed into bowing down to them and worshipping things the LORD your God has apportioned to all the nations under heaven."

God in Deuteronomy 17:2-3 states: If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns that the LORD gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the LORD your God in violation of His covenant, and contrary to my command has worshipped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars of the sky.

[CUPrez]

Speaking of Christianity and Greek Life... There are quite a few Christian sororities and fraternities that were founded by Christians for Christians.

This doesn' t mean that there are not Christians in other organization, because there are! In fact, my own parents belong to other Greek organizations that do not necessarily have a Christian base, and they are very much Christian.

But, there is something to be said for organizations that hold this as their ideal and that unswervingly and unashamedly proclaim Christ and Him crucified. It bothers me when organizations say they have a Christian foundation, but you go to their websites and see ladies with their behinds hanging out. Why even fake it? :p

CUPrez, Nat'l Pres.
DELTA PSI EPSILON CHRISTIAN SORORITY, INC.
Established in 1992

[MTSUGURL]

It bothers me when organizations say they have a Christian foundation, but you go to their websites and see ladies with their behinds hanging out. Why even fake it?



I agree. One of the fraternities here, which I won't name, has a tradition that when a guy lavaliers his gf they tie the brother naked to a tree and leave him there after they pour stuff all over him, then call his gf to come pick him up. They did this right outside the window of my old apt.:eek: Quite an eyeful on one occasion. They were founded on Christian principles. This to me says they're not living up to the ideals that their founders set up. If your org has a christian foundation, this should be clear by your conduct. Maybe that's just me...

Crystal

[Kevin]

Originally posted by CUPrez
Speaking of Christianity and Greek Life... There are quite a few Christian sororities and fraternities that were founded by Christians for Christians.

This doesn' t mean that there are not Christians in other organization, because there are! In fact, my own parents belong to other Greek organizations that do not necessarily have a Christian base, and they are very much Christian.

But, there is something to be said for organizations that hold this as their ideal and that unswervingly and unashamedly proclaim Christ and Him crucified. It bothers me when organizations say they have a Christian foundation, but you go to their websites and see ladies with their behinds hanging out. Why even fake it? :p


Why must your organization practice a certain religion to be acceptable? It is what's in YOUR heart that counts. My fraternity was founded when 3 men gathered around a Bible and took an oath to stop the physical and mental abuse present at VMI in 1869. All 3 men were very strong Christians. Today, my fraternity remains in its essence an organization that is very in-line with the Bible's teachings. I don't think Jesus would have had any qualms with our 3 cardinal virtues, Love, Honor and Truth...

We however gladly accept brothers of ALL religions. It is not about religion.. I believe that's why we have church -- a place where religion is the common thread.. It's about brotherhood.

If you have to have religion in common to have a bond that's just fine. I see you're in an exclusively Christian organization and that's fine. It's just not for everyone... Neither is mainstream Greek Life though.

You have to go where your values take you.

I do have a problem with your comment where you seemed to be saying that NONE of us practice our ideals. I think that's a very incorrect and judgemental statement. You know as much about my fraternity and others (with the exception of those we've come in direct contact with) as I know about yours.

[CUPrez]

Woah,

I think you read into my comments something that was not there...

First of all, all fraternities and sororities have requirements and a membership profile. That's why we are exclusive organizations. Ours happens to be that our members be Christian. They can be apart of any denomination, but we are a sorority for Christian women.

Never did I say that no one was living up to their ideals. I merely stated that those that claim to be Christian and don't follow through are reprehinsible. I believe everyone should do their best to keep their word and uphold their ideals. I didn't say anything about your organization not upholding it's ideals. I don't know where you got that from.

As I stated, there are Christians in other organizations. But, that doesn't mean that they are in a Christian organization. There's nothing wrong with that. But, they shouldn't claim that their organization is Christian if it isn't. That doesn' t make anyone better or worse. I'm just saying that everyone should be real about what their organization really is...

CUPrez

[Kevin]

And how would you know what that organization really is if you weren't in it?

You wouldn't.

Without studying the reasons an organization was founded and the entire history (much of which many organizations keep secret I'd assume) you'd really have no clue as to the TRUE purpose. Most of our mottos are secret so the only people that truly understand an organization are its members.

Bottom line is that if an organization claims to be Christian in its founding beliefs and principles you'd best take their word for it. You have no right and no factual base to say otherwise.

We just don't exclude others based on religion.

But merely stating that it's reprehensible for individuals not to follow their organization's ideals.. well I'd say to some degree EVERYONE is guilty of that. So why pass judgement on others?

Let he (or she) who is without sin cast the first stone.

[kstar]

Two things:

One when you read the Phi Kappa Theta website, it says Pope John Paul the SECOND, who was from the USA, but he is not the current pope, that is John Paul the THIRD.

And Two, why do you care so much what the church thinks of you, are you that despret in seeking approval that you have be liked by all? And if it is a Christian thing (I don't know, because I'm Jewish) and if you really get judged by god after you die, won't he be forgiving, isn't that what you preach? Didn't he give you free will for a reason?

[CarolinaCutie]

This is an interesting topic... Religion is always one thing that people feel VERY strongly about.

As for me, I'm with PinkIce on a lot of points. My organization is founded on Christian principles, and that means a lot to me. I have not been through initiation yet (Friday :D), but I know that several of my sisters are religious, and they would not be a member of an organization that was not Christian-based. As I've said before on this board, the use of Bible verses in the Pref night ceremony and the double mention of God in the Creed were two factors that influenced my decision to go Phi Mu. Our chapter even has a weekly optional Bible study. Christianity and being Greek CAN go hand in hand.

My church is not adverse to the Greek community at all. Actually, my decision to rush was heavily influenced by a Delta Zeta from another school who goes to my church. I think some people believe the hype about binge drinking and immoral behavior... but I think Christians in GLOs are working to change those stereotypes.

I would be interested to hear from a member of Chi Omega on this subject. I know we've all seen the website :rolleyes: and truthfully, I WOULD have a problem with their ALLEGED ritual. I'm 100% sure there are many members of Chi Omega who consider themselves Christian... I would like to know how they feel about it. I'm not sure that will ever happen though... it's obviously taboo to talk about ritual on GC for everyone to see.

[33girl]

Originally posted by kstar
Two things:

One when you read the Phi Kappa Theta website, it says Pope John Paul the SECOND, who was from the USA, but he is not the current pope, that is John Paul the THIRD.



Actually, the current Pope is John Paul the Second...

John XXIII 1958-63
Paul VI 1963-78
John Paul I 1978 (he took the names of both previous Popes to honor them...he was only Pope for a couple months)
John Paul II 1978-present - he is from Poland.

Incidentally, there was also a Pope Dionysius. :D

[CUPrez]

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

Many organizations hold things secret, but not their history and why their were founded-- that is usually public knowledge. So if they say they are Christian and don't follow through (as an organization) that is a problem. Sure, you will always have a member or two that does not do the right thing, but that isn't what I'm talking about.

The Bible also says, "faith without works is dead." So to proclaim you're a Christian organization and act another way-- that's not right.

CUPrez

[adduncan]

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

Many organizations hold things secret, but not their history and why their were founded-- that is usually public knowledge. So if they say they are Christian and don't follow through (as an organization) that is a problem. Sure, you will always have a member or two that does not do the right thing, but that isn't what I'm talking about.

The Bible also says, "faith without works is dead." So to proclaim you're a Christian organization and act another way-- that's not right.

CU Prez, be really, REALLY careful.

The Bible also says, "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone."

Accusing others of behaving opposite to Christian virtues can potentially come back to bite you in the behind. You may not "intend" to make accusations, per se, but your words are treading a fine line.

Unless you and your group can claim to be absolutely perfect, never make mistakes, never have an episode of bad judgement, or otherwise engage in wrong doing, you are setting yourself up to be lambasted as hypocrites. **Everyone** makes mistakes at one point or another. **Everyone** makes a judgement call that they would not repeat given another chance. I'll bet members of your group do too, we just don't know about it. It's part of being human and why we need forgiveness.

I would also not condemn anyone for wanting to maintain their privacy. GLOs keep certain things private. Just like you do. If you want your group to be respected, the quickest way to achieve that is to GIVE respect and be patient with people you disagree with.

Jesus didn't condemn the woman busted for adultery. Why are you condeming other Greeks for simply not proclaiming their faith in the same manner that you do?

Just food for thought.

[Kevin]

The Bible also says that "by their fruits ye shall know them." If an organization is founded on Christian principles, and are doing totally un-Christian things and carrying on in ways that are not by the Bible that is how you can see that.

You want to compare Christian organizations $'s donated to charity/service hours to that of regular GLO's?

Go right ahead:D

[33girl]

Many "Christian principles" do not necessitate a belief in Christ to be followed. Christians don't have a corner on loving their neighbor as themselves, turning the other cheek, etc. My ex was (at the time) an atheist and treated others in a far more Christian manner than some of the "Christians" who were shouting all the time about how righteous they were.

I think there are very few mainstream fraternities these days that say they are Christian orgs, since that used to mean that non-Christians were not allowed in.

[MTSUGURL]

You want to compare Christian organizations $'s donated to charity/service hours to that of regular GLO's?

Go right ahead

One thing that has impressed me so much about the AOPi chapter on our campus is their annual babecue for arthritis. This year they raised $15000. Before then, I didn't know any AOPis and hadn't watched them very much to form an opinion, but this definitely gave me a great impression.

I belong to the Baptisit Collegiate Ministries on my campus, and every year we set a goal for our missions fund of $6000. This may not seem like a lot to groups that have 80-150 members, but we've only have about 30 people who were really active and about 15 that helped fundraise, so it was a big deal and something we were proud of when we raised $8-9000 the past few years. There are a lot of other things they do - a couple of years ago, when I wasn't even in school, I was having a hard time paying my bills and they paid my rent. They routinely donate to people's families if they need money for hospital bills, money after a family member dies, etc. My church has been showing the same kind of support to people in the community since it was started 15 years ago.

I personally have 80+service hours this semester - and found most of these opportunities through my church and BCM.

Just because a Chrisitan organization doesn't advertise everything they do in areas of charity or community service doesn't mean it's not there. Most of the good they do isn't advertised because they don't want to call attention to themselves, but to God instead. I'm not saying we're perfect, but I'm also not going to agree that GLOs (mine included) are better because they do so much to help their charities and do advertise it.

[BlACKROSE]

[QUOTE= To be a Christian is to be like Christ and if you can not accomplish that task than you will be going to hell.


Just a little gospel note

Pinkice9[/QUOTE]

THAT MEANS THAT SO MANY CHRISTIANS ARE GOING TO THIS SUPPOSSE HELL FOR CHRIST WAS A MAN OF ACCEPTANCE HE TOLD THE CLERGY MEN OF THAT TIME HE DID NOT COME TO HEAL THOSE WHO WERE WELL BUT TO BE AMOUNG THE SICK SO IF JESUS WAS NOT RUNNING AROUNG SPOUTING OUT HELL TO EVERY SINNER THAN THESE SO CALLED CHRISTAINS SHOULD NOT EITHER FOR JESUS GREATEST COMMANDANT WAS UNCONDITIONAL LOVE

[macallan25]

Next time try using commas, periods, spelling, and less caps lock.

[AlphaFrog]

Last edited by BlACKROSE : Today at 02:01 AM. Reason: for those who feel important enough to get a thought of there own i corrected my misspelling


Umm...what?

You make no sense...and you're continually dredging up 6 year old threads. That's annoying. Stop it.

[adpiucf]

I thought Jesus was a Sigma Chi? :( Wow, I'm just soooo confused.... I mean, everyone KNOWS that Moses was a TKE!

[macallan25]

Moses a TKE....you must be kidding.

[adpiucf]

Nothing of the sort! Mary Magdalene is a Theta Phi Alpha by the way, too. :rolleyes:

[Kevin]

I'm very close to locking this thread due to the fact that it is discussing nothing even close to its topic.

Also, I think Kappa Sigma is the only organization old enough to claim Moses.

[AlphaFrog]

I'm very close to locking this thread due to the fact that it is discussing nothing even close to its topic.


I don't think anyone would cry over that.

[tunatartare]

I thought Jesus was a Sigma Chi? :( Wow, I'm just soooo confused.... I mean, everyone KNOWS that Moses was a TKE!
Dude, you need to go back to Hebrew school. Everyone knows that Moses was an AEPi.

[adpiucf]

Well, I WAS going to say that, but I thought it would be too stereotypical.

Unless of course we're talking about my cousin, Moishe Stein. ;) And his friend Jesus Maria Rivera.

[tunatartare]

I know a Moshe who's in AEPi. Then again, who doesn't? At my friend's wedding, there were like 5 guys all wearing "AEPi Founding Father" shirts.

[adpiucf]

True that.

I'm reporting you for stereotypical comments. Bad Jew.

[tunatartare]

would my comments be less offensive if I offered you some free ham? ;)

[adpiucf]

And shrimp cocktail.

[MTSUGURL]

would my comments be less offensive if I offered you some free ham? ;)

This is my ultimate favorite post of the day.

[Kevin]

This thread has been locked due to being too far off topic to ever recover.